Hi,
I'd like to begin a discussion about the future of the UK IT worker. I am worried about the encroachment of Indian nationals from 'offshore' companies in UK offices.
Definition of Terms: when I say 'UK Worker' I mean anyone of any nationality or ethnicity who is here to work in a private capacity. When I say 'Indian' I mean Indian Nationals sent by Indian offshoring companies not people of Indian ethnicity.
In the last few years 'offshoring' has cost thousands of UK workers their jobs. I have seen heavy redundancies (even pre-credit crunch) as skilled staff are replaced by cheaper 'offshore' labour.
I DO NOT take issue with India competing for offshore IT business. That is the completely fair operation of international capitalism. They have every right to draw work to India. This is not what this thread is about.
It is about Indian staff are body shopped into UK offices. Last year there were by some estimates 55000 'offshore' people onshore. Many of these roles (in my experience) are not suitable to be located in India. So that's c.55000 UK redundancies.
I do not believe this makes economic sense or is morally right.
Economically:
1) Onshored Indian staff do not pay income tax in the UK
2) Indian Companies do not pay corporate tax in the UK
3) The Government has lost 55000 people's income tax
4) The Government may well be supporting some of these people
5) There is a knock on effect as the 55000 are no longer spending in the wider UK economy
6) If UK staff are too expensive train more and allow supply to reduce wages. In addition this reduces the welfare bill.
Morally:
1) The spirit of the law is that foreign companies which are contracted by UK businesses to provide a service or product can send some of their staff to do this. The spirit is not that they can replace UK workers on a like for like basis. I say like for like as mostly they are managed and mentored by UK managers. This law is being exploited & while it may not be a technical breach it isn't right.
2) The government has a moral obligation to it's citizens or residents not those of another country.
3) To simplify the moral case. If a Victorian Factory one day fired all its workers and replaced them with cheap non-UK labour would that be right?
Arguments For:
There is only one. That UK industries remain competitive. Firstly is this actually accurate? Secondly do you feel this stacks up against the arguments against? Obviously for me it doesn't.
Conclusion:
I have no problem with individuals coming here to work in a private capacity. But this is a structural assault on the domestic labour market the like of which hasn't been seen before & it is still in its early stages. I struggle to see any benefit to the UK people or government in this.
I'd be interested to hear other opinions both for and against.
I'd like to begin a discussion about the future of the UK IT worker. I am worried about the encroachment of Indian nationals from 'offshore' companies in UK offices.
Definition of Terms: when I say 'UK Worker' I mean anyone of any nationality or ethnicity who is here to work in a private capacity. When I say 'Indian' I mean Indian Nationals sent by Indian offshoring companies not people of Indian ethnicity.
In the last few years 'offshoring' has cost thousands of UK workers their jobs. I have seen heavy redundancies (even pre-credit crunch) as skilled staff are replaced by cheaper 'offshore' labour.
I DO NOT take issue with India competing for offshore IT business. That is the completely fair operation of international capitalism. They have every right to draw work to India. This is not what this thread is about.
It is about Indian staff are body shopped into UK offices. Last year there were by some estimates 55000 'offshore' people onshore. Many of these roles (in my experience) are not suitable to be located in India. So that's c.55000 UK redundancies.
I do not believe this makes economic sense or is morally right.
Economically:
1) Onshored Indian staff do not pay income tax in the UK
2) Indian Companies do not pay corporate tax in the UK
3) The Government has lost 55000 people's income tax
4) The Government may well be supporting some of these people
5) There is a knock on effect as the 55000 are no longer spending in the wider UK economy
6) If UK staff are too expensive train more and allow supply to reduce wages. In addition this reduces the welfare bill.
Morally:
1) The spirit of the law is that foreign companies which are contracted by UK businesses to provide a service or product can send some of their staff to do this. The spirit is not that they can replace UK workers on a like for like basis. I say like for like as mostly they are managed and mentored by UK managers. This law is being exploited & while it may not be a technical breach it isn't right.
2) The government has a moral obligation to it's citizens or residents not those of another country.
3) To simplify the moral case. If a Victorian Factory one day fired all its workers and replaced them with cheap non-UK labour would that be right?
Arguments For:
There is only one. That UK industries remain competitive. Firstly is this actually accurate? Secondly do you feel this stacks up against the arguments against? Obviously for me it doesn't.
Conclusion:
I have no problem with individuals coming here to work in a private capacity. But this is a structural assault on the domestic labour market the like of which hasn't been seen before & it is still in its early stages. I struggle to see any benefit to the UK people or government in this.
I'd be interested to hear other opinions both for and against.
Comment