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contractor79
18th March 2009, 17:43
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1162957/Asian-postmaster-takes-immigration-stand-banning-customers-speak-English.html

"An Asian postmaster has provoked the ire of race equality campaigners by banning customers from his branch who cannot speak English.
Deva Kumarasiri claims all immigrants in Britain should learn the language so they can communicate properly with others here and embrace British culture.
'If you come to Britain you have got to speak English,' said the father-of-two, who moved here himself 18 years ago."

BrilloPad
18th March 2009, 17:47
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1162957/Asian-postmaster-takes-immigration-stand-banning-customers-speak-English.html

"An Asian postmaster has provoked the ire of race equality campaigners by banning customers from his branch who cannot speak English.
Deva Kumarasiri claims all immigrants in Britain should learn the language so they can communicate properly with others here and embrace British culture.
'If you come to Britain you have got to speak English,' said the father-of-two, who moved here himself 18 years ago."

I wonder how many are banned?

Cyberman
18th March 2009, 17:49
Nobody should get British citizenship if they cannot speak the language. Unfortunately, any foreign alien with the slightest leaning towards voting Labour is automatically welcomed and gets better benefits than any indigenous Tory ever would. :laugh

PRC1964
18th March 2009, 18:00
Nobody should get British citizenship if they cannot speak the language. Unfortunately, any foreign alien with the slightest leaning towards voting Labour is automatically welcomed and gets better benefits than any indigenous Tory ever would. :laugh

So a Welsh speaker should not be allowed to be British?

original PM
18th March 2009, 18:07
So a Welsh speaker should not be allowed to be British?

Well no they are Welsh!

This does flag a possible issue for the gentleman in the original post.

As it does not take into account the possibiity of tourists in the country.

However what I think Mr Kumarasiri is trying to get across is that he is sick and tired of paying taxes to a government who let all and sundry into the country allow them citizenship and then watch them sit around refusing to integrate into the culture.

Probably

denver2k
18th March 2009, 18:08
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1162957/Asian-postmaster-takes-immigration-stand-banning-customers-speak-English.html

"An Asian postmaster has provoked the ire of race equality campaigners by banning customers from his branch who cannot speak English.
Deva Kumarasiri claims all immigrants in Britain should learn the language so they can communicate properly with others here and embrace British culture.
'If you come to Britain you have got to speak English,' said the father-of-two, who moved here himself 18 years ago."

What if the person only speaks Gaelic or Welsh ??

He can impose these restrictions if the person is applying for job in his postoffice BUT I cant see any reason why someone is not allowed to use the services if he/she cant speak English.

Non English speaking person may be a visitor or a contractor from some other country (same as other Brits go to other countries knowing nothing about language).


Ohh sorry i just realized that its "Daily Mail".....:rollin:

BrilloPad
18th March 2009, 18:16
What if the person only speaks Gaelic or Welsh ??


How many are there like that?

Mrs BP's brother-out-law says that those who can only speak Welsh are backward retards : but then he is Welsh.

Churchill
18th March 2009, 18:24
Well no they are Welsh!

This does flag a possible issue for the gentleman in the original post.

As it does not take into account the possibiity of tourists in the country.

However what I think Mr Kumarasiri is trying to get across is that he is sick and tired of paying taxes to a government who let all and sundry into the country allow them citizenship and then watch them sit around refusing to integrate into the culture.

Probably

Do you know the difference between "British" and English/Scots/Welsh & Northern Irish?

minestrone
18th March 2009, 18:30
Do you know the difference between "British" and English/Scots/Welsh & Northern Irish?

:spel Scottish

OwlHoot
18th March 2009, 20:26
How many are there like that?

Mrs BP's brother-out-law says that those who can only speak Welsh are backward retards : but then he is Welsh.

Either backward retards or as old as Methusaleh (sp?) - The last Welsh-only speakers probably died in the 1880s, and ditto for Gaelic, Cornish, Manx, etc (probably even earlier than that).

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 09:36
What about customers whose language is British Sign Language? Or Irish Sign Language? Or Makaton?

