I wonder how many other users are in the dark about LC19?

[Loan Ranger]

It's clearly come as a shock to many AML users.

AML are unusual in that they're still around to inform their clients. The vast majority of promoters have long since disappeared.

I presume HMRC will write to everyone who is on their radar, at some point, giving advance warning of LC19?

Although knowing them, they'll probably save that nastygram for Xmas.

[luxCon]

I presume HMRC will write to everyone who is on their radar, at some point, giving advance warning of LC19?

HMRC does not have a list of people on their radar except those who were subject to an APN.

What HMRC wants is

1) The user comes forward fearing the 2019
2) The trustees providing them a list and then HMRC goes after the user

If 2) does not happen for whatever reason for a trustee, than those not taking on 1) will get away

So hopefully some of the users who are in the dark will get away as their trustee either gone under ground or rather not get involved .

[Loan Ranger]

HMRC does not have a list of people on their radar except those who were subject to an APN.

By on their radar, I meant where they've opened an enquiry or issued an assessment. There were quite a lot of non-DOTAS loan schemes where people won't have had APNs.

[webberg]

We've probably spoken with 50+ people in the last few days.

These are either AML users or another scheme where the trustee recently sent out a "be warned" note.

I would say perhaps 20 had no idea what was happening - never had HMRC enquiry - never heard of the charge.

If that very unscientific poll is true, then HMRC's alleged 65,000 impacted people is light by around 40,000 or so?

That brings us to around 100,000 which is closer to our estimate.

[phil@pmtc]

We've probably spoken with 50+ people in the last few days.

These are either AML users or another scheme where the trustee recently sent out a "be warned" note.

I would say perhaps 20 had no idea what was happening - never had HMRC enquiry - never heard of the charge.

If that very unscientific poll is true, then HMRC's alleged 65,000 impacted people is light by around 40,000 or so?

That brings us to around 100,000 which is closer to our estimate.

Id agree the 100k figure. I've also taken a few calls of late where they previously had no idea. I suspect there's going to be quite a number blissfully unaware until the LC itself kicks in.

[ChimpMaster]

Some non-DOTAS schemes contractors have been under investigation and so HMRC will be able to find out who every single contractor is within that scheme. A simple case of looking for everyone who was employed by that scheme company.

What HMRC won't know are the loan figures. I guess they will ask the contractor to supply bank statements from x years ago.

If I hadn't been on CUK I would never have known about the LC. Why would I? The employer is long gone and I have no open enquiry for when I was on that scheme for a short while 10 years ago.

So how are the "blissfully unaware" meant to know about the LC?

And - if these contractors remain unaware post-2019, will HMRC have the right to charge them with non-compliance, even though morally they have done nothing wrong?

[surreypanic]

can this be actually lawful?

We've probably spoken with 50+ people in the last few days.

These are either AML users or another scheme where the trustee recently sent out a "be warned" note.

I would say perhaps 20 had no idea what was happening - never had HMRC enquiry - never heard of the charge.

If that very unscientific poll is true, then HMRC's alleged 65,000 impacted people is light by around 40,000 or so?

That brings us to around 100,000 which is closer to our estimate.

I am exactly in that situation, just a random email from CK and the AML team

The purpose of this email is to bring to your attention all the options that are available to you concerning the Loan Charge legislation introduced by HMRC, which will take effect from April 2019.

As a recipient of a third party loan you will be caught by this punitive legislation and should take remedial action to mitigate your liability without delay. At the time the loans were made, they were within the tax legislation and not taxable. However, the new ‘Loan Charge’ legislation has been made retrospectively and you will be subject to the full force of this legislation when it takes effect in 2019.

You will have received an email from Knox House Trust, the Trustees of the trust that holds your loan. They have outlined 2 options to mitigate the 2019 Loan Charge; Settlement or Repayment. They cannot offer assistance and have suggested the services of contractor specialist PTS Limited, who can assist with these 2 options.

We would like to draw to your attention that there are further alternative options available. Vanquish Options can provide a mechanism to repay your existing loan which meets the requirements of the Loan Charge legislation and is supported by Tax Counsel opinion. Examples of the financial impact of each option are available. Please take time to review their website and contact Vanquish Options on 0203 740 3876. Taking no action will not avoid the 2019 Loan Charge.


If it was within legislation we as the customer surely acted in "good faith" of the service and the liability must sit with the service provider?

I am at a loss in terms of next steps .... anyone with advice I would appreciate any feedback ..

Regards

[Claypole1971]

I am exactly in that situation, just a random email from CK and the AML team

The purpose of this email is to bring to your attention all the options that are available to you concerning the Loan Charge legislation introduced by HMRC, which will take effect from April 2019.

