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TonyEnglish
14th June 2005, 10:45
Typical bloody new labour (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4090900.stm)

SupremeSpod
14th June 2005, 10:50
Popular support...?

BTW, some people can't access the BBC News website.

As a matter of courtesy can we quote the offending article when we post a link in future?

Spod.

TonyEnglish
14th June 2005, 10:56
OK

Lottery shake-up plan criticised

Ministers tried to introduce the changes in the last Parliament
Planned changes to the National Lottery will see cash diverted from areas like sport and the arts to "cover up gaps" in education and health, Tories say.
Culture Minister Richard Caborn said the plans enjoy popular support, ahead of a Commons debate on the proposals.

Mr Caborn says 70% of cash raised will go to voluntary and community sectors.

Theresa May, for the Conservatives, accused the government of "sticking its hands in the pocket of the lottery" to pay for things taxes should fund.

Independent?

"Frankly, what I think is happening is the government is moving away from the original aims of the Lottery to give money to good causes, heritage, arts and sport," she said.

Mrs May added that the "whole aim" of the lottery was for it to be independent of government but that was, she claimed, changing by stealth with ministers exerting more and more influence over how cash should be spent.

Stephen Bubb, who heads an umbrella group for chief executives of voluntary organisations, said increasing proportions of lottery cash in recent years had gone on health and education programmes and improving school meals following a campaign by TV chef Jamie Oliver.

"Good cause money mustn't be there to plug gaps in departmental budgets at the expense of charities," said Mr Bubb.

Public support?

Mr Caborn was asked on BBC Radio 4's Today programme who decided £45m would come out of lottery funds to pay for school dinners to which he conceded a "major direction" had come from government.

But he insisted that under the proposed changes such decisions would be made by the Big Lottery Fund.

"We are responding exactly to what the public wants," he said adding that people wanted cash to go on priorities like health and education.

The Big Lottery Fund is being created by merging the Community Fund, New Opportunities Fund and the Millennium Commission and Mr Caborn said efficiencies would boost cash to good causes.

"Streamlining will mean more going to frontline services and organisations that there would have been," he said.

widgetdance
14th June 2005, 11:09
If the departments for health and education want lottery money they should buy a fookin ticket like everyone else.

TonyEnglish
14th June 2005, 11:19
The lottery was intended to pay for things which the government wouldn't. It wasn't a method of voluntary taxation. Improving school meals should not come from Lottery funds. It should come from general taxation. I am only suprised that it took Brown so long to start milking this cash cow though

Lucifer Box
14th June 2005, 11:22
Now, now, it's only "fair".

wendigo100
14th June 2005, 11:40
What worries me is that we are stuck with all these new stealth taxes. Imagine trying to reverse this in a few years' time - "removing funding for decent school dinners".

New Labour have made tax-and-spend so complicated, it is now a rats nest of dependencies, rules and money-shuffling that no-one understands but everyone has to abide by, and which will always need a lot of maintenance.

Will anyone ever be able to unravel it, simplify it, and put it above board?

Maximus
14th June 2005, 11:57
"Mr Caborn says 70% of cash raised will go to voluntary and community sectors."


So the ethnics will now get state subsidy to practice witchcraft / flying planes into buildings /avoiding deportation etc

Lucifer Box
14th June 2005, 11:59
What worries me is that we are stuck with all these new stealth taxes
Oh yes. you only have to look at the hysteria generated by the Tory's pre-election proposal to increases spending by 1% less than Labour's plan to see that - "Swingeing cuts in public services", "All nurses to be sacked", "Charging for operations", etc., etc.

The minds behind NL's tax and spend plans are many things, but stupid is not one of them.

DimPrawn
14th June 2005, 12:13
Well they do say the NHS is a lottery and now it really is.

