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View Full Version : OMG… Greenland’s ice sheets are melting fast



BrilloPad
10th August 2015, 13:02
OMG (http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/aug/09/omg-nasa-project-oceans-melting-greenland)

An urgent attempt to study the rate at which Greenland’s mighty ice sheets are melting has been launched by Nasa. The aim of the six-year project, called Oceans Melting Greenland (OMG), is to blah blah blah.

How long would a non urgent attempt take?

NibblyPig
10th August 2015, 13:30
The non-urgent method would be the Leisurely Monitoring Arctic Oceans (LMAO) and would take as long as the contractors can stand around having fag breaks while one of them occasionally pokes the ice with a wooden stick.

pjclarke
10th August 2015, 13:47
OMG (http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/aug/09/omg-nasa-project-oceans-melting-greenland)

An urgent attempt to study the rate at which Greenland’s mighty ice sheets are melting has been launched by Nasa. The aim of the six-year project, called Oceans Melting Greenland (OMG), is to blah blah blah.

How long would a non urgent attempt take?

No need. Arctic ice is up. We've been told repeatedly.

AtW
10th August 2015, 13:53
Thermonuclear winter should fix it nicely.

WTFH
10th August 2015, 13:53
No need. Arctic ice is up. We've been told repeatedly.


Of course it's up. Look on a map. The Arctic is up. The ice in the Arctic is up in the same place on the map as the Arctic.


It doesn't take a rocket surgeon to work that one out.

pjclarke
10th August 2015, 13:56
Of course it's up. Look on a map. The Arctic is up. The ice in the Arctic is up in the same place on the map as the Arctic.


It doesn't take a rocket surgeon to work that one out.

Ah, but the same unimpeachable source also informs us that Antarctic ice is up. Explain that one, Einstein. Do we turn the Atlas upside down?

BrilloPad
10th August 2015, 13:56
No need. Arctic ice is up. We've been told repeatedly.

As long as there is enough for my G+T, then all is well.

BrilloPad
10th August 2015, 13:57
The non-urgent method would be the Leisurely Monitoring Arctic Oceans (LMAO) and would take as long as the contractors can stand around having fag breaks while one of them occasionally poke the ice with a wooden stick.

I tried that with both my ex-wives. Always seemed to lead to divorce.

AtW
10th August 2015, 13:58
I tried that with both my ex-wives. Always seemed to lead to divorce.

Why didn't you get a prenup? Much cheaper than very expensive divorce, and if she really does not love you then it would save you money on wedding too...

WTFH
10th August 2015, 14:31
Ah, but the same unimpeachable source also informs us that Antarctic ice is up. Explain that one, Einstein. Do we turn the Atlas upside down?



I think you are confusing two different articles published recently.


One stated that global ice was not decreasing as fast as previously thought, and the other stated that Antarctic sea ice area was larger than normal.
Both articles actually agreed that the increase in area of the Antarctic was considerably less than the decrease in the Arctic.


As for Gin, we should be OK for a few years to come.

BrilloPad
10th August 2015, 14:33
Why didn't you get a prenup? Much cheaper than very expensive divorce, and if she really does not love you then it would save you money on wedding too...

Did you get a prenup when you married that squirrel?

EternalOptimist
10th August 2015, 14:38
OMG (http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/aug/09/omg-nasa-project-oceans-melting-greenland)

An urgent attempt to study the rate at which Greenland’s mighty ice sheets are melting has been launched by Nasa. The aim of the six-year project, called Oceans Melting Greenland (OMG), is to blah blah blah.

How long would a non urgent attempt take?

The six year OMG project supercedes the 12 year Hemisphere Ocean/Land Yearly Cryophere Ordinal Warming project (HOLY COW)

AtW
10th August 2015, 14:51
Did you get a prenut when you married that squirrel?

FTFY

BrilloPad
10th August 2015, 14:58
The six year OMG project supercedes the 12 year Hemisphere Ocean/Land Yearly Cryophere Ordinal Warming project (HOLY COW)

Was HOLY COW urgent too?

DimPrawn
10th August 2015, 15:06
Did you get a prenup when you married that squirrel?

Luckily he did, she ran off with another man on their wedding day.

http://s3-ak.buzzfed.com/static/imagebuzz/web03/2009/8/21/11/wedding-crasher-5164-1250868263-89.jpg

EternalOptimist
10th August 2015, 15:21
Was HOLY COW urgent too?

Semi, you are probably getting confused with the World Hydrological Arctic Temperature Evaluation and Verification Envisat and Radiosondes (WHATEVER)

unixman
10th August 2015, 15:45
OMG (http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/aug/09/omg-nasa-project-oceans-melting-greenland)

An urgent attempt to study the rate at which Greenland’s mighty ice sheets are melting has been launched by Nasa. The aim of the six-year project, called Oceans Melting Greenland (OMG), is to blah blah blah.

