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grjohnson
17th April 2002, 20:46
Hi

I've been looking at this Contractor Financial Planning scheme offered by Dignatio.

Is there anyone out there using this already or know any thing about it?

AReporter
25th June 2002, 18:26
I Would seriously consider your options before joining Dignatio. I Signed up
with them and all was well until one day I was advised by Dignatio that I
would not be paid for the month because the bank that makes payments had
decided to stop trading after the events of 11th September. This was not
true and after a long delay and filling in forms I was given an on-line
account with Keystones-Global Bank registered in some far of country with no
real address or telephone number. They must had just built the on-line web
site because it did not work and I could not log in to access my long over
due money. I Could go on but lets just say you have been warned and I learnt
my lesson well since being put out of pocket by the experience.

Safe
29th July 2002, 11:08
I agree...I did an email trace on the "off shore" account they set you up with. It goes straight to Dignatio!! This basically means they do not operate the scheme they say they do. This also means it isn't defenable should it go to court. And would you want to trust a company like this with large amounts of your money. The directors are not from this country so they could run off with a whole load of money that isn't theirs should the IR start sniffing around. Don't touch this scheme until they have a track record i.e. a few years. This sort of scheme relies on a large amount of trust, they have to operate the scheme they say they do if you don't want to get screwed. Unfortunately they don't..... EBT's are a good idea and ARE defenable in court. You really have to do a little research, if you are going through one of these companies check the EBT fund exists, check they have received legal advise (ask to see minutes) and check the accountancy company they use also exists. In short verify everything they say they have in place is in place. E.G. Try and verify Keystone Global and you find no information on the web, go to the web site and they only take correspondence by email. Dignatio say they operate in Canada, yet they always repond by email in UK time ... Mmmmmm doesn't really take a Genius to work out that Dignatio have set this account up themselves does it?? And you know what, I spent 3 hrs pursuing this .. I'm pretty sure the IR would spend much more time than me taking there "implementation" of the scheme apart.

milanbeness
2nd August 2002, 15:05
Hi Graem,

Are you ready to start up another dodgy scheme after you had your £££ fraud cases?

itallhelps
2nd August 2002, 16:06
who's Graem - dignatio

Safe
2nd August 2002, 16:39
Please try to make sense when you reply, we are trying to have a sensible discussion

itallhelps
2nd August 2002, 17:44
sorry, punctuation let me down.

My question is/was: Is this Graem person the one who set up the scheme which you're all saying is a bit dodgey? Just in case he pops up elsewhere, which is likely.

jacko
2nd August 2002, 18:34
More to the point - who's milanbeness??

milanbeness
3rd August 2002, 10:01
itallhelps,

Graem is obviously nothing to do with the company 'Dignatio' as he's asking about their scheme.

milan
(I'm a shadow of milanbenes5)

shaunbhoy
2nd September 2002, 14:14
Well, personally speaking, I have used the Dignatio/CFP scheme for almost a year and a half. Yes, there have been a few hiccups along the way but I am yet to lose any money and believe the scheme to be legally defensible. Do tell me some better alternatives that do not involve me just handing over around half of my income to a wasteful IR in order that we can build more detention centres for economic spongers!

dcbluemoon
31st October 2002, 15:11
Well, they went bust last week taking a rather large amount of a fair few contractors cash with them... I should have heeded the warnings doh!

shaunbhoy
31st October 2002, 17:47
"taking a rather large amount of a fair few contractors cash with them"

Not ******** yet they haven't!!!

Grrrrrr!

RAC Contracts
31st October 2002, 20:17
Does anyone have any factual inside knowledge of why this company has gone into liquidation?

Now that they have gone under, does anyone have a recommendation for an alternative company running a similar scheme?

planetit
1st November 2002, 09:04
What, a similar scheme to the one that has just gone bust? Rumoured (by an accountant on this board) to be because the taxman was on to them?

Well, funnily enough, no I don’t.