Lucifer Box
14th June 2005, 12:17
Look on the bright side, chaps. Public services are disproportionately used by those who pay little or no tax. The lottery is disproportionately played by those with little or no cash. This is a step towards ensuring those on low income pay their "fair" share of the cost for the services they use, albeit on a voluntary basis. Expect the next budget to unveil a scheme for mandatory lottery playing for those on income support.

dundeegeorge
14th June 2005, 12:25
a small extra tax on microwave-chips or burberry could be applied. I like it. Any other suggestions for targetted-tax?

DimPrawn
14th June 2005, 12:31
Tax on alco-pops, unhealthy foods, gold chains, baseball caps, tattooes, yeah, I like it:D

trajectory
14th June 2005, 12:36
Tax fat people.

Per kilo overweight.

bignobbyfromupnorth
14th June 2005, 13:05
Tax on masturbation by intelligent white males from north of england. Forget coal, this is obviously a waste of one of world's most precious resources.

Am I allowed to say that here?

SupremeSpod
14th June 2005, 13:17
Tax on masturbation by intelligent white males from north of england.

Red or White?

Lucifer Box
14th June 2005, 13:28
a small extra tax on microwave-chips or burberry could be applied. I like it. Any other suggestions for targetted-tax?
You've got it. Car body kits would appear to be another accesory crying out for some special tax treatment. Would probably be no need for road tolls then.

ZATHRAS999
14th June 2005, 14:43
They've been doing it for years. They just think now they could admit to it. >:

benn0
14th June 2005, 14:57
tax on whinging fat cat contractors who are better off than the average man in the street can ever dream to be.
If you don't like it don't buy a lottery ticket. Simple.

DimPrawn
14th June 2005, 15:04
Yes Benn0, power to the people! Them fascist money grabbing b@stard IT contractors should be shot in the streets.

How dare they aspire to anything above ordinary.

Lucifer Box
14th June 2005, 15:07
tax on whinging fat cat contractors who are better off than the average man in the street can ever dream to be
Yeah, right on, comrade. Those fat cat IT contractors will be the first against the wall when the revolution comes.

http://www.lindsayfincher.com/news/soviet_poster_didyouvolunteer.jpg

Tw@t.

TonyEnglish
14th June 2005, 15:11
"tax on whinging fat cat contractors who are better off than the average man in the street can ever dream to be.
If you don't like it don't buy a lottery ticket. Simple"

What utter cr@p. This has nothing to do with being a contractor or well off. It has everything to do with a dishonest government knicking money to use to fill the gaps in thier own spending plans. One of the main points when the lottery was first mooted was that the money raised should NEVER be used to pay for things which taxation should pay for.

ZATHRAS999
14th June 2005, 16:17
One of the main points when the lottery was first mooted was that the money raised should NEVER be used to pay for things which taxation should pay for.

Actually it was Labour (as then was) which brought in this particular point. They argued that the Major Government would use the Lottery to make up shortfalls in their own spending (pot, kettle, black >: ). They then forced through an amendment to the act making the use of Lottery funds for primary government spending illegal. An amendment they dropped when they eventually came to power.

This means the so called 'good causes' have lost out twice. Once when the Government swiped the money. Further sales of Lottery Tickets have declined since this change and so therefore their is now a smaller part of a smaller pie available for those causes people want to pay for. Incidentally they also lose out in a third way since money paid to the lottery has to come out of somewhere and it usually is out of people discretionary money - ie money they might give to Charity directly.

Because in effect the Lottery is now becoming a voluntary tax I refuse to take part. If I want my money to go to good causes then I will pay to them directly. It's the only way. If more people did this the whole ediface would collapse. For example hows about paying a regular sum to your local Repetory theatre?, or some other Charity. I think you will find that done this way the recipient Charity can also claim the tax back in which case you grab even more back from GB which can't after all be a bad thing.

widgetdance
14th June 2005, 16:26
Yes, you set up a covenant to your registered charity and sign a bit of paper which effectively gives them the tax you pay on that amount.

Lucifer Box
14th June 2005, 17:04
You don't even have to do that any more. Just tick the box on the direct debit mandate that says "I am a taxpayer" and the GiftAid scheme takes care of the rest.