How long would a non urgent attempt take?

Speed of planetary geology governs speed of study?

BlasterBates
10th August 2015, 17:34
Greenland melt season over (https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2015/08/10/greenland-melt-season-is-over/)


Greenland’s surface gained mass yesterday for the first time this summer. The net surface gain over the past year has been 300 billion tons.

AtW
10th August 2015, 17:40
Greenland’s surface gained mass yesterday for the first time this summer. The net surface gain over the past year has been 300 billion tons.


That was no way to talk to a lady

DimPrawn
10th August 2015, 18:51
Greenland melt season over (https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2015/08/10/greenland-melt-season-is-over/)

The windmills are working!

More windmills and more "green" taxes, it's working!

:rolleyes:

pjclarke
10th August 2015, 19:07
Greenland melt season over (https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2015/08/10/greenland-melt-season-is-over/)

Steve Goddard could not lie straight in bed. Quoting him is a fast track to zero credibility. From the link on his page:


Over the year, it snows more than it melts, but calving of icebergs also adds to the total mass budget of the ice sheet. Satellite observations over the last decade show that the ice sheet is not in balance. The calving loss is greater than the gain from surface mass balance, and Greenland is losing mass at about 200 Gt/yr.

Greenland Ice Sheet Surface Mass Budget: DMI (http://beta.dmi.dk/en/groenland/maalinger/greenland-ice-sheet-surface-mass-budget/)

BlasterBates
10th August 2015, 19:47
Arctic sea ice approaching normal (https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2015/08/10/arctic-sea-ice-approaching-normal/)


The melt season has essentially stopped, with very cold air across the Beaufort Sea

pjclarke
10th August 2015, 21:15
Arctic sea ice approaching normal (https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2015/08/10/arctic-sea-ice-approaching-normal/)

Enough with the comedy one-liners.

Ocean and Ice Services | Danmarks Meteorologiske Institut (http://ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/icecover.uk.php)

http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/images/daily_images/N_stddev_timeseries.png

http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/images/daily_images/S_stddev_timeseries.png

EternalOptimist
10th August 2015, 22:56
things will get interesting a week from now
when this North West passage cruise (http://www.crystalcruises.co.uk/OfferDetail.aspx?OG=220) is due to set sail

will they make it through ?

if they make it, the responses will be

EO -I am gobsmacked and will go back and have a rethink
PJ -Obviously they made it, due to CAGW

If they don't make it, the responses will be

EO - As we have been saying, arctic ice is up
PJ -Obviously they couldn't make it, due to CAGW

WTFH
11th August 2015, 08:09
That was no way to talk to a lady

She's just retaining water... Frozen water.

MicrosoftBob
11th August 2015, 08:20
Enough with the comedy one-liners.

Ocean and Ice Services | Danmarks Meteorologiske Institut (http://ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/icecover.uk.php)

http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/images/daily_images/N_stddev_timeseries.png

http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/images/daily_images/S_stddev_timeseries.png

It's snowjoking matter :tumble:

pjclarke
11th August 2015, 09:02
things will get interesting a week from now
when this North West passage cruise (http://www.crystalcruises.co.uk/OfferDetail.aspx?OG=220) is due to set sail

will they make it through ?

if they make it, the responses will be

EO -I am gobsmacked and will go back and have a rethink
PJ -Obviously they made it, due to CAGW

If they don't make it, the responses will be

EO - As we have been saying, arctic ice is up
PJ -Obviously they couldn't make it, due to CAGW

Meh. Weather. I decline your attempt to frame the question. Alternatively one could say that one luxury cruise more or less doesn't tell you very much; obviously they will have consulted meteorologists and taken out cancellation insurance against the cost of turning back and the insurance company likewise when setting the premium, but as they are charging up to 30K / passenger, I guess they have pretty deep pockets.

If you want to know what the reinsurance business in general think about the risks to their business from climate change …


https://www.munichre.com/en/group/focus/climate-change/index.html

pjclarke
11th August 2015, 09:15
PS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_Bremen

pjclarke
26th August 2015, 13:38
Arctic sea ice approaching normal (https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2015/08/10/arctic-sea-ice-approaching-normal/)

Dropping like the Shanghai Composite.

http://ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/plots/icecover/icecover_current_new.png

WTFH
26th August 2015, 14:48
Based on the title of the thread...
Greenland's Jakobshavn Glacier sheds big ice chunk - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-34041531)


...of course, this is fictitious because in 1983 there was one hot day in Northern Ireland, which proves all the scientists wrong.
Also the calving has increased the amount of ocean ice for a while (what was once considered land ice is now sea ice), which I'm sure will be reported by some as further proof that the scientists are wrong.

