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tazdevil
20th December 2018, 09:29
OK who's been droning over Gatwick (https://news.sky.com/story/chaos-at-gatwick-after-drone-sightings-force-runway-closure-11586557)? And why aren't these things detected and taken down, there appears to be plenty of anti drone technology available.

Jog On
20th December 2018, 09:49
OK who's been droning over Gatwick (https://news.sky.com/story/chaos-at-gatwick-after-drone-sightings-force-runway-closure-11586557)? And why aren't these things detected and taken down, there appears to be plenty of anti drone technology available.

Ex clientco of mine - anti-drone measures are in the pipeline... The challenge is anti-drone technology that doesn't interfere with aircraft and air traffic control.

People will do it and there's not much to stop it. Bit like shining laser pens at pilots coming in to land.

They have people with guns patrolling the airfield with guns to shoot birds

minestrone
20th December 2018, 09:53
I would guess using a drone jammer in an airport might not be the smartest move.

Only a matter of time before one gets maliciously used to bring down a plane.

tazdevil
20th December 2018, 09:58
I would guess using a drone jammer in an airport might not be the smartest move.

Only a matter of time before one gets maliciously used to bring down a plane.

I bet the Israelis have the appropriate technology and as this must be a problem common to all airports it must be possible to deploy a workable solution. I bet the military airports have something that works:spank:

minestrone
20th December 2018, 10:05
Should get a squadron of hunter seeker drones. Teenagers sitting on deck chairs playing fortnite until the siren goes off. Be like 1940 all over again.

Old Greg
20th December 2018, 10:10
OK who's been droning over Gatwick (https://news.sky.com/story/chaos-at-gatwick-after-drone-sightings-force-runway-closure-11586557)? And why aren't these things detected and taken down, there appears to be plenty of anti drone technology available.

It's the secret EUSSR army, war gaming hard Brexit scenarios.

Bean
20th December 2018, 10:16
Should get a squadron of hunter seeker drones. Teenagers sitting on deck chairs playing fortnite until the siren goes off. Be like 1940 all over again.

There’s already drone racing...why not just get some of the best racers (read chasers), with a chaser drone adjusted to deliver an electric current to fry the mischievous drone causing the problem!

Hobosapien
20th December 2018, 10:22
Surely consumer drones use a frequency for remote control that is not interfering with airports or aircraft so just jam that frequency around the airfield border. :smokin

Also, if planes are built to withstand bird strikes then surely a small plastic drone ain't going to do as much damage as a frozen turkey or whatever they use to test such things. :tongue

I therefore feel this is not a technical problem but more of typical governing/management slowness to implement workable solutions in practice. This incident should at least speed that up somewhat. :spank:

Strange that flights were suspended for a while at around 3am but when re-started at around 4am the drones came back, suggesting maliciousness or indeed terrorism. :eek:

BR14
20th December 2018, 10:26
It's the secret EUSSR army, war gaming hard Brexit scenarios.

more fecking thread pollution.

Hobosapien
20th December 2018, 10:31
Update: Situation still ongoing and flights disrupted while runway closed until at least 11am.

Gatwick Airport: Drone sightings cause delays - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-46623754)

Drone seen at 7am, ongoing since 9pm yesterday, so not just some kids or local numpties, too persistent.

Police still not tracked culprit(s) down. Shows a lack of preparedness for such an incident to not be resolved yet, giving others incentive to try similar. :frown

Updated update: Around 10,000 passengers directly affected and other advised not to travel as planes grounded. Those opportunist taxi drivers charging e.g. £600 for a trip from Cardiff to London are going to do well out of the chaos as planes get diverted all over the place and people desperate to get to London for crimbo.

Old Greg
20th December 2018, 10:35
more fecking thread pollution.

A little Christmas gift for you.

Paddy
20th December 2018, 10:41
Update: Situation still ongoing and flights disrupted while runway closed until at least 11am.

Gatwick Airport: Drone sightings cause delays - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-46623754)

Drone seen at 7am, ongoing since 9pm yesterday, so not just some kids or local numpties, too persistent.

Police still not tracked culprit(s) down. Shows a lack of preparedness for such an incident to not be resolved yet, giving others incentive to try similar. :frown

Updated update: Around 10,000 passengers directly affected and other advised not to travel as planes grounded. Those opportunist taxi drivers charging e.g. £600 for a trip from Cardiff to London are going to do well out of the chaos as planes get diverted all over the place and people desperate to get to London for crimbo.


Two out of the three drone scares at Heathrow turned out to be actual police drones. Considering there are already anti- drone drones on the market, I am surprised that airports do not have them.

Eirikur
20th December 2018, 10:41
more fecking thread pollution.

Yep you came on

minestrone
20th December 2018, 10:49
It will be some activist campaign group filled with public school types who want to get their list of grievances on the front of the papers.

Hobosapien
20th December 2018, 11:02
It will be some activist campaign group filled with public school types who want to get their list of grievances on the front of the papers.