Or customers who do not speak English but who are not immigrants - perhaps on a lovely holiday to this fair land?

I think we need to understand the entire critieria.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 09:40
Either backward retards or as old as Methusaleh (sp?) - The last Welsh-only speakers probably died in the 1880s, and ditto for Gaelic, Cornish, Manx, etc (probably even earlier than that).

Not quite, according to wikipedia:

'Historically, large numbers of Welsh people spoke only Welsh, but monoglot Welsh speakers are now virtually non-existent, at least above school age. Almost without exception, Welsh speakers in Wales also speak English (or Spanish in Chubut Province, Argentina, see Welsh settlement in Argentina).'

Pickle2
19th March 2009, 09:43
Dont forget them from the Pitcairn Islands. They speak funny too, we should revoke their britishness! :rolleyes:

PM-Junkie
19th March 2009, 09:50
In looking at the non-DailyMail presentations of this story, it transpires that the guy is hacked off with people who live here, regularly use his shop, and refuse to learn the language.....resulting in big queues while he deals with them, and people waiting in said queues getting annoyed and leaving his shop.

Nothing to do with tourists, nothing to do with the welsh, nothing to do with people who use sign language, but everything to do with not losing customers because of the selfishness of a few.

Seems an entirely sensible move to me.

sasguru
19th March 2009, 09:50
I understand this man. His real aim was to ban Scousers as

1. They can't speak English
2. They are thieving gits.

I think the Daily Mail misunderstood as usual.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 09:51
In looking at the non-DailyMail presentations of this story

Stop spoiling our fun.

Mich the Tester
19th March 2009, 09:52
If it’s his own business it’s up to him. Personally I think that if someone were to enter my (imaginary) shop carrying money and wanting to buy something, I couldn’t care less if he speaks Gobbledegookistani; he’s paying so I’ll sell him something.

Pickle2
19th March 2009, 09:56
In looking at the non-DailyMail presentations of this story, it transpires that the guy is hacked off with people who live here, regularly use his shop, and refuse to learn the language.....resulting in big queues while he deals with them, and people waiting in said queues getting annoyed and leaving his shop.

Nothing to do with tourists, nothing to do with the welsh, nothing to do with people who use sign language, but everything to do with not losing customers because of the selfishness of a few.

Seems an entirely sensible move to me.

Us Brits are funny arent we? We live all over the world as expats: middle east, south east asia, spain, france, south america, many without knowing a word of the lingo.

Live here on the same terms? Burn 'em!

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 09:56
If it’s his own business it’s up to him. Personally I think that if someone were to enter my (imaginary) shop carrying money and wanting to buy something, I couldn’t care less if he speaks Gobbledegookistani; he’s paying so I’ll sell him something.

Presumably, according to the logic of the free market, he could impose a flat rate or percentage surcharge on customers according to the costs associated with managing their barriers to communication. But I bet the political correctness Nazis would put a stop to it

PM-Junkie
19th March 2009, 09:58
Us Brits are funny arent we? We live all over the world as expats: middle east, south east asia, spain, france, south america, many without knowing a word of the lingo.

Live here on the same terms? Burn 'em!
...and if someone in one of those countries took the same position with a brit, it would be equally sensible, for the same reasons.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 10:00
...and if someone in one of those countries took the same position with a brit, it would be equally sensible, for the same reasons.

Except they'd get punched in the face because we'd have maxed out on the cheap booze.

Pickle2
19th March 2009, 10:04
...and if someone in one of those countries took the same position with a brit, it would be equally sensible, for the same reasons.

Fair enough. Im just pointing out that many of the crazed, right wing, pseudo nazi racist morons that read the daily mail and mindlessly cheer this crap on wouldnt think twice about retiring to spain, or taking a high paying tax free job in the middle east, or going to "open a bar" in Thailand etc etc without ever considering needing to learn the language beyond ordering a beer.

I just find it odd how people's value systems are a often a one way street.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 10:08
Fair enough. Im just pointing out that many of the crazed, right wing, pseudo nazi racist morons that read the daily mail and mindlessly cheer this crap on wouldnt think twice about retiring to spain, or taking a high paying tax free job in the middle east, or going to "open a bar" in Thailand etc etc without ever considering needing to learn the language beyond ordering a beer.