Boiler Spoiler
1st November 2002, 10:37
OMGawd

"People not learning by their previous mistakes shocker"

I can just see the headline in The Sun now.

I remember a while ago, on this board, one of the resident accountants was being slated by you lot for stating this scheme was a bit iffy.

And now your thinking of looking at another one?!?!?!?!

freshblue
1st November 2002, 12:09
RAC - either run a true limited company and defend your corner on ir35 or use a bog standard umbrella. Any ebt scheme is (imo) a red rag to a red (Hector) bull, especially those that state "avoid ir35".

ukcontract01
2nd November 2002, 22:17
Dignatio looked iffy from the start - I suspect that they didn't actually have a genuine EBT set up - nor a foreign bank or foreign currency broker

Inland Revenue would soon realise this - and disallow transactions with connected companies/ficticious transactions - hence presenting Dignatio with a massive Corporation Tax bill they couldn't pay and so go bust

EBTs are legal/viable (correctly set up with professional/reputable trustees)

Just as one iffy company folds - along comes another - just try getting the trustees details from Norla Consulting - with any umbrella company just ignore the sales patter and check out credentials of accountants/trustees - if the info isn't forthcoming - don't join up

tim123
3rd November 2002, 09:16
.....Inland Revenue would soon realise this - and disallow transactions with connected companies/ficticious transactions - hence presenting Dignatio with a massive Corporation Tax bill they couldn't pay and so go bust.

Um, don't you think that perhaps this is exactly what has just happened? ISTM to be the most plausable of the possibilities.

Tim

Magoo
4th November 2002, 04:35
They havent gone bust Tim. They need to be financially solvent in order to go into voluntary liquidation.

However, they may have been presented a large corp tax bill (or whatever) and decided the only means of paying it is with the EBT (That part may well have been a scam). It'll be interesting to find out how many people get their money in a couple of weeks time.

Safe
4th December 2002, 14:30
Test

Safe
4th December 2002, 14:36
like I said:

I went with Dignatio:

1) It was apparent that they were not operating the scheme they said they did - The bank they say existed didn't
2) They didn't ever have any forward contracts with which you indenpendently verify
3) There scheme they said they had didn't exist - I took all my money and ran - the sale guy Stuart Little did a presentation and I thought he was lying through his teeth. I'm pretty sure hes the man behind this hold scheme.
4) I have the directors address if anybody would like it (via companies house)- If you have outstanding monies then you could write to them

Jason

Carolinek
4th December 2002, 14:48
What do you think the chances are of Inland Revenue coming after us (ie the contractors that have used the scheme) for the additional PAYE and NI?

Safe
4th December 2002, 15:02
Slim, but they can. Hopefully they will make an example out of the Dignatio directors and take them to the cleaners. It would be expensive and time-consuming for the IR to pursue this throughly, but they can. I am really annoyed that Dignatio have put this many people in this position

malvolio
4th December 2002, 16:43
IIRC, there's only one director and he is not a UK citizen, so may be outside the IR's reach. And there is a principle in law somewhere about artifical financial constructs used to step around paying tax.

Ex-Dignatio clients (among others, of course) are not safe yet, not until 2022. The IR rights of investigation can go back for 20 years.

Simon SJDaccountancy
4th December 2002, 17:28
They can only go back 20 years if they suspect fraud, and this really would not apply to the contractors.

I reckon you have a fair chance of getting investigated - it is fairly easy pickings for the Revenue unless someone has investigation insurance (which is very unlikely for this sort of scheme)

Magoo
11th December 2002, 13:21
Simon,
What is the basis of your opinion?
From what I have read, Dignatio went down because of a large corporation tax bill and not because of the mechanics of the scheme.

It is also likely that they will be paying this bill from money that they have not submitted to the EBT which only goes to reinforce the contractors stance with regard to tax laibilities.

So the legality was never in question. In theory, if Dignatio could persuade its contractors to pay for its mistake, they could still be operating.