Any regional airports struggling due to Gatwick? :devil

110,000 people due to use Gatwick today. That's a lot of disrupted travel plans. Sat around airports for hours on end is soul destroying at the best of times. :frown

BR14
20th December 2018, 11:12
Yep you came on

Piss off you stupid cloggy twat

Eirikur
20th December 2018, 11:13
Piss off you stupid cloggy twat

Stop the thread pollution racist bigot

Troll
20th December 2018, 11:58
Surely consumer drones use a frequency for remote control that is not interfering with airports or aircraft so just jam that frequency around the airfield border. :smokin

Also, if planes are built to withstand bird strikes then surely a small plastic drone ain't going to do as much damage as a frozen turkey or whatever they use to test such things. :tongue

I therefore feel this is not a technical problem but more of typical governing/management slowness to implement workable solutions in practice. This incident should at least speed that up somewhat. :spank:

Strange that flights were suspended for a while at around 3am but when re-started at around 4am the drones came back, suggesting maliciousness or indeed terrorism. :eek:

Depends if they are carrying any package


https://videos.dailymail.co.uk/preview/mol/2018/08/06/3229283084525519804/636x382_MP4_3229283084525519804.mp4

minestrone
20th December 2018, 12:30
Wouldn't happen on Boris Island.

GreenMirror
20th December 2018, 12:54
It will be some activist campaign group filled with public school types who want to get their list of grievances on the front of the papers.

So the IPSE CC then....

Hobosapien
20th December 2018, 12:56
Still no flights anywhere near Gatwick:

Flight Tracker | Flightradar24 | Track Planes In Real-Time (https://www.flightradar24.com/51.21,-0.29/10)


Though there are some grey boxes moving about at the airport when zooming in. Presume these are not UFOs. :eyes

Seems odd that there aren't even any planes on the ground showing up, unlike the absolute pile-on at Heathrow. I guess the yellow planes only appear when the plane is active not just parked up at a terminal.

Something doesn't seem right. Apparently there was bad weather at Gatwick overnight so even industrial/military
grade drones would have struggled to fly. I'm going with decepticons appearing as drones, or more likely the drones were only seen on radar and are phantoms due to bugs in the system. Probably a software upgrade gone wrong. :bang:

NickFitz
20th December 2018, 14:11
Still no flights anywhere near Gatwick:

Flight Tracker | Flightradar24 | Track Planes In Real-Time (https://www.flightradar24.com/51.21,-0.29/10)


Though there are some grey boxes moving about at the airport when zooming in. Presume these are not UFOs. :eyes

Seems odd that there aren't even any planes on the ground showing up, unlike the absolute pile-on at Heathrow. I guess the yellow planes only appear when the plane is active not just parked up at a terminal.

Something doesn't seem right. Apparently there was bad weather at Gatwick overnight so even industrial/military
grade drones would have struggled to fly. I'm going with decepticons appearing as drones, or more likely the drones were only seen on radar and are phantoms due to bugs in the system. Probably a software upgrade gone wrong. :bang:

Flightradar24 depends on people picking up ADS-B transmissions (or similar) and feeding them to the site. If the airport is closed, the planes are going to turn off their transmitters so there won't be any transmissions to pick up: How it works - Flightradar24.com - Live flight tracker! (https://www.flightradar24.com/how-it-works)

The reason you can see loads of planes on the ground at other airports is that they're either powered up ready to depart, or haven't yet powered down after arriving.

The grey boxes are ground vehicles belonging to the airport. They are also fitted with ADS-B so they show up on ATC's screens, making it easier to avoid landing a plane on one of them as it trundles along the runway.

jds 1981
20th December 2018, 14:24
It's skynet, finally become self aware. Rather than try to destroy humanity it just turns out to be a twat.

Old Greg
20th December 2018, 14:34
It's skynet, finally become self aware. Rather than try to destroy humanity it just turns out to be a twat.

Opening salvo.

Hobosapien
20th December 2018, 14:34
Mystery solved. It was some bloke testing out the drone toy he bought his kid for crimbo (got to put in some pre-wrapping play time to make sure no defects found :smokin), got home and wondered what all the fuss is about.

Sorry, won't do it again. :o Drone all wrapped up now. Fuzz still chasing their tails. :moon:

Hobosapien
20th December 2018, 14:51
Flights cancelled until at least 7pm (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-england-sussex-46564814). :eek:

Drone last sighted at around noon.

Estimated two hour long wait to queue for a coffee.

What an absolute shambles.

Just a taster of what to expect post March 2019. :eyes

SeededLoaf
20th December 2018, 16:53
There's a brilliant film idea here, i'm suprised no one else has suggested it!

A plane gets hit by a load of drones causing dual engine failure.

The quick thinking pilot lands on the Thames and everyone survives. Hurrah :happy

vwdan
20th December 2018, 16:59
My theory is that the Police/Government/Military have held off deploying any "special tech", due to not wanting to publicly demonstrate any of our capabilities on what is disruption, not a life threatening attack. Might have to be disclosed in court, too, potentially. Obviously as time goes on, their options become more limited.

Very odd situation, I'll be very very curious as to how it plays out.

I think the Police would have engaged it conventionally with rifles, had they genuinely seen it as a threat initially. I'm guessing everybody feels that's too risky/ineffective to do in a planned way. Though I am surprised that it wasn't seen as a priority to capture one, if not for forensics.




Surely consumer drones use a frequency for remote control that is not interfering with airports or aircraft so just jam that frequency around the airfield border.

The Police and Airports won't just randomly have ECM devices. Counter Terrorism officers may do, Special Forces and some other units definitely do. But, even so, many drones are designed to operate without a direct control link so it'll either return to base, hover or just continue along a defined path.

