View Full Version : No More Agencies IT Position Website

Agencies Lie
31st July 2002, 13:30

I want to see the end of IT agencies - they lie, take huge cuts, send you to inappropriate interviews and have become thoroughly arrogant in today's market. I want to start a website advertising available IT positions directly to contractors without the middleman ogre that is the agency. Companies wishing to advertise positions will pay a one off fee and know that their payment for contractors would be substantially less over the contracting period. The website will be staffed by people who know IT so contractors can be confident in the service. The website should as simple to use as Jobserve and just as popular. We have seen services such as no-agency.com which to be honest was unacceptable - asking £100 to download a database of contacts was ridiculous. This website however can work. I want to restore confidence in IT contracting - the website is ready, minimal investment required but a shared vision. Let's share our knowledge and beat the agencies! Who's with me??

31st July 2002, 14:09
Wow - that is very original, going up against Jobserve. Why would a client want to advertise on your site rather than Jobserve, Gis-a-job, PCG, Fish-4-Jobs, Planet Recruit, CWJobs, GoJobsite, etc etc etc.
When you actually develop something that works and we can see, come back and show us.
Its like me saying petrol is too expensive I am going to invent an engine that runs on water.

31st July 2002, 14:43
<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote>Quote:<hr> services such as no-agency.com which to be honest was unacceptable<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END-->

how so? i thought it was quite original and well done....

bit of a pointed post for a first post or are you just hiding under a new identity???? bit cowardly......

<stir stir>

go get 'em NoDash........

Agencies Lie
31st July 2002, 15:30
Hmmm Jobserve, Gis-a-job, PCG, Fish-4-Jobs, Planet Recruit, CWJobs, GoJobsite - What have they in common? Advertisements from AGENCIES! The planned website advertises directly from employers! That is the difference - a major difference and IT contractors or permanent staff do not have to pay to browse available jobs. Employers speak directly to staff who know that Windows 2000 is not a new double glazing company! More importantly the website staff know IT from Cisco to Solaris, from networking to Flash. Is this so impossible? NO - it isn't. As for Conor, is a website for the prospective contractor that charges £100 for a directory of employers without an actual postion specified viable?? NO it can't be - did you fork out £100 for it? Be honest. This my first posting, I have never posted before under any identity and find that claim COWARDLY! I seek people who can contribute in time more than money as much as I can and get equal reward as anyone else! I offer an alternative to agencies that would benefit all IT staff - please only interested parties respond!

31st July 2002, 16:06
To be honest it’s not us you need to convince. If the “employers” are paying, it’s them you need to sell yourself to. I don’t think your agencies are lying ogres approach will go down too well though.

If you come up with a site with loads of people offering contracts which we can view for free, you won’t hear too many complaints from contractors.

31st July 2002, 16:14
So you have an idea, no doubt written on the back of a fag packet and you need people who can develop it for you for free?
Jobserve et al do allow clients to advertise directly, you really should research your market.
Are you offering an advertising service or an agency? If an advertising service, why would the people running it need to know IT? Surely they should know about advertising!!
I don't understand the point about contractors having to pay to browse jobs, where is that done now?
The Directory was aimed at contractors who wanted to market their company to decision makers, they have a choice of directories - Yellow Pages etc (only adresses & tel no's), Computer Users Handbook (£1000+) or No-Agency.com (was £100).
Apart from spouting on about how bad agencies are and how you are going to have a comapny run by contractors for contractors (nice one, but has been used before) try acrually developing a site, or even a viable business model and then market it.
As someone who has launched two new models for contractors to find direct work I will take my hat off to you if you succeed, but believe me in todays market you will find it impossible to make a profit.
If you would like to purchase a Directory of companies and contacts who may want to advertise on your new site go to www.no-agency.com - special price for you £1500

Agencies Lie
31st July 2002, 17:20
Actually, I could not find one position advertised directly by the client on Jobserve. I understand that they could but in practice they do not. Jobserve is the most frequented website for IT job seekers - few can argue that. Agencies are not wonderful institiutions and contractors agree! Advertisers should understand clients' requirements and match suitable candidates, it is plain silly to say otherwise. If the idea appears simple it's because it is and has been thought out reasonably and rationally and it can work. There is no need for a convoluted business model, the steps are simple - establish a site and convince employers that this resource is more effective in terms of cost and finding more appropriate candidates than agencies offer. Is that so impossible? Ok - so you got a list of contacts, tried to sell them and it didn't work out; it didn't need any market research to work out that it could not succeed. As for £1,500 for the website - well, that's not going to happen is it? A derivation of the name can be bought for £20. Sales may not be your strong point but you can contribute to this idea as much as everyone else offering the time and resources that you have available - everyone will have a share equal to their contribution including me. Establishing the site is the key - it will take time maybe 6 months but it is not unreasonable to envisage a website more popular than Jobserve. So don't be disheartened and instead contribute and be positive.

31st July 2002, 17:27
Agencies Lie - you're NEW HERE AREN'T YOU?

31st July 2002, 17:35
Errr. Those steps don't sound simple to me. Especially the "convince employers..." bit.

