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View Full Version : How Many Contractors in UK?



pjt
9th November 2015, 16:41
With a target of around 100,000 being forced onto a companies payroll I'd have thought only a small portion of these would be valid contractors. Fro what I can determine their are well over a million freelancers in the U.K. If that's the case surely the impact of the proposed new changes can't be as bad as we're thinking.

Zero Liability
9th November 2015, 18:29
They throw around a lot of numbers that they don't really bother substantiating. The usual number for 'PSCs' (as opposed to all freelancers) is 220k, I believe. I suspect the figure may be related to the "40%" mentioned in this article (http://www.contractoruk.com/news/0011600why_taxmans_new_ir35_figures_just_dont_stac k.html), which would bring it just under 90k.

LisaContractorUmbrella
10th November 2015, 07:39
We did put in a FOI request to try and get a definitive answer on this and got nowhere - none of the figures that have been quoted can be substantiated

ShandyDrinker
10th November 2015, 08:11
We did put in a FOI request to try and get a definitive answer on this and got nowhere - none of the figures that have been quoted can be substantiated

So are you saying that FOI requests are in effect a complete waste of time other than for anything the government wants to release to the great unwashed? Fancy that...

LisaContractorUmbrella
10th November 2015, 08:26
So are you saying that FOI requests are in effect a complete waste of time other than for anything the government wants to release to the great unwashed? Fancy that...

You might think that..I couldn't possibly comment :wink

TheFaQQer
10th November 2015, 09:22
So are you saying that FOI requests are in effect a complete waste of time other than for anything the government wants to release to the great unwashed? Fancy that...

I think it's closer to "we haven't got a clue where the numbers come from, but they sound impressive don't they?"

pjt
10th November 2015, 09:31
My point with this thread is not that they don't have a grasp of the figures (which they don't). Its that the figures would suggest that the proposals probably won'y be as bad as the figures suggest. Even if the new rules capture 90,000 contractors that leaves a lot still working through a limited company. If we we're to lump all the agency staff forced to go through an umbrella (cleaners etc) surely that would take up a large portion of the 90,000. In effect I'm clutching at straws and hoping the details of these new proposals wont actually be as bad as they currently seem. Maybe the point on some IT workers still being able to be LTD Co. will be our saving grace.

We can only hope and wait for further details.

webberg
10th November 2015, 09:44
My point with this thread is not that they don't have a grasp of the figures (which they don't). Its that the figures would suggest that the proposals probably won'y be as bad as the figures suggest. Even if the new rules capture 90,000 contractors that leaves a lot still working through a limited company. If we we're to lump all the agency staff forced to go through an umbrella (cleaners etc) surely that would take up a large portion of the 90,000. In effect I'm clutching at straws and hoping the details of these new proposals wont actually be as bad as they currently seem. Maybe the point on some IT workers still being able to be LTD Co. will be our saving grace.

We can only hope and wait for further details.

"The government estimates that there are around 265,000 PSC's in 2012/13"

"In 2011/12 around 10,000 people paid tax under IR35, an estimated 10% of those who should have paid tax on at least part of the income their PSC receives under the legislation"

Quotes from Intermediaries Legislation (IR35): discussion document, 17 July 2015.

Perhaps a slightly different statistical set but indicates that HMG considers another 90,000 PSC's should be effectively treated for tax purposes as employees.

pjt
10th November 2015, 10:02
"The government estimates that there are around 265,000 PSC's in 2012/13"

"In 2011/12 around 10,000 people paid tax under IR35, an estimated 10% of those who should have paid tax on at least part of the income their PSC receives under the legislation"

Quotes from Intermediaries Legislation (IR35): discussion document, 17 July 2015.

Perhaps a slightly different statistical set but indicates that HMG considers another 90,000 PSC's should be effectively treated for tax purposes as employees.

Yes, but this would also suggest that they think 165,000 should not be treated as employees. This surely means the rules would have to be implemented in a way that allows true contractors the ability to continue as they currently do? What I'm getting at is that a large portion of the 90,000 will hopefully be the low skilled umbrella agency staff. Which may leave us fairly unscathed. Again I do realise this is clutching a straws but may be something in it.

MarkT
16th November 2015, 15:17
Yes, but this would also suggest that they think 165,000 should not be treated as employees. This surely means the rules would have to be implemented in a way that allows true contractors the ability to continue as they currently do? What I'm getting at is that a large portion of the 90,000 will hopefully be the low skilled umbrella agency staff. Which may leave us fairly unscathed. Again I do realise this is clutching a straws but may be something in it.

As a fellow straw clutcher, I feel your clutching. (Sid James laugh ensues) :rolleyes:

You may well have a point - this statement about "some IT contractors should work through PSCs" may well be our saviour. I wonder what the CBI said about it to them....

....I would the phrase rhymes with "clucking bell"