Also, jamming isn't really that straightforward - you can't just jam a particular frequency like that, it's far more messy and potentially more dangerous the drone. Remember, this is about safe conclusions.


Also, if planes are built to withstand bird strikes then surely a small plastic drone ain't going to do as much damage as a frozen turkey or whatever they use to test such things.

Nope - for one, they not be that small. Two, while aircraft are designed to put up with a strike, and engines specifically tested, it's still something you avoid at all costs. Planes are held off due to birds all the time.

Old Greg
20th December 2018, 17:23
Flights cancelled until at least 7pm (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-england-sussex-46564814). :eek:

Drone last sighted at around noon.

Estimated two hour long wait to queue for a coffee.

What an absolute shambles.

Just a taster of what to expect post March 2019. :eyes
Yikes. Any news about the bars?

Dark Black
20th December 2018, 17:25
Army called in amid Gatwick disruption - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-england-sussex-46564814)

GJABS
20th December 2018, 17:35
I am minded to get airborne, and give the drone a bash with my wingtips!

Like spitfires used to do with V1 doodlebugs.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DV7Lo7NWAAAFsXy.jpg

vwdan
20th December 2018, 17:40
I am minded to get airborne, and give the drone a bash with my wingtips!

Like spitfires used to do with V1 doodlebugs.


Would a Jabiru be heavy enough to affect a drone? ;)

Old Greg
20th December 2018, 17:42
I am minded to get airborne, and give the drone a bash with my wingtips!

Like spitfires used to do with V1 doodlebugs.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DV7Lo7NWAAAFsXy.jpg

I'll have shauny on standby with the in-flight spag bol.

GJABS
20th December 2018, 18:10
Would a Jabiru be heavy enough to affect a drone? ;)

What I may lack in weight I make up with technique ;)

And my propeller is a good drone-shredding device..

Hobosapien
20th December 2018, 18:36
Yikes. Any news about the bars?

Yep, someone's going to be behind them soon. :tongue


News update: No new drone sighting since noon. :nerd

vetran
20th December 2018, 21:48
unfortunately I was right in the middle with this Mrs V & I were taking mini V away. Told the flight was cancelled at 6am (we were up at 2am).

we went to winter wonderland instead.

mudskipper
20th December 2018, 21:56
unfortunately I was right in the middle with this Mrs V & I were taking mini V away. Told the flight was cancelled at 6am (we were up at 2am).

we went to winter wonderland instead.

Bummer.

vetran
20th December 2018, 22:03
Bummer.


Ta!

meridian
21st December 2018, 07:55
unfortunately I was right in the middle with this Mrs V & I were taking mini V away. Told the flight was cancelled at 6am (we were up at 2am).

we went to winter wonderland instead.

That’s a narrow escape then, I might have bumped into you at Gatwick.

Currently queuing at Stansted, Ryanair have diverted all Gatwick departures from here today.

BR14
21st December 2018, 09:56
That’s a narrow escape then, I might have bumped into you at Gatwick.

Currently queuing at Stansted, Ryanair have diverted all Gatwick departures from here today.

Are you really COTBAC ?

vwdan
21st December 2018, 09:58
What I may lack in weight I make up with technique ;)

And my propeller is a good drone-shredding device..

Hehe! I'm only messin' - I like the cost appeal of microlights, they're just too restrictive for me.

NotAllThere
21st December 2018, 10:07
Estimated two hour long wait to queue for a coffee.:eek Oh the horror!


Like spitfires used to do with V1 doodlebugs.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DV7Lo7NWAAAFsXy.jpgThere's a SciFi book (in two volumes) that references that. Blackout and All Clear by Connie Willis. Excellent time travel story set during WW2.

GJABS
21st December 2018, 10:12
Hehe! I'm only messin' - I like the cost appeal of microlights, they're just too restrictive for me.

Restrictive? Maybe in some respects. But in mine I've flown to Cornwall, Dundee, Normandy, up to 10,000 feet, and landed everywhere from farm strips to Southampton airport. Cruises at 80 knots too (95 mph).
Great fun..

psychocandy
21st December 2018, 10:13
Some woman on BBC website saying they're trip to lapland was ruined and they couldn't get any money back because they're flight was never cancelled completely.

I can see how, yes, sadly a weekend away is completely ****ed by a 24 hour delay, but shes saying "insurance is difficult as Finnair did not officially cancel the flight".

Surely if you're trip is massively ****ed because of this you can claim on insurance? If you're going for say, 4 days and you're outward flight is delayed by, say, 3 days then surely this is, in effect, cancellation? (Sure my insurance allows me to treat as cancelation after certain delay?)

Then again, you never know these days whether its just the person tried to save a few quid and didn't bother with insurance.

meridian
21st December 2018, 10:31
Are you really COTBAC ?

I wouldn’t normally, in my opinion of scuminess they’re only just above British Airways.

The flight schedule was ideal this time though. Until I had to drive to Stansted.

vwdan
21st December 2018, 11:59
Restrictive? Maybe in some respects. But in mine I've flown to Cornwall, Dundee, Normandy, up to 10,000 feet, and landed everywhere from farm strips to Southampton airport. Cruises at 80 knots too (95 mph).
Great fun..

