Subsistence claims and receipts

[monkeygeorge]

There's lots of scaremongering here as soon as anyone mentions anything about filing subsistence claims with no receipts. The number of times I've seen "just you wait till the IR come knocking..."

Has anyone actually been told first hand by the IR that you need receipts?

I've spoken to two people at the IR about this and they said that if there is a dispensation then it's fine - you don't need receipts.

George

[Cowboy Bob]

There's lots of scaremongering here as soon as anyone mentions anything about filing subsistence claims with no receipts. The number of times I've seen "just you wait till the IR come knocking..."

Has anyone actually been told first hand by the IR that you need receipts?

I've spoken to two people at the IR about this and they said that if there is a dispensation then it's fine - you don't need receipts.

George

If YOU have the dispensation you don't need receipts. Do you have a dispensation? Or is it your umbrella?

[malvolio]

For the last time (after this, people damn well can go search for themselves), you do not need receipts. You do, however, need a proof of purchase if you are claiming a business expense - that can be an entry on a CC bill if necessary - and then only if you are being investigated for VAT or PAYE (checking for missing BIKs)

So, if you are never investigated for VAT or PAYE, no problem. However if you are and you can't prove the purchase it will be disallowed as a business expense and you may get smacked with a back-tax bill and even penalties if you';re really taking the michael (and an IR35 trawl for good measure). Since receipting things from six years ago might be tricky, why not take the time-honoured course of keeping proper records...?

[monkeygeorge]

If YOU have the dispensation you don't need receipts. Do you have a dispensation? Or is it your umbrella?

That's not what the guy at the IR told me.

[ASB]

That's not what the guy at the IR told me.

Well the man at the IR was, broadly speaking, wrong. As malvolio said in the event of an investigation you need proof (which can be different from a receipt). All the dispensation does is allow simpler reporting - they don't have to be put on the P11D. The onus is firmly on the taxpayer to be able to prove the expense to the satisfaction of the man from the IR.

However, from experience, the IR are not entitrely unreasonable. If you can show reasonable patterns etc they are generally OK. If you can't then you will have a problem.

[SallyAnne]

There's lots of scaremongering here as soon as anyone mentions anything about filing subsistence claims with no receipts. The number of times I've seen "just you wait till the IR come knocking..."

Has anyone actually been told first hand by the IR that you need receipts?

I've spoken to two people at the IR about this and they said that if there is a dispensation then it's fine - you don't need receipts.

George

If you want absolutely proof George, then wait until my investigation is complete (if that ever happens!)
I'm currently being investigated for Travel and Subsistance - they have all my receipts, and are no doubt goin through all the IR35 stuff aswell. They said 6 weeks - its now been about 5 months, and still no sign.
I will post and let you all know what happens (which will no doubt be a hefty fine, and some anal punishment (so I've been told) for good measure)

[DS23]

I was investigated re Travel and Subsistence last year by the IR. Took close to 4 Months and I was asked to provide proof of purchase. I did have a full set of receipts covering the 8 months and 12 grand in question - which is a might pile of paper.

I found that the standard totalling of monthly expenses that I had been performing in my accounting spreadsheet was completely inadequate for the data that the IR wanted so I had to recompile everything again - well, I didn't have to but it seemed like a sensible thing to do. Getting copies of the receipts was also a pain because they were collated in a submitted expense kind of way and split into Euro and Sterling versions - I had to undo everything and copy them all again...

Next time I am on an expenses job I will work in triplicate copy mode rather than just one for my Ltd Co and one for the agent/client. I will also be adding individual line, date, amount, exchange rate, type, starting point, destination and purpose to my detailed expenses spreadsheet (though not necessarily my accounting spreadsheet).

Anyway, by going through all the data I did discover duplicates and discrepancies that I had made. I politely held my hand up ended in an amendment of just under 150 quid that I owed. So maybe the rear investigature will not be so bad Sally Anne...

[partimer]

yet again

I think you'll find that the person you spoke to at the IR probably thought you were the Brolly and not the end tax payer. As with all dealings with Hector, the onus is always on you to prove everything. The quickest way is a receipt.

It's also the only time when you are effectively guilty till proven innocent. The people investigating tend to be of a more nasty variety then the smiling faces on their helpdesk. As with most expenses, they should be financially neutral. You spend money and get that money reimbursed. Only a nutter would claim for lobster and caviar as lunch every day

Take the p1ss with expenses and expect no mercy.

[Nixon Williams]

Obtaining and keeping receipts is essential to avoid future problems with the Revenue. A dispensation does not remove the obligation to keep receipts, it just removes the obligation to report the expenses on a P11d. If you cannot show that you have spent the money you have no defence when the Revenue ask.

Many Umbrella's appear to encourage the claiming of standard "expenses" even if not incurred, anyone can see that can end in trouble.

Alan

[monkeygeorge]

Firstly, the guy at the IR definitely knew I was an employee and not an umbrella company.

Just to make sure we're talking about the same thing, for those being investigated for Travel and Subsistence, which brolly company were you with, and did you spend the amount you claimed?

I've added a note on my tax return that I claimed subsistence for the time I was with shambolic Orange Genie, so lets see if they come back to me on that.