As a recipient of a third party loan you will be caught by this punitive legislation and should take remedial action to mitigate your liability without delay. At the time the loans were made, they were within the tax legislation and not taxable. However, the new ‘Loan Charge’ legislation has been made retrospectively and you will be subject to the full force of this legislation when it takes effect in 2019.

You will have received an email from Knox House Trust, the Trustees of the trust that holds your loan. They have outlined 2 options to mitigate the 2019 Loan Charge; Settlement or Repayment. They cannot offer assistance and have suggested the services of contractor specialist PTS Limited, who can assist with these 2 options.

We would like to draw to your attention that there are further alternative options available. Vanquish Options can provide a mechanism to repay your existing loan which meets the requirements of the Loan Charge legislation and is supported by Tax Counsel opinion. Examples of the financial impact of each option are available. Please take time to review their website and contact Vanquish Options on 0203 740 3876. Taking no action will not avoid the 2019 Loan Charge.


If it was within legislation we as the customer surely acted in "good faith" of the service and the liability must sit with the service provider?

I am at a loss in terms of next steps .... anyone with advice I would appreciate any feedback ..

Regards

Likewise - I got my email today and in a mild panic. Would love some guidance on where to go

[LandRover]

Likewise - I got my email today and in a mild panic. Would love some guidance on where to go

Big Group has many ex-AML users...

It looks like the numbers affected have been hugely under-estimated seeing that many have no investigations underway yet.

[joed]

SElf employed status

So I got the LC19 notice also although not from AML direct, via a colleague who introduced me to the scheme. I was involved for 4 years from 2012/13 to 2015/16 so racked up quite a few 'loans'. I got a notification and assessment from HMRC for the first tax tear and promptly passed this on to AML who then dealt with HMRC. AML's challenge was that HMRC did not provide any basis for their assessment other than guessing, I presume from invoice amounts. This of course included the 18% fee that AML charged. I never had an HMRC 'assessment' on how much was due for the other 3 years, although I did receive letters saying they were 'checking' my SA returns. I have never heard from HMRC directly now for over a year.

I have always passed HMRC correspondence to AML (or Smartpay Ltd, who also got involved in the 15/16 tax year due to new income reporting rules from HMRC) as they always asked to be the primary point of contact for me.

I have been in contact with a tax consultant at AML who has advised me the following:

1. No 'Penalty' charges will apply if I settle with HMRC, only interest accruing at the rate of 3% from the due date of 31 Jan of the following yr.
2. There is no 'negotiation' on the interest, they intend to recover all interest due.
3. He 'wavered' on my intention to claim back expenses during the years in question.
4. He said that AML would register me with HMRC before the 31 May deadline and I would never have to meet with HMRC people.
5. He said we would make a calculation of the tax due and submit to HMRC who would come back to 30 September 2018 to either agree or advise otherwise.

If anyone received different advice to what I was advised, can you let me know?

Anyhow, I am going to make a settlement with HMRC but have a few questions for any of you guys out there who can offer some DECENT advice.

First question - If they are now asking me to declare all income as employment income, I should be then classed as Self Employed for the years in question right? I was not working for any company direct, only using an agent and AML to process the payments for me. I would be due to pay all income tax and NI for the yrs in question at the rates in effect at that time, and any allowances I could claim, which due to my 'now classed as employment income' punts me out of any personal allowances but I do get to retain my married couples allowance... right? ?

Question 2 - If the above is correct, which seems reasonable to me, then I must be able to claim reasonable and allowable expenses incurred during the execution of my work. This involved lots of driving to meetings at various places, overnight stays in hotels, air/train travel, mobile phone charges, etc., all normal expenses for a self employed person and substantiated with travel records, receipts etc. right?

Question 3 - Does anyone know of any other allowances? Can I claim educational fees etc if directly attributable to my employment ie; on-line courses etc? What about business development? I spent a lot of personal time investigating another business venture which in the end I did not pursue, but in the meantime had prepared lots of design work - drawings, layouts etc. met with property people and business developers, agents etc and also set up a website etc. Can I reclaim all of this even though in the end I did not pursue that business venture?

Question 4 - I would like to make an advance payment in order to limit the hemorrhaging of cash due to interest charges. Can I just send it to their sort code and bank account and send a letter including my case no, reference number or whatever, telling them I've sent a payment? I assume they can't charge me interest on that part of the outstanding balance if it's in their account right?

I would, appreciate any info you could provide but none like 'You were naïve' etc. please. No KIDDING!!