Yeah, but I don't think the little one is gonna be happy sitting on the wing :D (Well, they might be actually). I can absolutely see the appeal but even in a Warrior you can't get 4 adults in and fuel

Uncle Albert
21st December 2018, 13:50
Some woman on BBC website saying they're trip to lapland was ruined and they couldn't get any money back because they're flight was never cancelled completely.

I can see how, yes, sadly a weekend away is completely ****ed by a 24 hour delay, but shes saying "insurance is difficult as Finnair did not officially cancel the flight".

Surely if you're trip is massively ****ed because of this you can claim on insurance? If you're going for say, 4 days and you're outward flight is delayed by, say, 3 days then surely this is, in effect, cancellation? (Sure my insurance allows me to treat as cancelation after certain delay?)

Then again, you never know these days whether its just the person tried to save a few quid and didn't bother with insurance.

If they took the cheap insurance option they probably aren't covered.

Gatwick Airport drone chaos: Can I get compensation? - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46632302)


It is important to note that extra compensation, which is normally paid under EU rules if the delay is the fault of the airline, will not be paid in this case, as the closure of Gatwick was beyond the airlines' control.

washed up contractor
21st December 2018, 14:21
There quite a lot of bullshit doing the rounds on this incident. I fly RC scale Helicopters which are not drones but the technology is the same.

We fly on 2.4ghz with transmitters and receivers that frequency 'hop' to reject unwanted interference. That doesnt mean their frequency cannot be jammed. All one needs do is turn on a more powerful transmitter in the same frequency band. Yes, the 2.4ghz frequency is quite big but the frequency used for RC is quite narrow. There are other Users of the frequency such as wifi and some older mobile phones.

Drones can vary in size from tiny indoor ones to those about the diameter of a bin lid. Note that even these are not a solid disc and normally have a central tray to carry electronics, battery and small camera. The irony is the larger the drone, the more likely it being lightweight for its size as carbon fibre would likely be used in its construction so size doesnt immediately relate to a far heavier drone.

Maximum flight time is around 45 minutes tops. That gives you a theoretical maximum outward and return duration of about 20 minutes since one way will likely be wind assisted with the other against the wind, ergo uses more power in one leg of the flight.

Drone weight, air temperature and wind speed will all impact flight time. It is also quite tiring flying continuously for 10 - 15 minutes although GPS way point flight lessens this, it doesnt remove it altogether.

The drone will need to land frequently and new batteries fitted. Even recharging takes time and a power source. Charging from a car battery will not really cut it.

Even a large drone, the diameter of a bin lid would not bring down an airliner. It took a flock of geese and multiple strikes to force the plane in the US to ditch in the New York river. Even so, the pilot made a controlled landing.

Yes, a drone could bring down a cessna sized plane. No, a responsible model or drone flyer isnt behind this.

I find it incredible the lack of action taken in this incident, a major UK airport was effectively closed for 2+ days. The drone was supposedly sighted over 50 time yet they still could trace its landing point? Strange how Transport Secretary Grayling has only just surfaced in all the commotion.

vwdan
21st December 2018, 15:10
Even a large drone, the diameter of a bin lid would not bring down an airliner. It took a flock of geese and multiple strikes to force the plane in the US to ditch in the New York river. Even so, the pilot made a controlled landing.
.

This is a very, very dangerous and somewhat irresponsible way of thinking. Is a single drone likely to take down an airliner - no, probably not. Could it - absolutely. A drone ingested into an engine is highly likely to take out the engine, even if temporarily - in fact, almost certainly so.

Considering things like ETOPS, many many airlines are now twin engine, even long haul stuff.

Taking that into account, doing something like that at a critical moment of flight, close to the ground, is seriously dangerous. You're removing the aircraft's redundancy and upsetting the flight at the worst moment - are the pilots likely to keep it under control and sort it? Yes, one would absolutely hope so. Is it guaranteed - most definitely not. Could you be looking at a new engine? Probably. Remember you're talking speeds of >150mph

Now that's just assuming engines - there isn't much in the sky quite like a big drone, but some of the damage that appears to have been caused by them is fairly immense. So when you're talking a coordinated attack, with more than one drone, the risk for serious injury and death absolutely exists. I also feel the difference between an unknown actor acting deliberately vs a dumb bird.



although GPS way point flight lessens this, it doesnt remove it altogether.


Uhm, many drones are capable of completely autonomous flight.



We fly on 2.4ghz with transmitters and receivers that frequency 'hop' to reject unwanted interference.


Many drones also use 5.8GhZ.



All one needs do is turn on a more powerful transmitter in the same frequency band. Yes, the 2.4ghz frequency is quite big but the frequency used for RC is quite narrow. There are other Users of the frequency such as wifi and some older mobile phones.


Ah, I love the internet where everything sounds so easy. Firstly, that's generally illegal and for that reason - the equipment to do isn't routinely employed or equipped. Secondly, "there are other users" is about the biggest understatement in the world - the 2.4ghz band is used by a huuuuuge range of devices as it's one of the most popular ISM bands. It'd probably be easier to go and list the things that aren't, because if it's wireless and you don't need a license then chances are it's on ISM. You don't get to just jam a certain frequency range to that kind of accuracy - you ARE going to cause interference, especially when you're going to need to try and deploy it some way away from the drone.


I'm also not convinced about this bit "but the frequency used for RC is quite narrow", which just doesn't sound quite right.

MarillionFan
21st December 2018, 15:15
Some woman on BBC website saying they're trip to lapland was ruined and they couldn't get any money back because they're flight was never cancelled completely.

