Frustrated...

[STVH001]

OK, hello? This is a posting to check whether there is something really REALLY wrong with me, or whether "agencies" are
really just the spawn of Satan. Am I the only one who is having a really, really hard time getting any use out of these (I
hesitate to use the word "consultants" as it's taken me years to perfect my customer consulting skills, but it seems anyone
can call themselves a consultant these days if they can work out how to double click on a computer icon) agencies?

A bit about me, sorry to bore you but I need to know that there are other people out there in the same boat... I am
33 and have been in IT engineering and management for 10 years and a contractor since 2000. My key skills are briefly listed
below so you can gauge how... sorry I'm going to have to lower myself here, "marketable" (eeugh!!!) you think I am.

Alright then, briefly, and in no uncertain order this is me...

A PRINCE2 project management Practitioner.
Over 8 years experience in server based (WAN/LAN/AIX/SOLARIS/NT-Win2K-XP) infrastructure delivery projects.
Additionally certified in risk management, analysis and project control techniques.
Additionally certified in advanced planning techniques and estimating practices.
Have worked in both Blue chip and SME environments, as a time served apprentice, in a shop (selling computers) and a pub.
Operational systems support and management of datacentre networks and software.
Currently studying for my ITIL Service Management Foundation certification.
Excellent customer facing and consultancy skills and have worked as a lead consultant and technical architect for companies
including IBM, Merrill Lynch, LLoyds TSB, Hutchison Whampoa and Gala Leisure.

Before you all start baying... my CV is in more detail and has been prepared professionally and by a senior recruitment
manager at one of Europe's largest insurance companies. So I'm sure my CV is not the problem...

So heres the drag... If you look at Jobserve, as I do (and have done every day for the last year or so) or you choose to
view any of the websites of any of the "agencies" that have sprung up virus-like over the last few years, you would think
that there are enough positions available to employ everyone. There are certainly plenty of jobs advertised and listed in my
field which is, put generally... the professional delivery of infrastructure and technical project management. It would also
appear from looking through Jobserve et al, that there are also plenty of jobs around in most other fields of IT.

Before I continue though, sorry Jobserve, the fault does not lie with you.

Here is my daily routine when looking for a job over the web (I have set up my "search filters" so I get my jobs by e-mail)
which is one benefit of Jobserve, OK;

1) Read through job listings.
2) Invariably find at least one advertised position which suits my skills, as per the agency description.
3) Email recent CV and covering email/letter about why I like position to agency.
4) Wait
5) Phone agency about position, talk to them...
6) Wait
7) Phone again

After that I mainly get fobbed off, so I phone yet again, or email and ask the question;

Me : "How come you aren't sending my CV in to the company when I fit the description of your posted job?"
Agency : Errr... usually nothing actually, 'cept the wind howling and tumbleweeds-a-blowin'

In the unlikely event that these people of huge IT experience, these who have invested years at the cutting edge of IT and
technical engineering decide that they DO think that my profile fits, they'll happily wag their tails in my direction and
tell me how great they are that they've managed to work their telephone, and that they have "exclusively" matched me to this
position when in fact all they have done is fed my electronic CV into an SQL search filter and managed to deduce that 1+1=2.

OK, so why don't agencies just tell the truth and not make up stories why they don't have information about an application,
here are a couple of recent conversations and a few beautiful moments I have experienced during my job search...

Me : "Hi, it's Steve Hicks here, have you heard anything back from company 'X' about my CV you sent them yesterday?"
Agency : "Oh, the manager at 'X' hasn't looked at your CV yet."
Me : "So when will the manager be looking at my CV?"
Agency : "Oh in about 10 minutes."

Yeah right. How can you possibly know that, sounds like agency BS to me... you want another?

After previously speaking to agency person "Tom";

Me : "Hi, can I speak to "Tom" please?"
Agency : "Oh, I'm sorry, "Tom" is on a training course today and won't be back until tomorrow, can I help?"
Me : "I don't know, I was speaking to him regarding the PM position at company 'X'"
Agency : "Oh, I don't know about that, I'll get him to call you when he gets back from his meeting."
Me : "But you just said he was out on a training course?"
Agency : "Oh... yes... I don't know why I said that"

Maybe it's because you're a slimy unprofessional parasite? Maybe, that's a bit harsh, we do, after all, all have to make
a living, but I don't get it, do these people not realize that they make their money off of MY labour... you think that would
inspire them eh? The harder you work, the more you earn? simple...