'Dos beerios' - works throughout the Mediterranean.

The funny thing is, the Daily Mail does a Spanish print run for the expat community and I bet they're nodding their heads in approval of the story.

FSM with Cheddar
19th March 2009, 10:08
Fair enough. Im just pointing out that many of the crazed, right wing, pseudo nazi racist morons that read the daily mail and mindlessly cheer this crap on wouldnt think twice about retiring to spain, or taking a high paying tax free job in the middle east, or going to "open a bar" in Thailand etc etc without ever considering needing to learn the language beyond ordering a beer.

I just find it odd how people's value systems are a often a one way street.

Shirely you just need to shout louder, then Johnny foreigner will understand.

contractor79
19th March 2009, 10:08
Welsh, Cornish, Manx, Gaelic, Scots etc. are indigenous languages and should have their place in their parts of the UK, so not comparable to foreign languages spoken by immigrants

Pickle2
19th March 2009, 10:09
The funny thing is, the Daily Mail does a Spanish print run for the expat community and I bet they're nodding their heads in approval of the story.

Exactly.

cailin maith
19th March 2009, 10:10
Shirely you just need to shout louder, then Johnny foreigner will understand.

Dad, is that you?

Mich the Tester
19th March 2009, 10:11
Welsh, Cornish, Manx, Gaelic, Scots etc. are indigenous languages and should have their place in their parts of the UK, so not comparable to foreign languages spoken by immigrantsEnglish is an imported language.

contractor79
19th March 2009, 10:21
English is an imported language.

when was that, I'm interested in where you draw the line here

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 10:25
Welsh, Cornish, Manx, Gaelic, Scots etc. are indigenous languages and should have their place in their parts of the UK, so not comparable to foreign languages spoken by immigrants

Is Angloromani OK with you too?

Mich the Tester
19th March 2009, 10:28
when was that, I'm interested in where you draw the line here

I don’t draw any line. You listed the indigenous languages of the British Isles. English came along much later than those languages and is a mix and match of Germanic and Norman dialects, brought here by immigrants/conquerors (there’s still a lot of debate about whether the Saxons were warlike conquerors or peaceful migrants or a mixture of both). English has developed into such a rich language because it’s been open to so many influences. (I’m not suggesting that the other indigenous languages are somehow poorer). You seem to want to stop those influences arriving; you are drawing the line.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 10:35
English is an imported language.

I don't think so. Germanic languages similar to Friesian came over from the continent from the 5th century, but English developed here.

Remember, Celtic languages are also imported - think about the poor neo-lithic folk who were culturally displaced.

Perhaps we should demand that everyone peaks Basque or Etruscan as languages representative of the time before those nasty Indo-Europeans turned up.

contractor79
19th March 2009, 10:39
I don’t draw any line. You listed the indigenous languages of the British Isles. English came along much later than those languages and is a mix and match of Germanic and Norman dialects, brought here by immigrants/conquerors (there’s still a lot of debate about whether the Saxons were warlike conquerors or peaceful migrants or a mixture of both). English has developed into such a rich language because it’s been open to so many influences. (I’m not suggesting that the other indigenous languages are somehow poorer). You seem to want to stop those influences arriving; you are drawing the line.

where do you draw the line please, at what point does something become indigenous

Mich the Tester
19th March 2009, 10:39
I don't think so. Germanic languages similar to Friesian came over from the continent from the 5th century, but English developed here.

Remember, Celtic languages are also imported - think about the poor neo-lithic folk who were culturally displaced.

Perhaps we should demand that everyone peaks Basque or Etruscan as languages representative of the time before those nasty Indo-Europeans turned up.You're right, but I'm pointing out in a strange way that all languages have developed under the influence of migration and the idea that one language should be frozen in time as the one and only 'indigenous' language is stupid. There are probably no real indigenous languages.