I can see how, yes, sadly a weekend away is completely ****ed by a 24 hour delay, but shes saying "insurance is difficult as Finnair did not officially cancel the flight".

Surely if you're trip is massively ****ed because of this you can claim on insurance? If you're going for say, 4 days and you're outward flight is delayed by, say, 3 days then surely this is, in effect, cancellation? (Sure my insurance allows me to treat as cancelation after certain delay?)

Then again, you never know these days whether its just the person tried to save a few quid and didn't bother with insurance.

Find the ****er who did and sue them.

Hobosapien
21st December 2018, 15:50
:eek Oh the horror!

I included that as an insight into what it must have been like for those poor sods stuck in the airport where even basic services were unable to cope.

I presume once through security you're stuck hoping for the flight to go ahead and can't simply just walk back out and come back later without lots of faff and likely lengthy queues.

Shockingly bad response by the authorities. They could easily have disabled the drone by twatting it with a police helicopter skid or staying out of reach up above it and dropping a net over it. Drones can't out fly a helicopter!

Paddy
21st December 2018, 17:13
Find the ****er who did and sue them.

It seems that it is a local anti Gatwick activist.

NickFitz
21st December 2018, 17:36
It seems that it is a local anti Gatwick activist.

Probably one of those idiots that buys a house twenty yards from the end of the runway, then starts complaining about the noise :eyes

Acme Thunderer
21st December 2018, 17:43
Even a large drone, the diameter of a bin lid would not bring down an airliner. It took a flock of geese and multiple strikes to force the plane in the US to ditch in the New York river. Even so, the pilot made a controlled landing.

.

A drone isn't made of muscle, skin and bone which are fairly easy for an aircraft engine to survive ingesting. A Drone will have carbon fibre, some metal and a battery. All of which are far worse for an engine to ingest. It is also not the engine failure that would be the problem - twin engine aircraft are designed to continue to fly with an engine failure at takeoff. It is how the engine fails. Even though the engine nacelle is designed to stop bits coming out, sometimes they don't. Broken fan blade(s) through the fuselage anyone?

Hobosapien
21st December 2018, 17:44
Whoever it is.... dun dun dun ..... he's back.

Gatwick flights suspended again after suspected drone sighting - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-46654797)

Got to admire their mentalness and balls. Hope the British Army slot the bastard. :devil

Edit: :bang: Swear filter's failed. :bang:

northernladyuk
21st December 2018, 20:25
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Du4yKcnX4AAmWcd.jpg

BR14
21st December 2018, 20:27
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Du4yKcnX4AAmWcd.jpg

Do Lucasfilm know about 'the drone wars'? :smokin

northernladyuk
21st December 2018, 20:36
Do Lucasfilm know about 'the drone wars'? :smokin

It's been parody, so protected.

BR14
21st December 2018, 20:38
It's been parody, so protected.

Whatever, - made Me chuckle , - ta muchly :smokin

NickFitz
21st December 2018, 20:47
Interesting Twitter thread from a chap who knows his drones, and theorises that the attackers could be using up to 48 self-built drones, moving around between launches in a wide area (he includes maps). Archived so you don't have put up with Twitter's website: Thread by @brad3d: "Retail drones with remote telemetry can’t fly near airports, they are locked out in software. DJI drones can’t get within 2.5km of […]" #GatwickAirport #GatwickDrones #drones #BadGuys (https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1075748568382619648.html)

greenlake
21st December 2018, 21:15
Police release first picture of Gatwick drone suspect

http://i.imgur.com/kwVoBKd.jpg

:rollin:

NickFitz
22nd December 2018, 02:02
BUSTED: Two arrested in drone disruption at Gatwick - Sussex Police (https://news.sussex.police.uk/news/two-arrested-in-drone-disruption-at-gatwick-343013) :bluelight

WTFH
22nd December 2018, 09:00
Possibly flying in to LGW tonight. BA have put on extra planes so ours should be OK. Row 1, as ever.

Hobosapien
22nd December 2018, 09:34
BUSTED: Two arrested in drone disruption at Gatwick - Sussex Police (https://news.sussex.police.uk/news/two-arrested-in-drone-disruption-at-gatwick-343013) :bluelight

BBC reports it was a man and a woman.

Gatwick drones: Two arrested over flight disruption - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-46657505)

If not the perps, I wonder what else they may have been doing at 10pm in an isolated area. :eyes

If it was them then likely ecowarriors or someone with a real grudge against the airport. We'll see if more details are released to confirm all over or if perps still at large.

Mordac
22nd December 2018, 14:10
Possibly flying in to LGW tonight. BA have put on extra planes so ours should be OK. Row 1, as ever.

If they cancel the flight, you could always get a drone, they're still flying...

Snarf
22nd December 2018, 15:45
Surely consumer drones use a frequency for remote control that is not interfering with airports or aircraft so just jam that frequency around the airfield border. :smokin

Also, if planes are built to withstand bird strikes then surely a small plastic drone ain't going to do as much damage as a frozen turkey or whatever they use to test such things. :tongue

I therefore feel this is not a technical problem but more of typical governing/management slowness to implement workable solutions in practice. This incident should at least speed that up somewhat. :spank:

Strange that flights were suspended for a while at around 3am but when re-started at around 4am the drones came back, suggesting maliciousness or indeed terrorism. :eek:

Birds don't have lithium batteries up their butts...

