A question for Java developers... how wide are your skills?

[d000hg]

I've done some work as a Java developer in the IB scene... as well as Java itself I worked with servlets, JSP, JSTL and SQL routinely. I used Ant to build the software, and SVN obviously, but I don't know much about writing an Ant script or setting up a new SVN project. Does that matter... I don't know when asked 'do you know Ant' if answering 'yes' implies I can cope using scripts to build the project, or that I can write a new script from scratch in notepad?

[chicane]

I don't know when asked 'do you know Ant' if answering 'yes' implies I can cope using scripts to build the project, or that I can write a new script from scratch in notepad?

I'm not a Java developer, but ...

...from my standpoint, 'Do you know Ant?' would be a poor interview question, and 'yes' would be an equally poor answer.

If you want to be up-front and honest (rather than blagging it), just elaborate by telling them that you're familiar with the usage of Ant scripts in building the project, but your knowledge of creating new Ant scripts from scratch is limited. That'll help them understand whether or not the scenarios in which you've used Ant correspond with the nature of experience they're seeking.

[jim2406]

I'm a .NET developer.

I reckon for every 50 people that have SVN, NANT, CruiseControl etc.. on their CVs, maybe 1 knows how to set it all up. The rest just use it. (eg: get latest, double click on a batch file, etc).

1 in 50 is probably optimistic!

[VectraMan]

Setting up SVN isn't very difficult. Just follow the instructions. Setting up SVN to use Apache and HTTPS as I've done is a bit more tortuous, but still not exactly the sort of thing anybody is ever going to be doing often.

Knowing how to use it properly is much more important.

[nomadd]

I've done some work as a Java developer in the IB scene... as well as Java itself I worked with servlets, JSP, JSTL and SQL routinely. I used Ant to build the software, and SVN obviously, but I don't know much about writing an Ant script or setting up a new SVN project. Does that matter... I don't know when asked 'do you know Ant' if answering 'yes' implies I can cope using scripts to build the project, or that I can write a new script from scratch in notepad?

Yes, you need to know how to write Ant - and possibly Maven - scripts. You'll also need a very firm grasp of Spring and Hibernate. Knowing how to set these things up in an Enterprise environment is also a very useful skill to have - and a must if you really want to know how these tools work, IMHO.

Other's may differ, but that's my experience in my last few contracts. The old "I know Java, JSP and Servlets" is worth nothing these days; 10 million Indians also know those things. I haven't seen one decent Java server-side role in the last year or more that hasn't also required strong Spring/Hibernate/Ant/Maven/Agile in it's spec.

Nomadd

[NickFitz]

FWIW, the SVN book is online to read or download free in a variety of formats, and the Ant Manual is available in HTML. Both probably tell you all you need to know, but a lot of people would just be happy that you were aware of them, and thus knew where to look if you wanted to find something out.

Let's face it, there's no need to memorise every single possible way of using tools like that; a skim through those docs means you'll have a good idea of what they can do and won't start re-inventing any wheels, which is all that's necessary.

[MPwannadecentincome]

how may people ever write anything from scratch - mostly there is always something to copy from or refer to.

[swamp]

A 'good' Java dev would know how to set up Ant from scratch, and most importantly know how to set up the project. SVN setup and admin are less important, but merging and backing out changes is a must.

[d000hg]

A 'good' Java dev would know how to set up Ant from scratch, and most importantly know how to set up the project.

How do you get this experience? Every project I ever worked on was an existing project... sure I can figure Ant out in every detail but that's not the same as knowing the best way to set up a Java-based web project from scratch.

In many cases, you could steal scripts/inspiration from an existing project but as
for starting at the very beginning, I wouldn't imagine books cover this precisely because most people don't have to do it.

[TroubleAtMill]

I've always found the ANT homepage to be an excellent resource for getting the basics, including setting up a project.

If you want an idea of a small project then a web-app will demonstrate 80% of ANT's capabilities. That is,

1. Create/Clean folder for compiled classes (let's call it build)
2. Compile Java code to build.
3. Assemble classes and WEB-INF files into a WAR file.
4. Copy WAR to deploy folder of Tomcat/JBoss/whatever.

HTH.