EternalOptimist
26th August 2015, 14:59
Based on the title of the thread...
Greenland's Jakobshavn Glacier sheds big ice chunk - BBC News (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-34041531)


...of course, this is fictitious because in 1983 there was one hot day in Northern Ireland, which proves all the scientists wrong.
Also the calving has increased the amount of ocean ice for a while (what was once considered land ice is now sea ice), which I'm sure will be reported by some as further proof that the scientists are wrong.

What on earth are you gibbering about ?

WTFH
26th August 2015, 15:04
What on earth are you gibbering about ?



I'm pre-empting your "report" that the sea ice in the Arctic has increased by 12km^2.

pjclarke
26th August 2015, 15:29
I'm pre-empting your "report" that the sea ice in the Arctic has increased by 12km^2.

:rollin:

MicrosoftBob
26th August 2015, 15:43
I'm pre-empting your "report" that the sea ice in the Arctic has increased by 12km^2.

How would you explain that with the lack of pirates in the Artic ?

EternalOptimist
26th August 2015, 16:02
I'm pre-empting your "report" that the sea ice in the Arctic has increased by 12km^2.

Do you seriously believe that this is the only glacier to calve, or that sublimation is not a massive factor ?

pjclarke
16th September 2015, 12:36
Arctic sea ice approaching normal (https://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2015/08/10/arctic-sea-ice-approaching-normal/)

It has (probably) hit bottom, 1.8 million km2 below the average minimum.

http://nsidc.org/arcticseaicenews/files/2015/09/Figure2a-350x280.png

BrilloPad
16th September 2015, 12:42
It has (probably) hit bottom, 1.8 million km2 below the average minimum.


More science pseudo bollux. No-one has any idea what is going on.

The only things one can be sure of are death, the sun rising and so called scientists(the new priests) spouting nonsense to get attention.

This post applies to AGW acceptors and deniers.

pjclarke
16th September 2015, 13:30
More science pseudo bollux

Fake bollux? Is that truth?

LondonManc
16th September 2015, 13:32
How would you explain that with the lack of pirates in the Artic ?

They have galleons not ice-breakers. HTH

pjclarke
16th September 2015, 13:58
Fourth lowest minimum in the satellite era, as I predicted, hailed a 'recovery' in some quarters ...


Some more context on the fourth-lowest-on-record ice figure might also be provided by recent research showing that the arctic ice cap has staged a remarkable recovery in recent years.

writes Lewis Page at El Reg (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/09/16/arctic_ice_hits_fourth_lowest_area_on_record_recor ds_go_back_cough_34_years/). He also points out that


There still weren't any ice-scanner satellites during the summer minimum of 1969, when the 100,000-ton supertanker Manhattan - at the time the largest merchant vessel on the US registry - transited the Northwest Passage. The M'Clure strait was blocked then, too, just as it is this year, but the Manhattan got through via a route south of Banks Island. It sounds as though ice conditions that summer may not have been too dissimilar to this year.

But, for some reason he omits to mention that, while the passage is today described as 'fully navigable' in 1969 it was only traversible using the Manhattan - the biggest icebreaker in the world, and she was accompanied by 4 other super-ice-breakers, which one might have thought was relevant, in an article on sea-ice. Gotta love the Reg! :laugh

Benny
16th September 2015, 14:31
But, for some reason he omits to mention that, while the passage is today described as 'fully navigable' in 1969 it was only traversible using the Manhattan - the biggest icebreaker in the world, anMe thunk the Manhattan was built as a bog standard oil tanker - but did have an icebreaker
bow fitted for the voyage.
Dedicated icebreakers in addition to the strengthened bow also have a specialist hull design which the Manhattan did not (to move the broken ice away from vulnerable propellers / rudders etc. )and lots of welly in the engines
There are modern "double acting tankers" available since the 1990's which use a stern first approach to ice breaking (yes really!) and forward pointing for open water
HTH

pjclarke
16th September 2015, 14:35
Me thunk the Manhattan was built as a bog standard oil tanker - but did have an icebreaker
bow fitted for the voyage.
Dedicated icebreakers in addition to the strengthened bow also have a specialist hull design which the Manhattan did not (to move the broken ice away from vulnerable propellers / rudders etc. )and lots of welly in the engines
There are modern "double acting tankers" available since the 1990's which use a stern first approach to ice breaking (yes really!) and forward pointing for open water
HTH

Thanks, you're right.


Manhattan* '​s route began in August 1969 on the east coast of North America and transited the passage from east to west via the Baffin Sea and Viscount Melville Sound. The master of Manhattan was Captain Roger A. Steward. Heavy sea ice blocked the way through M'Clure Strait, so a more southerly route through Prince of Wales Strait and south of Banks Island was used. A single, token barrel of crude oil was loaded at Prudhoe Bay and then the ship went back. She was escorted by the Canadian Coast Guard icebreaker CCGS John A. Macdonald. At various times during the expedition, Manhattan was supported by the icebreakers CCGS Louis S. St-Laurent, USCGC Staten Island, and USCGC Northwind.

Page is still a :winker: , tho'