Also theres a difference between surviving a bird strike and landing safely and surviving a bird strike and not having a couple hundred k of damage...

NickFitz
22nd December 2018, 17:58
Reports now that the two people arrested were moving around the area on bicycles. They had a couple of drones which could be quickly broken down and stored in panniers or some such; they were caught when somebody spotted them doing just that.

Best of all: they'd often been in plain view of police/security while doing their thing, but they wore wore hi-vis jackets. And as we all know, wearing a hi-vis jacket automatically makes people assume you must be there on some kind of official business, so they don't notice you :laugh

I don't know if this info is correct, but the Twitter source is a chap who provides informed comment to news organisations on aviation security matters, so he probably has good sources :D

JULIANBRAY on Twitter: "#gatwick #drones arrested person wearing hi- viz vest and cycle helmet. Motorist says two drones one 4 ft wide, had flashing lights. Using a pushbike perp. constantly moved, used back streets footway paths and was 'in plain sight' of security forces most of the time says source.… https://t.co/uYg0Zf2aUm" (https://twitter.com/aviationcomment/status/1076322863471386624)

minestrone
22nd December 2018, 20:39
Gatwick drone: Identities of arrested couple revealed (https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/12/22/gatwick-drone-identities-arrested-couple-revealed/?WT.mc_id=tmg_share_tw)

WTF!

She looks like the type of wife who makes him sit in silence when strictly is on.

This can't be right.

Lockhouse
23rd December 2018, 08:09
Have they arrested the right people? He's ex-army, is he taking one for the team as a ploy?

Hobosapien
23rd December 2018, 10:17
Conflicting reports. One via twitter saying perps caught red handed at scene.

Others saying suspects arrested at home after posting drone review two years ago. Guy was at work when incident was ongoing.

Hope it's the former as the latter smells fishy. More precisely red herring.

minestrone
23rd December 2018, 11:36
Released without charge, unlucky feckers. :laugh

I think they are looking for this chap now...

https://i.postimg.cc/sXj27G1R/189533-v3.jpg

Old Greg
23rd December 2018, 12:05
Conflicting reports. One via twitter saying perps caught red handed at scene.

Others saying suspects arrested at home after posting drone review two years ago. Guy was at work when incident was ongoing.

Hope it's the former as the latter smells fishy. More precisely red herring.

It's not really a report if it's on twatter.

Hobosapien
23rd December 2018, 13:03
It's not really a report if it's on twatter.

NickFitz reported it on here (https://www.contractoruk.com/forums/general/130827-gatwick-chaos-7.html#post2610206). :tongue


Reading elsewhere, appears the perp buzzed the tower allowing the authorities to get a good look at the make/model of drone being used and it's a rare one. :facepalm:

Hope that hubris is what allows them to be caught seeing as it looks like they weren't in fact caught in the act (poor showing NickFitz not getting corroborated evidence before posting on here :spank:).

Shame the army getting involved looks to have been too late to use their fancy kit to trace the remote control signal back to source. So they'll now have to question all those that own the aforementioned rare drone to eliminate them from the enquiries.

They're offering £50k reward for information. One of my neighbours is a drone maniac (probably modern version of peeping tom, easier to get a look into women's bedrooms than climbing a tree) so I may grass him up just in case he's been to London recently. Got to be in it to win it. :smokin

NickFitz
23rd December 2018, 15:26
It's not really a report if it's on twatter.

Somebody should tell the President of the United States that :rolleyes:

OwlHoot
23rd December 2018, 17:15
Shame the army getting involved looks to have been too late to use their fancy kit to trace the remote control signal back to source. So they'll now have to question all those that own the aforementioned rare drone to eliminate them from the enquiries. ...

I thought there was a branch of GCHQ devoted to tracking and locating the source of unauthorised or anomalous radio signals, what used to be MI8 during WW2 ?!

GhostofTarbera
23rd December 2018, 17:43
Luckily no one reported there names

And police checked some basic facts and let them go

Or not

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181223/48fdd3c275dca586c69f186c48561bec.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181223/33524125e00f739d277e166c5e208660.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181223/bd6685babdbea053e0101e0b5d44a784.jpg


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minestrone
23rd December 2018, 17:56
"always a possibility that there may not have been any genuine drone activity in the first place"

:rollin:

Oh my sides

minestrone
23rd December 2018, 18:57
Luckily no one reported there names

And police checked some basic facts and let them go

Or not

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181223/48fdd3c275dca586c69f186c48561bec.jpg



The Daily Mail are in "substantial damages" territory with that front page.

They will try to claim they are calling the culprits morons but as it could be one person behind it then then their use of morons plural can only really mean they are calling them morons. And being arrested doesn't mean you are accused.

I'm going with 250k.

AtW
23rd December 2018, 19:04
They (Daily Fail) will get away with it since they only asked a question, not stating fact...

Lawyers will make 250k though...

minestrone
23rd December 2018, 19:09
They (Daily Fail) will get away with it since they only asked a question, not stating fact...

Lawyers will make 250k though...


McAlpine v Bercow - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McAlpine_v_Bercow)

Old Greg
23rd December 2018, 19:48
The Daily Mail are in "substantial damages" territory with that front page.

They will try to claim they are calling the culprits morons but as it could be one person behind it then then their use of morons plural can only really mean they are calling them morons. And being arrested doesn't mean you are accused.