Maybe they really are robots after all? maybe Philip K Dick was right, and they're already here... just enough
intelligence to function to perform the role - but will never have enough genius to really realise the full beauty of life
or of the light. Anyway....

Who hasn't had this one...

Agency : "Hello Mr Hicks? we have your details and think you may be interested in this vacancy." (reads out vacancy)
Me : "Hmm... can you tell me exactly where on my CV it says that I am a JAVA or C# engine programmer?"
Agency : "Oh, sorry... do you know anyone who might be available for this role?"
Me : "OK, so not only is it hard enough for me to get a job, especially when you waste my time with positions that I
have in no way indicated that I am skilled for... but you want me to do your job for you as well? What the ****?"

I could list loads of these, but finally, I have to include the actual text from an email tennis match I had with a girl from
the Allegis agency... this is the actual advert that the agency posted, and bear in mind that I have deleted the girls name
to stop her feeling like a dolt, although I really, really wanted to leave it in... the contact name in the advert is the
girl I have the email conversation with.... the devil is in the first sentence of the advert and I guess this really sums my
frustration with agencies;

The advert from Jobserve;

Ty: Contract
Po: Project Co-Ordinator
Sk: 3 x Project Coordinators with SC clearance or be willing to undergo government security clearance required to assist
with coordination of IT rollout project. You will be responsible for team scheduling, data capture, project issues and
progress reporting and data change management. You must be highly proficient with MS Office and able to work under
pressure. You will also be extremely customer facing and organised. Any candidates must have previously worked within a
government/MOD/police/secure site environment. Please apply ASAP by Word CV.
Lo: Hampshire, South East
St: ASAP
Du: 6-8 months
Ra: Experience Driven
Ag: Allegis Group - IT Jobs (Contract Positions)
Co: LXXXXl AXXXXXXXg
Te: 0XX7 XXX 0XXX
Em: [email protected]

OK, not the perfect contract for me, but I was interested as it's a good location.... so I sent in a CV and a nice
covering letter. And got this immediate response...

Sent: 02 June 2004 10:25
To: 'Steve Hicks'
Subject: RE: Project Co-Ordinator role you advertised

Steve,

Please advise if you have the security clearance required for this role.

Thank you.

LXXXXl AXXXXXXXg
Account Manager


So being a jolly chap, and always wanting to build a good relationship, I sent this email back....


Hi LXXXXl,

I do not have current security clearance, I have held SC in the past for a defense project (1994'ish) and don't see any
reason why a re-granting would be an issue as the camel smuggling allegations were completely untrue ;-)

Hope to hear from you.

Best Regards,

Stephen Hicks
(XXXXX) XXXXXX
(XXXXX) XXXXXX


And got this response....


From: LXXXXl AXXXXXXXg [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: 02 June 2004 11:28
To: 'Steve Hicks'
Subject: RE: Project Co-Ordinator role you advertised

Hi Steve,

Thanks for making me laugh! Unfortunately your clearance needs to be still
valid-they were very specific about that.

Sorry mate, if we get anything else I'll give you a call.

Kind regards,

LXXXXXl

Laurel Armstrong
Account Manager


So, confused I sent this open, but to the point, email back....


Hi LXXXXl,

OK, sorry for being a bit confused but your advert quite clearly states in the first sentence;

"with SC clearance or be willing to undergo government security clearance"

What's the story? Do you not read the adverts before you place them?


Best Regards,

Stephen Hicks
(XXXXX) XXXXXX
(XXXXX) XXXXXX


Needless to say, I heard nothing back....

So, where are we... ahhh yes, a few major points and Q's;

1) I don't think I'm a dolt. I have worked very hard and have very employable skills and experience (in my opinion),
so why can't I get a contract? or why can't I even get most recruitment consult... ahem!!! I almost did it again,
"agencies" to phone me back?

2) Am I alone in this struggle, I feel as though I am.... is anyone else having these same problems?

3) Is the contract market dead, or am I really just kidding myself that I am quite skilled?

4) Skills crisis, what skills crisis... if you create an environment of fear and crisis, to survive, you have to feed that
fear otherwise you are deposed, is this how most agencies, and the gov'mt survive?


My frustrations lie in why don't agencies have the courtesy to phone back, or the courtesy to keep me informed of progress
when they do send my CV to a company?

My own experiences lead me to believe that most of these "posted" positions don't exist, and it's a cynical ploy by these
"agenices" to grab more CVs.

How desperate must they be when you see about 10-15 agencies all posting the same contact for a desktop support engineer
which is only paying about £8 PH.


I Wish all you UK contractors looking for work all the best in your efforts.... and don't give up.

Regards,


Steve







xx-small

[rebeccaloos]

Hey dude,

I am going through similar experiences, but then again it was the same 10 months ago (last time I was looking for a contract).

Agents have been quite bad in terms of coming back to you / being available to talk to you on the phone, and finally not really understanding the technical requirements that their client has given them (e.g. they ask you to know not just a programming language but the editor that the client uses too, even though it's not that important: if it doesn't appear in the CV, it's not good)

But anyway. I had an agent tell me yesterday that the market may have picked up but is still very slow.

I applied for a bog-standard DBA job 2 days ago, that is not even paying that well, and got the agent to tell me that they had 68 replies to the ad - in 24 hours.

so I think that the market might have picked up a bit but there are lots of people out there chasing contracts.

So I don't know whether the jobs are real or not, but there seems to be a lot of contractors after them...which may explain why it is still hard to get a decent contract.

[mailman]

can we have the readers digest version please?

I once got fobbed off by an agent saying that I need the appropriate security clearance before they would put me forward for a job.

Funnily enough...once I told him not having a SC isnt reason not to be put forward he changed his mind (luckily I had been researching that very point that same morning so I knew what I was talking about). :rollin

So whats my point...no farken idea as I need the readers digest version of the above two postings before making a real contribution to this thread (mind you...thats never stopped AtW has it :rollin )

Mailman

[Viking]

Re: I think I'm seeing double

Funny how we are having a similar discussion of the general board about these so-called "consultants".

You will be pleased to know that with 20 years in the business as a contractor it's getting worse, not better.

Hope that helps.

[Vetran]

Re: I think I'm seeing double

This was a hot topic in the PCG, the government have confirmed that witholding work by demanding current clearance except in exceptional circumstances is very naughty.

report it to the PCG? They may be able to provide a copy of the original letter that covered this.

[king contractor]

Who was that woman or was it 'Dolt'

Laurel Armstrong... you didn't do a very good job of removing the 'Consultants' name... but I'll forgive you as it's a long posting and quite easilly missed.

Yes experienced most of what your saying in the 10 years I've been contracting.

KC 8)

[runner]

Re: Who was that woman or was it 'Dolt'

Steve,

Your experience matches mine in many ways and as others have pointed out, there are a few more contracts out there but also an awful lot of people chasing them. One other thing though, the agency (or client for that matter), cannot stipulate current security clearence before you are able to apply for a role. I had this clarified by the Defence Vetting Agency who said it takes 2 weeks max to clear straightforward previously cleared people (I am also in that position BTW) so there is no excuse about it taking months anymore, they have speeded up the checking process it seems.

Hope this gives you some support.

[blondiebeeb]

Re: Who was that woman or was it 'Dolt'

When I left university, I had a temp job in a recruitment agency. It basically involved writing out job descriptions onto a database for the website.

I had a big stack of jobs to write out and it basically consisted of a pile of torn out adverts from magazines and newspapers and I was told "even put on the ones that say 'no agencies' " That tells you why there are so many jobs on the internet-cos they haven't been instructed to recruit for them. I know that they had jobs on their website that were at least 3 months out of date,

That is one of the few reasons why I hate recruitment agencies.

[FreeWiley]

Re: Who was that woman or was it 'Dolt'

If the recruitment cons, does not ring you within 30 minutes of you sending in your CV, then the job advert is a fake.

simple as that.

[rebeccaloos]

Re: Who was that woman or was it 'Dolt'

I am more and more agreeing with you, FreeWiley