Mandatory security meeting request on behalf of client - advice please

[d000hg]

They're asking, not telling.

Don't go in - that which they can't see, they can't fail you on.

It's been described as mandatory though the language is a little ambiguous.

Why is it some contractors think they are above client security and H&S? Just think of it from the client perspective and try understand their obligations. What you should and shouldn't do will become a lot clearer.

I don't know what the client obligations are, they haven't told me. They don't seem to know what it is about except their customer informed them they have to do it.

I don't think I've above security, I just wanted to ask how it should be handled. Since I've been given no more information than I shared in this post, and my client seemed fairly unclear themselves what it was for/about - and their customer was not being very helpful telling them.

[TheCyclingProgrammer]

Attend but make it clear up front that you will be billing for the time and if your contract allows for it, additional travel costs.

[WordIsBond]

Attend but make it clear up front that you will be billing for the time and if your contract allows for it, additional travel costs.

If the contract doesn't cover this kind of thing, it might be good for IR35 purposes to insist on a separate, even if informal, agreement. Agree verbally a total cost to cover time and expenses, and then send them a letter saying that, as they've requested you to be there and this isn't part of your contract, the cost will be £X, which you'll invoice separately. Ask them to at least send an email back confirming it.

If you end up dragged inside IR35 for the main contract this will then be a separate amount and not included. But it will also help make the case that you aren't inside IR35 at all -- employees don't do that kind of thing.

[billybiro]

Would you "trust" a person who will not cooperate in a mandated process?

Mandated by whom? Why not try this. Send a letter to your client that YourCo has mandated a rate increase of 50%. See how "mandatory" the client believes that is.

Why is it some contractors think they are above client security and H&S?

Um. Because they're not employees? Do the cleaners have to attend security and H&S meetings?

On a more serious note, why not offer the client a choice. Explain that you're happy to attend site for 2 days, but that it'll cost the client £x for your time. If they're not too receptive to that, tell them that they can forward the minutes of the meeting to you which you can read at your leisure at no additional cost.

[northernladuk]

Um. Because they're not employees? Do the cleaners have to attend security and H&S meetings?
.

I'm pretty sure they will have signed at least H&S but not accessing systems they won't need security.

A clients legal responsibilities are for anyone on site, even visitors. And letting people touch their systems without adhering to their security policy? Jesus.

From..
Employer's responsibilities: Workers' health and safety

Employer's responsibilities

Under the law employers are responsible for health and safety management. The following provides a broad outline of how the law applies to employers. Don't forget, employees and the self employed have important responsibilities too.

It is an employer's duty to protect the health, safety and welfare of their employees and other people who might be affected by their business. Employers must do whatever is reasonably practicable to achieve this.

But thanks for that crap.

[billybiro]

I'm pretty sure they will have signed at least H&S but not accessing systems they won't need security.

A clients legal responsibilities are for anyone on site, even visitors. And letting people touch their systems without adhering to their security policy? Jesus.

From..
Employer's responsibilities: Workers' health and safety




But thanks for that crap.

You're really reaching with this and I suspect you know it. That quoted section is about employers ensuring there isn't obvious health and safety risks like loose cabling laying around where it can be easily tripped over or sharp objects randomly jutting out of walls etc. It even mentions visitors. Do they all attend these 2 day meetings too?

It also has absolutely nothing to do with security. Adhering to a security policy is one thing. That's the client giving you a document at the beginning that perhaps forms part of your contract that details the security policy that you agree to abide by.

Its definitely got nothing to do with clients sending out demanding chicken little-esque "the sky is falling" emails so we MUST all attend this mandatory 2 day seminar just because some middle manager somewhere suddenly gets itchy feet mid-contract and feels the need to do some box ticking.

[northernladuk]

It's not a seminar, it's an audit and it will take 2 days to complete. Part of that will be a briefing.

An audit will encompass anyone on the project or account. Why do you think contractors are exempt from audits?

You do come out with some bollocks.

[WLB2018]

Personally I do not see an issue; bill for the 2 days and attend. Keep the client happy by attending their "mandatory" meeting/audit - simplez!

Surely if you work in a sector that has a requirement for any sort of regulatory compliance (including security) you would be asked to attends audit meetings, governance oversight and alike? None of which I see as an issue.

WLB

[northernladuk]

Personally I do not see an issue; bill for the 2 days and attend. Keep the client happy by attending their "mandatory" meeting/audit - simplez!

Surely if you work in a sector that has a requirement for any sort of regulatory compliance (including security) you would be asked to attends audit meetings, governance oversight and alike? None of which I see as an issue.

WLB

Don't say that. Billybiro will accuse you of having your pants pulled and down and you aren't a proper contractor.

[LondonManc]

If this is aimed at everyone, including contractors, subbies, 3rd party site staff etc. then there is no reason not to do it. It sounds like this would fall under National Security being a Govt. client so I'd just get on with it, it's no different to working for a client that supplies a laptop for you for security reasons.

This. It's nothing to do with IR35 and everything to do with organisational operational risk. Building and systems security apply to all people engaging with the organisation, be it permies, consultants, contractors, lift engineers, canteen staff, cleaners or anyone else. You're on the project, you attend. It's billable time, so not an issue.