As for the Basque or Etruscan choice, I'd choose Etruscan; it's a close call as both Etruscans and Basques have good food and very enjoyable booze, but I just think Basque has too many 'k's, 'x's and 'z's to be pronouncable.

Mich the Tester
19th March 2009, 10:40
where do you draw the line please, at what point does something become indigenousnever

sasguru
19th March 2009, 10:42
where do you draw the line please, at what point does something become indigenous

Are you an immigrant? Your mastery of English seems rather poor.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 10:44
You're right, but I'm pointing out in a strange way that all languages have developed under the influence of migration and the idea that one language should be frozen in time as the one and only 'indigenous' language is stupid. There are probably no real indigenous languages.

As for the Basque or Etruscan choice, I'd choose Etruscan; it's a close call as both Etruscans and Basques have good food and very enjoyable booze, but I just think Basque has too many 'k's, 'x's and 'z's to be pronouncable.

Nobody really knows much ancient Etruscan.

I'm picturing this policy in 1940.

Newly arrived Jewish refugee turns up in shop without a word of English (oh, hang on this is the Daily Mail, let's think of something else.)

Newly arrived Polish soldier having escaped from Poland, then from France, turns up in shop. Gesticulates at something. No service.

contractor79
19th March 2009, 11:08
never

oh really, so you'd find it quite acceptable for one group of people to immigrate en masse to some other part of the world and dismantle the indigenous culture there and replace it with theirs, I guess you have no problem with the colonisation of parts of the world by e.g. British Empire then

and you would justify that because you deny indigenous culture exists

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 11:14
oh really, so you'd find it quite acceptable for one group of people to immigrate en masse to some other part of the world and dismantle the indigenous culture there and replace it with theirs, I guess you have no problem with the colonisation of parts of the world by e.g. British Empire then

and you would justify that because you deny indigenous culture exists

Could you explain the logical flow of ideas in your post please?

Rantor
19th March 2009, 11:23
Exactly.

I get to see this quite a lot.

Personally, I get frustrated at my level of spoken dutch as I think it’s a bit rude to live somewhere and not be able to conduct routine transactions in the local language.

More importantly, there are often situations were people are precluded from speaking the non-official lingo. I actually ended up feeling sorry for my sons teacher (fluent English speaker) who had to endure my ‘nederlands als tweede taal – jaar 2’ caveman dutch at the last parents meeting but they made the rules.:laugh

Still, it could have been worse; I could have launched into French and started a major ethnic dispute.

I would add that my willingness to learn the local languages is not universal, and there are loads of English speakers who live here for years and simply refuse to learn any foreign.

My missus was getting quite comfortable with that idea and I had to spend ages persuading her that speaking English loudly wasn’t the best long term option – sooner or later you need to be able to have an argument with someone in officialdom.

BTW – blanket linguistic chauvinism highlighted by the OP is just another cretinous way of pandering to xenophobia.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 11:30
BTW – blanket linguistic chauvinism highlighted by the OP is just another cretinous way of pandering to xenophobia.

Fancy that ending up in the Daily Mail.

minestrone
19th March 2009, 11:43
English is an imported language. That is why we have two words for some things, the Normans called it beef because that is what they ate while the poor Saxons who only got to farm the animals called them cows.

contractor79
19th March 2009, 11:52
does Mick deny that the Japanese, Chinese, French, Germans, Irish, Italians etc. have their own indigenous culture in their own countries too?

Mich the Tester
19th March 2009, 11:59
does Mick deny that the Japanese, Chinese, French, Germans, Irish, Italians etc. have their own indigenous culture in their own countries too?Give me a definition of 'indigenous' and I'll give you at least 5 more definitions.

Mich the Tester
19th March 2009, 12:01
Ah.

The advantage of Welsh... it doesn't have k's, x's, or z's... :D

The odd "dd", "ff" and "ll" makes up for it though, especially in the extressive use of spittle...Do they have Countdown on Welsh TV? Erm, I'll have a consonant please. Another consonant please. Another consonant. Don't confuse me with a vowel.

Mind you, I bet the Basques are good at scrabble.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 12:02
English is an imported language. That is why we have two words for some things, the Normans called it beef because that is what they ate while the poor Saxons who only got to farm the animals called them cows.

