Have you ever used a Substitute - how do you go about this? Have you ever used a Substitute - how do you go about this? - Page 2
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Posts 11 to 18 of 18
  1. #11

    Nervous Newbie


    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    11

    Default

    If a client has engaged multiple contractors, is there anything stopping the contractors from substituting each other to both "escape" IR35?

    I suppose it would depend on the contracts, so contracts allowing, would it work if the client was on board?

  2. #12

    My post count is Majestic

    northernladuk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    39,494

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiny View Post
    If a client has engaged multiple contractors, is there anything stopping the contractors from substituting each other to both "escape" IR35?

    I suppose it would depend on the contracts, so contracts allowing, would it work if the client was on board?
    Yes. The other contractors have got work to do. Client is hardly going to be impressed if you all stop doing the work you are supposed to be doing to step in for someone else for no other reason than your tax status.

    And its so highly convoluted it just won't stand up to any scrutiny.

    If it were that simple don't you think it would be standard practice?

    And there is no 'escape' you are inside or you are outside.
    'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!

  3. #13

    Nervous Newbie


    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    11

    Default

    All this talk of silver bullets just had me pondering.

    Thanks for your insight.

  4. #14

    Super poster


    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Posts
    2,148

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by malvolio View Post
    Just remember that the substitute takes over the current contract for the duration, they are not a sub-contractor working for you. That means that they have to hit all your agreed targets and contractual conditions which includes charge rates - which means in turn you will have to negotiate with them how much of the rate they get to keep.
    This is not entirely true.

    YourCo is contracting to meet targets and contractual conditions which includes charge rates. You can work half the time, work the first two months and then disappear for a month while you send someone else, then come back. There is nothing in the law that says the substitute must take over for the duration. Nor does the law specify whether your substitute is an employee of yours or a contractor.

  5. #15

    Godlike

    ChimpMaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Here There and Everywhere
    Posts
    5,482

    Default

    Hooray

    Client has agreed to take a substitute while I am on holiday and then in the future "as and when needed".

    Maybe not the Silver Bullet, but hopefully a significant big marker for "out of IR35". Will be especially useful come next April if I'm still contracted here.

    I'll be engaging the individual myself and paying them from my company - still invoicing the client as normal and in full.


    Do let me know if you have a suitable contract I can use.

    And do let me know if there is anything I should look out for - it's my first ever Sub

  6. #16

    My post count is Majestic

    northernladuk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    39,494

    Default

    IPSE and QDOS have sample contracts. Shouldn't be much different than yours but for a fixed time.

    There is an argument for a much simpler one but if you get it right once you should be able to re-use.

    How will you be getting them up to speed on your time?
    'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!

  7. #17

    Godlike

    ChimpMaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Here There and Everywhere
    Posts
    5,482

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by northernladuk View Post
    IPSE and QDOS have sample contracts. Shouldn't be much different than yours but for a fixed time.

    There is an argument for a much simpler one but if you get it right once you should be able to re-use.

    How will you be getting them up to speed on your time?
    Seems to just be a normal contract on IPSE. But like you say, I could use my contract and amend as needed.

    I'll be getting the Sub up to speed somehow. He's an old work colleague so we have a good working relationship.

    Just did the CEST test again for fun. 6 questions in and "The intermediaries legislation does not apply to this engagement". Never thought I'd be this excited about this stuff.

    I'll be charging the client my normal day rate and paying the Sub a percentage of that. Does that mean I'm a true 'consultancy' because I can make profit even when I'm not personally working? Even though it's only for 10 days
    Last edited by ChimpMaster; 8th July 2019 at 16:15.

  8. #18

    More time posting than coding


    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    330

    Default

    I have a Sub also, I don’t pay them any money, I provide a service back to them to the same value. Not sure if IR35 bullet proof or not


    Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •