The PS, IR35 and GCloud

[jonnyboy]

All,

What is your view of work from the GCLoud in terms of the new proposed IR35 rules?

So GCloud = Public sector portal where PS companies can find services and products from approved suppliers, and visa-versa (companies bidding for PS deliveries)

So if you win a Gcloud contract to supply a chunk of software (lets say create a web site, or create a new database, or create and carry out a training course to train a bunch of people on something), is this inside or outside of the new IR35 rules?

It could be viewed as being as 'jasmine' scenario...

Jasmine is a Website Designer, contracted to a large local authority to design and build a website - off-payroll working rules do not apply.
Context

Jasmine is a website designer who provides her services through her own company, Jasmine WWW Ltd. The PSC has been contracted by a local authority, Midshire CC to design and build a new website, through which local residents should be able to access and use their services.

Midshire CC has agreed to pay Jasmine WWW Ltd £200,000 for Jasmine’s services.

Do off-payroll rules apply?
Jasmine’s task is to design and build the new website. To do so, she will need to work closely with the council to understand their requirements, including technical specifications and timelines. Jasmine will have a large amount of control for how she delivers her work and other than regular checkpoint meetings and progress appraisals with the council’s Head of IT Services, her work will be largely unsupervised.

Jasmine WWW Ltd’s contract with Midshire CC means Jasmine will be expected to:

deliver the website to an agree standard by the agreed date
visit the council’s offices for meetings, but will mainly work from her own office
provided her own equipment needed to do the job in hand
employ her own staff to help deliver the contract if she needs to
cover her own costs and expenses

Using the Employment Status Service
Midshire CC uses the online Employment Status Service to help determine whether the off-payroll rules should apply to the contract with Jasmine WWW Ltd. Given the nature of Jasmine’s work and the contract with the PSC, the service indicates that the rules do not apply in this instance.

Jasmine WWW Ltd has been contracted to provide a distinct product to the council and will bear the costs associated in delivering that. Although her work is for the public sector, Jasmine will not be performing a role which would be considered to be that of an employee.

[youngguy]

Key points there are a tangible deliverable (website), working off site and using own resources . G Cloud and other frameworks may look better on the face of it but I suspect the new tool and the fact that ps decide will mean the framework matters little.

[Andy Hallett]

Gcloud is a deliverables based framework, those delivering through this should be ok.

[Scruff]

Way too complicated for me to read...

[bobspud]

Way too complicated for me to read...

You need to...

Otherwise you are going to end up in a herd of super temps making everyone else rich except yourself.

[northernladuk]

GCloud has been tightened up recently so bums on seats offerings have, in the main been taken off. The types of gigs that the PS want won't hit GCloud so there won't be the option to go for it. Doesn't matter what framework you are on, if the gig isn't offered in it you are wasting your time.

There are many many established companies on there already offering any service you can think off. When you are shortlisted you go through a very intensive checklist when you present. No way will a bunch of contractors cut it. One of the key questions that stumps most moat new people to GCloud is 'Have you supplied this service to clients before'and you will get asked about it when you present.

Your question misses a lot of context which makes it very difficult to answer accurately. You are obviously angling at something but the details of that are key.

[jonnyboy]

The details are that one of my PS clients is looking to offer me some work through GCloud... but no point in going down this route if it does not work.

In terms of the 'have you done this before' the answer will be a yes. Oh, and the client is offering to help set me up as a company in GCLoud with pre-selection for the work once registered. Its the IR35 case and tax implications I am concerned with going forward.

[bobspud]

GCloud has been tightened up recently so bums on seats offerings have, in the main been taken off. The types of gigs that the PS want won't hit GCloud so there won't be the option to go for it. Doesn't matter what framework you are on, if the gig isn't offered in it you are wasting your time.

There are many many established companies on there already offering any service you can think off. When you are shortlisted you go through a very intensive checklist when you present. No way will a bunch of contractors cut it. One of the key questions that stumps most moat new people to GCloud is 'Have you supplied this service to clients before'and you will get asked about it when you present.

Your question misses a lot of context which makes it very difficult to answer accurately. You are obviously angling at something but the details of that are key.

Not true I know a few micro companies doing well at g-cloud.

The details are that one of my PS clients is looking to offer me some work through GCloud... but no point in going down this route if it does not work.

In terms of the 'have you done this before' the answer will be a yes. Oh, and the client is offering to help set me up as a company in GCLoud with pre-selection for the work once registered. Its the IR35 case and tax implications I am concerned with going forward.

Your issue is that G-clouds not open at the moment. You might be able to get onto Digital Outcomes though if you are really quick.

[eek]

Not true I know a few micro companies doing well at g-cloud.



Your issue is that G-clouds not open at the moment. You might be able to get onto Digital Outcomes though if you are really quick.

Yep you have until 5pm Wednesday to get into Digital outcomes and as it features Developer, BA and project management options it is worth going for...

[nucastle]

How do you know about the cut off dates Eek?

My idea is to set up shop with a bunch of ex DWP contractors as a supplier but I have no clue how easy/hard this is going to be.