I'm going with 250k.

They seem to get away with labelling honest citizens as Enemies of the People.

minestrone
23rd December 2018, 19:56
They seem to get away with labelling honest citizens as Enemies of the People.

They were :laugh

Old Greg
23rd December 2018, 21:38
They were :laugh

In the opinion of our resident ne'er-do-well.

BR14
23rd December 2018, 21:56
In the opinion of our resident ne'er-do-well.

Wasn't me! - i wasn't there. nobody saw me. you can't prove anything :smokin

minestrone
23rd December 2018, 22:12
In the opinion of our resident ne'er-do-well.

That's the nicest thing anyone on this forum has said about me in months.

minestrone
23rd December 2018, 22:46
They are really backtracking now on this being drones. :laugh

Monkey-man of Delhi - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monkey-man_of_Delhi)

xoggoth
24th December 2018, 08:27
Hmmmm. I'm a member of the local police search team and just got an email requesting my presence to "Help Police and other agencies with Drone activities at Gatwick Airport" Dunno, feeling knackered as usual.

Updaticus
Site says "Sorry, registrations are no longer available for Gatwick Drone Actvity". Email went out at 9.45 last night when I was watching Father Brown, so obviously been a big rush. So I won't be spending today poking about in bushes looking for whatever.

They'll regret not having the benefit of xoggoth's superb sleuthing activities.

Old Greg
24th December 2018, 08:31
They are really backtracking now on this being drones. :laugh

Monkey-man of Delhi - Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monkey-man_of_Delhi)

It would be funny if it was mass hysteria. A well deserved national humiliation to round off the year.

original PM
24th December 2018, 08:51
Strange really - seems there was no drone at all.

Managed to ground a few flights for a few days - probably gave them some time for extra security 'checks'

Or maybe there is nothing in that at all.

Hobosapien
24th December 2018, 09:41
WTF!

Gatwick: suspects exonerated as confusion deepens over drone attack | UK news | The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/dec/23/gatwick-drone-chaos-arrested-couple-released-without-charge)


Confusion deepened as a senior police officer in the case said it was “always a possibility that there may not have been any genuine drone activity in the first place”. DCS Jason Tingley added that although the damaged drone was a significant line of inquiry, wet weather could have washed away evidence. He also noted that there were no pictures or video of the drone incursions into the airspace around Gatwick . He said there was “no available footage and [officers] are relying on witness accounts”.

WTAF!

They didn't get eyes on before pulling the plug? Who are these morons, they should be the ones on the front pages of the gutter press.


"Sir we have reports of a drone inside the perimeter fence"
"Who's reporting it?"
"Some guy walking his dog"
"So not even a plane spotter that may know how to tell the difference between a drone, and you know, the various types of aircraft coming into this airport?"
"Nope just some old duffer"
"Alright better close the place down, can't take any risk"
"Shouldn't we get visual confirmation from airport security"
"Nope, public witness accounts can be relied upon, hit the panic button"

It can't be true. I'm embarrassed for them.

tazdevil
24th December 2018, 09:51
The age of moron management or the 'I can't possibly take responsibility and think outside the box'. Captain Mainwaring would be proud of the modern management duffers who talk the game but can't do:rolleyes:

WTFH
24th December 2018, 11:33
Possibly flying in to LGW tonight. BA have put on extra planes so ours should be OK. Row 1, as ever.

Flight was delayed 30 mins due to late baggage delivering to the plane on the outbound sector.
Our flight was slow due to 125mph headwinds.
Them, because the airport is so full of planes, we were put on a remote stand near the North Terminal, and had to be bussed all the way to the South. Passport Control was empty, so no delays there.

In total, we were maybe an hour later home than expected.

minestrone
24th December 2018, 14:07
Mind you, who hasn't spent days chasing down a non existent bug as some user "saw something that didn't look quite right"

Paddy
24th December 2018, 16:07
Strange really - seems there was no drone at all.

Managed to ground a few flights for a few days - probably gave them some time for extra security 'checks'

Or maybe there is nothing in that at all.

Gatwick 'no drone' police comment 'miscommunicated' - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-46670714)


Gatwick 'no drone' police comment 'miscommunicated'


I too don't think there were any drones. Authorities will be too embarrassed to admit it

NickFitz
24th December 2018, 16:29
WTF!

Gatwick: suspects exonerated as confusion deepens over drone attack | UK news | The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/dec/23/gatwick-drone-chaos-arrested-couple-released-without-charge)



WTAF!

They didn't get eyes on before pulling the plug? Who are these morons, they should be the ones on the front pages of the gutter press.


"Sir we have reports of a drone inside the perimeter fence"
"Who's reporting it?"
"Some guy walking his dog"
"So not even a plane spotter that may know how to tell the difference between a drone, and you know, the various types of aircraft coming into this airport?"
"Nope just some old duffer"
"Alright better close the place down, can't take any risk"
"Shouldn't we get visual confirmation from airport security"
"Nope, public witness accounts can be relied upon, hit the panic button"

It can't be true. I'm embarrassed for them.

"Why has that 737 crashed on Pease Pottage?"

"Dunno, there wasn't anything untoward out there. Well, some bloke walking his dog said he saw a large drone buzzing the runway, but he doesn't even have a subscription to Flight International, so what would he know? We told him to feck off."