No. The English language was not spoken on continental Europe and then brought here. It developed here out of various imported languages.

Mich the Tester
19th March 2009, 12:05
We did that to confuse the Saes....My compliments. You do a bloody good job of it.

contractor79
19th March 2009, 12:05
Give me a definition of 'indigenous' and I'll give you at least 5 more definitions.

define what you deny please

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 12:06
does Mick deny that the Japanese, Chinese, French, Germans, Irish, Italians etc. have their own indigenous culture in their own countries too?

Did Mick deny that the English, Scottish, and Welsh have their own indigenous culture?

Also, please use capital letters at the beginning of your sentences. We have this indigenous custom of using the Queen's English in this country.

Mich the Tester
19th March 2009, 12:07
define what you deny pleaseNo. You decided by some criteria some languages are 'indigenous'. You tell us how you define 'indigenous'.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 12:08
Do they have Countdown on Welsh TV? Erm, I'll have a consonant please. Another consonant please. Another consonant. Don't confuse me with a vowel.

Mind you, I bet the Basques are good at scrabble.

I remember when Private Eye did a Welsh language Scrabble conversion kit - a load of 'l' tiles.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 12:09
No. You decided by some criteria some languages are 'indigenous'. You tell us how you define 'indigenous'.

And I still want a definitive ruling on Angloromani.

contractor79
19th March 2009, 12:16
No. You decided by some criteria some languages are 'indigenous'. You tell us how you define 'indigenous'.

you've denied indigenous

presumably therefore you have no problem with colonisation as there's no such thing as indigenous in your fantasy world

Mich the Tester
19th March 2009, 12:22
you've denied indigenous
Is that a sentence?

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 12:24
you've denied indigenous

presumably therefore you have no problem with colonisation as there's no such thing as indigenous in your fantasy world

There's no such thing as logic in your fantasy world. You equate language with culture.

Now your punctuation has slipped as well, so what kind of example does that set to non-native speakers.

contractor79
19th March 2009, 12:42
conclusion is that by denying an indigenous people/culture you are in effect not opposing any colonisation as you'd deny that there's no indigenous people/culture to replace

people with certain political and religious views want to dismantle the idea of nationhood, indigenous people and cultures so that they can impose their globalist ideologies

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 12:47
conclusion is that by denying an indigenous people/culture you are in effect not opposing any colonisation as you'd deny that there's no indigenous people/culture to replace

people with certain political and religious views want to dismantle the idea of nationhood, indigenous people and cultures so that they can impose their globalist ideologies

Can you learn at least one of either punctuation or logical reasoning?

sasguru
19th March 2009, 12:51
Hurrah! There's another cretinous fool to toy with :laugh

contractor79
19th March 2009, 12:51
Im waiting for mich to tell us what exactly was wrong with British empire

sasguru
19th March 2009, 12:52
conclusion is that by denying an indigenous people/culture you are in effect not opposing any colonisation as you'd deny that there's no indigenous people/culture to replace

people with certain political and religious views want to dismantle the idea of nationhood, indigenous people and cultures so that they can impose their globalist ideologies

This is a good troll. OK which of you invented this one?:rolleyes:

sasguru
19th March 2009, 12:54
Im waiting for mich to tell us what exactly was wrong with British empire

Nothing much. The strong always dominate. Now that Britain is weak, the situation is reversed and the Indians are reverse-colonising here.

HTH

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 12:54
Im waiting for mich to tell us what exactly was wrong with British empire

Let me start. It failed to leave a lasting legacy of accurate apostrophe usage.

Anyway, I asked about your stance on Angloromani, so let's hear it.

Old Greg
19th March 2009, 12:55
This is a good troll. OK which of you invented this one?:rolleyes:

Well, the bar is set quite low, so it must be one of yours. It's the only way you can come out on top. :laugh

MrMark
21st March 2009, 10:58
Man loses job...

beeb report (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/nottinghamshire/7956570.stm)


A postmaster from Nottingham who refused to serve customers who could not speak English has left his job.