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Millions of middle-class savers could lose out under radical pensions shake up

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    Millions of middle-class savers could lose out under radical pensions shake up

    George Osborne warned that millions of middle-class savers will lose out under plans for a pensions Isa which will be unveiled in his Budget next month.

    (AtW's comment - he should warned this before the election )

    Middle-class savers are to lose thousands of pounds of tax relief when saving for a pension but will not have to pay tax when they retire, under radical plans set to be unveiled in the Budget.

    The controversial proposal will mean that higher-rate taxpayers will lose valuable tax perks during their working lives. However, they will be able to withdraw their lifetime savings tax-free after retirement.

    The proposal has sparked a Government row with the pensions minister warning that it threatens to undermine the system by removing the tax incentives for pensioners to keep money in their pot. It would allow George Osborne, the Chancellor, to save more than £10 billion annually in the coming years – although tax receipts would then fall in decades to come. (AtW's comment: so there you have it - he is NOT fixing roof proper, he is just using some cellotape to claim success - a cowboy chancellor)

    The Chancellor is preparing to announce “pensions Isas” in his Budget later this month. The system would allow people to remove as much as they wish from their retirement pots tax free but would also remove tax relief on any funds paid into the pot.

    Savers would instead receive a “bonus” worth up to 20 per cent of the money they invest in their pensions.

    Last night, analysis for The Daily Telegraph showed that higher rate taxpayers will lose up to 15 per cent of their retirement income under the plans.

    Savers would lose out because the loss of 40 per cent tax relief would outweigh the benefit of tax free withdrawals after age 55 as many would only be paying a basic rate of tax on withdrawals under the current system.

    The analysis found that a higher rate taxpayer who has built up a pension pot worth £500,000 after tax under the current system would lose £76,000 under the proposals. Alan Higham, founder of consumer website pensionschamp.com who conducted the research, said: “This is a massively high risk strategy and risks killing off voluntary workplace pensions all together.

    “We’ve already seen a lot of big bosses opting out of pensions because it’s not tax efficient, and we’ll likely see this kind of activity en masse with the implementation of a pension Isa system.”

    Steve Webb, the former Liberal Democrat pensions minister, told The Daily Telegraph that the plans for a “pensions Isa” could drag more than 500,000 people into the higher rate of income tax overnight.

    He said that at present pension contributions are “tax deductible” and do not count towards people’s annual earnings. He suggested the reforms would see people’s taxable income “soar”.

    More DOOM from the source: Millions of middle-class savers could lose out under radical pensions shake up - Telegraph

    I guess that means that pensioners in 20 years won't be voting Tory Scum at all

    Apart from those who will become known as waldorks...

    #2
    Half of these articles lately are basically written by Steve Webb, who has been pontificating about needing a flat rate pensions "relief" for utterly yonks - right up until the point when we was sacked by the voters.

    He wants a flat rate system, he's always wanted that, and anything that gets in the way of that is sacrilege.

    Pensions ISAs are practically dead. Osbourne hasn't got the balls to see through such a radical change. This is Steve Webb trying to put the nails firmly in the coffin - just in case Osbourne is feeling really bold.

    Then what other choice will Osbourne have but to do what Webb has wanted all along.

    Most of these "sources" are total bollards - it's just scare stories from one side trying to make the other option sound so bad that Osbourne will throw it in the bin.

    We'll find out in a couple of weeks, assuming George doesn't kick it into the long grass again with the Euro referendum pending.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by centurian View Post
      We'll find out in a couple of weeks, assuming George doesn't kick it into the long grass again with the Euro referendum pending.
      In case of failure to win referendum it will be his good friend Camoron that will probably have to fall on his sword... suits Osborne! Of course he won't call in the elections because of the fixed term Parliaments now, obeying the law like the last commoner...

      I reckon Gidiot will go for "flat rate" 20% contribution, called a bit differently just like the article says - so there will be possibility to remove that "bonus" in the future. I doubt he'll give 5 years for tapered withdrawal of tax relief on this one, maybe 4 years if he is generous, which he ain't.

      As a "compensation" he will accelerate increase in high rate threshold a bit - something that he promised to do anyway without giving details what he'll take back...

      P.S. Webb works for pension industry now and they would have much preferred status quo, the only reason he talks about "flat rate" is in vaid hope the rate will be something reasonable like 33% but he ain't going to get it. The fallout for Osborne will be big enough whether he fixes it at 20% or 25%, so might as well go to 20% straight away and maybe later increase it a bit to 25%.
      Last edited by AtW; 4 March 2016, 00:27.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by AtW View Post
        P.S. Webb works for pension industry now and they would have much preferred status quo, the only reason he talks about "flat rate" is in vaid hope the rate will be something reasonable like 33% but he ain't going to get it. The fallout for Osborne will be big enough whether he fixes it at 20% or 25%, so might as well go to 20% straight away and maybe later increase it a bit to 25%.
        While I agree the pensions industry would prefer no changes at all for 10 years to get some stability, I think the defined contribution providers (most of the private sector pensions industry) are warm to the idea of a flat rate relief if there are going to be any changes at all - as it simplifies their model - and makes marketing pension benefits more clearer. That's why they hired Webb - to make sure that any change if it happens - is their preferred change.

        The defined benefit providers (i.e. public sector, plus some large corporates) are having nightmares about flat rate relief.
        Last edited by centurian; 4 March 2016, 10:13.

        Comment


          #5
          Must be nice to be rich (assuming nothing else changes between now and said rich's retirement).

          So if I understand this correctly people who have a portion of their income directly paid into a pension would still have that income taxed, i.e., it wouldn't be a "pre-tax contribution" any more. That sounds brilliant, why not make it mandatory to ensure the collection of tax as well? I was planning to opt-out of my umbrella's pension fund anyway, but this would have ensured that. It's either going to be an ISA or fire safe that I put cash into I guess...

          Comment


            #6
            George Osborne backs down on radical pension reform | Politics | The Guardian



            There won’t be any changes to tax relief at all in the budget. George has always been clear he wouldn’t do anything to damage saving. The pensions consultation has been open-ended, to look at how the system is working. He’s listened to what people have said and concluded that now isn’t the right time – with uncertainty in the global economy and reforms such as auto-enrolment still bedding in – to turn things on their head.
            Translated: I'm a chicken**** (until June 24).

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by jamesbrown View Post
              Well, buckle up then - he'll have to find a lot of money in new tax increases then ...

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by AtW View Post
                Well, buckle up then - he'll have to find a lot of money in new tax increases then ...
                Why - this was called "Strengthening the incentive to save" - it wasn't a tax grab

                Comment


                  #9
                  A few months ago the end of contracting was nigh and he barely scratched the surface.
                  Now the end of pensions is nigh, what chance the reality is that nothing of any real significance will actually occur?
                  Taking a break from contracting

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by chopper View Post
                    what chance the reality is that nothing of any real significance will actually occur?
                    He'll do it in Nov/Dec, since he's already capped "additional rate" taxpayers they won't be able to save much to avoid his axe.

                    Comment

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