"Sensible. Now, better call the AAIB I suppose. Anybody got their number?"

minestrone
24th December 2018, 19:53
It would be funny if it was mass hysteria. A well deserved national humiliation to round off the year.

I'm not sure what behaviour is more neurotic, the "yes, I see it too" of the drone witnesses, or the "I need everyone around me to fail" of the contemporary progressives.

Paddy
25th December 2018, 11:00
And now, from several drones buzzing the runway it becomes "when drones were sighted near the runway." And "UK now has systems to combat drones"

UK now has systems to combat drones - Ben Wallace - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-46676762)

Paddy
29th December 2018, 13:33
Two out of the three drone scares at Heathrow turned out to be actual police drones. Considering there are already anti- drone drones on the market, I am surprised that airports do not have them.


And today...


Gatwick drone sightings may have been of police equipment, chief constable admits

Gatwick drone sightings may have been of police equipment, chief constable admits (https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/gatwick-drone-sightings-may-have-been-of-police-equipment-chief-constable-admits/ar-BBRyLdO?ocid=spartanntp)

minestrone
29th December 2018, 16:02
A 12 year old after a Christmas lecture could tell you how to evade these "drone systems".

And I refuse to believe that the radar in an airport could not detect a drone. Maybe the operator software would not have displayed it but...

Acme Thunderer
29th December 2018, 16:34
A 12 year old after a Christmas lecture could tell you how to evade these "drone systems".

And I refuse to believe that the radar in an airport could not detect a drone. Maybe the operator software would not have displayed it but...

A primary surveillance radar is highly unlikely to detect a drone. It just isn't designed to do that. It would only sweep past the drone every 4 seconds or so plus the size of the return would be minuscule

The secondary surveillance radar, which ATC do their work from, certainly wouldn't see it as the drone won't have a transponder

minestrone
29th December 2018, 16:54
A primary surveillance radar is highly unlikely to detect a drone. It just isn't designed to do that. It would only sweep past the drone every 4 seconds or so plus the size of the return would be minuscule

The secondary surveillance radar, which ATC do their work from, certainly wouldn't see it as the drone won't have a transponder

Radar is not deigned to detect flying things in the sky.

That is me told.

GreenMirror
29th December 2018, 17:02
Radar is not deigned to detect flying things in the sky.

That is me told.

Its a question of size. The smallest thing I can think of is WTFH's brain Do you think radar could detect that?

minestrone
29th December 2018, 17:11
Its a question of size. The smallest thing I can think of is WTFH's brain Do you think radar could detect that?

WTFH's brain is very big, Cojak's brain is very big, NAT's brain is very big, Admin's brain is very big.


*winks Morse code at keyboard*

greenlake
29th December 2018, 17:52
WTFH's brain is very big, Cojak's brain is very big, NAT's brain is very big, Admin's brain is very big.

:rollin: :rollin: :rollin: :rollin:

http://i.imgur.com/lhCwrPF.jpg

mudskipper
29th December 2018, 17:56
WTFH's brain is very big, Cojak's brain is very big, NAT's brain is very big, Admin's brain is very big.


Size isn't important - it's what you do with it. ;)

WTFH
30th December 2018, 14:03
Size isn't important - it's what you do with it. ;)

Size is also relative, not only to others, but also to where/how it’s used.
A cocktail sausage fits nicely in a bit of puff pastry, but wouldn’t be noticed in the channel tunnel

Hobosapien
31st December 2018, 10:44
New primary suspect: Police drone :facepalm:

Gatwick drones: Sussex Police 'sorry' for arrested couple - BBC News (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-46709353)


He admitted police drones launched to investigate could have caused "some level of confusion"


The disruption was not caused by police drones, launched in response and only when the airport was closed.


However, he said he was "absolutely certain that there was a drone flying throughout the period that the airport was closed".

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

Looks like the original perp has gotten clean away amid confusion of public spotting police drones in the area.

Tinfoil hat theory: Saboteurs not happy with imminent sale of airport. :eyes

GhostofTarbera
31st December 2018, 12:30
Bridges are now closing because of drones


Severn Bridge shuts after drone flown from the top - BBC News (https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/uk-england-bristol-46720717)


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GreenMirror
31st December 2018, 12:39
More chance of catching the Gatwick drone operators than catching the CUK malware operators.

mudskipper
31st December 2018, 12:52
Bridges are now closing because of drones


Severn Bridge shuts after drone flown from the top - BBC News (https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/uk-england-bristol-46720717)


Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=79863)

TBF it sound like it shut because someone climbed up it to fly a drone, rather than because there was a drone.

GreenMirror
21st February 2019, 12:04
Thank goodness this can only happen in the UK,. No way would this ever happen in the EU. No Sir.

WTFH
21st February 2019, 12:09
So they've narrowed down who did it:
Gatwick Airport drone attack 'was an inside job' | Metro News (https://metro.co.uk/2019/02/21/gatwick-airport-drone-attack-inside-job-8693544/)

GreenMirror
21st February 2019, 12:13
So they've narrowed down who did it:
Gatwick Airport drone attack 'was an inside job' | Metro News (https://metro.co.uk/2019/02/21/gatwick-airport-drone-attack-inside-job-8693544/)

Metro? Sister paper of the fail? I did read similar in the fail this morning - I assumed it was just the keystone cops.

Now about Dublin.....