How would you stop agents using your site to find jobs to fill?

Agencies Lie
31st July 2002, 17:41
What do you call advertising for a position with a high level qualification and an excellent salary that does not exist just to get a response from people with that qualification so they can have them on the agency's books?
What do you call an agency informing the contractor they are getting a 20% cut from the contractor's rate when the client tells you it is 33%?
What do you call agencies that send candidates for interviews for positions that are different than advertised?

Quite simply you call these lies! I have experienced all of these and I bet other contractors have too. You may well work for an agency but the fact remains agencies do not serve the client and contractor well, they are only interested in themselves and how much they make! I believe a resource should exist that benefits client and contractor without the use of agencies.

31st July 2002, 17:41
Is good to see a bit of energy on here for a change. It'll certainly be no picnic taking on that task though. One of the biggest barriers is the 'preferred suppliers list' so many large companies have. Devise a plan to get past that one? Also, how would you get companies to trust you can deliver?

Tough questions to answer. One chap on here, ScotsPine has set-up a resource for sourcing contractors direct - see www.podsol.co.uk/consorti...rlogon.asp (http://www.podsol.co.uk/consortium/designerlogon.asp)

Also, btw, some companies do advertise direct on Jobserve. Doesn't seem very popular but I don't know why.

1st August 2002, 09:17
Good points made by nearly all!

However, to try and get Contractors back into work directly with clients, an option comes clear to me.

You state that a client must PAY to register, wouldn't it better if these clients could post jobs when they have them without charge. This would appeal to smaller clients, and also ones who have tremendous problems getting the accounts department to authorise payments. Adding another payment to looking for a contactor has in my experience stopped companies from deciding on a contractor and going for direct newspaper adverts for a PERMY.

We all want to make money, but I see that the approach of charging the people we want to get to employ us (considering we cost enough already) is a bit 'silly'

1st August 2002, 09:21
I am 'slowly' developing a website along these lines, (a bit of help might be in order, as I am a applications devloper, not a web developer).
It might be an option for someone who has bought these client lists to post a message to ALL on this list to poiint them to this web site a thus helping everybody, not just the one.
Please e-mail me if you want to know more @ dave@fieldsend.net

1st August 2002, 10:45
It's a sad fact that developers can become so engrossed in their own self-importance that they believe that every decision they make is correct.

Every developer I have worked with thought marketing didnt have a clue what they were doing and funnily enough every marketing bod thought the developers didnt have a clue what the customer wanted.

This is certainly no difference.
AgencyLies I suggest that you build a business model first or get someone to help you with it ( like NotAs.. ) before looking for help directly.

The reason employers tend not to contract direct is based on employment law reasons and the lack of decent hr staff. Agencies (bless their little cotton socks ) provide that service.

They are in it to make a buck only - no more no less.

Yours and NotAs ideas both have merit - but the flaw is based around the business model. How will you do it for free. I would suggest that a contractor co-op / search engine be more effective. Charge employers to advertise (jobserve ), provide CV search ( agency ), Client Search ( NotAs ) and also act as an agency but not necessarily so profit driven. Only an idea.

I suggest you look at some business models first.

Agencies Lie
1st August 2002, 11:14
Gaining client confidence in a website that cuts out the agency will take time. The benefits of a website staffed by those who know IT extremely well and charge a one-off fee are compelling. Like any business that is selling in this case a service, the client must be persuaded that it is prefereable than the alternative which this clearly is. This is a project for the long term and will require those with vision to see it through.

To everyone interested e-mail me at agencieslie@gladion.net -please no spam or snide comments. This idea will benefit us all And just to show you the latest depths of the agency, checkout Jobserve today. To apply for one position you must mail in your CV and a photograph of yourself. A photograph? How is that relevant? So they can see that you would 'fit in'? That you aren't white or black or Asian or ugly or bald? This is discrimination! How much lower can agencies go? Let's stop these Nazi thugs!

1st August 2002, 12:00
Well I wish you luck, but bear in mind that clients don’t know or care how badly you (as a contractor) have been treated by an agency.

As soon as MF suggests you need to do some work on a proper business model you launch straight into another rant about agents being Nazi thugs (and I’m not one by the way – an agent or a Nazi).

Using language like that will not convince anyone that you have a serious business proposition.

How about some role-playing? Pretend I’m a client looking to resource some contractors. So far you’ve told me that your service is clearly better, and that the case is compelling. But let’s say I can’t see that. How is it better for me?

Agencies Lie
1st August 2002, 12:19
If you as a client need to hire staff and know that you can now speak to people who know IT, who understand your IT needs who won't keep ripping you off, who can deliver appropriate staff - would you ring an agency?

Yes my feelings about agencies are strong but accurate. This is not just a business proposal for me - I am driven by the arrogance of agencies. If you read through the postings of mine and my experiences with agencies shared by many contractors, you would see why I am so keen to offer another way. Clients I'm sure have experienced problems with agencies - why isn't an alternative available? What do you think about agencies requesting photographs? Is this right? Do you not feel as sickened as I do? Is it even legal?

Response to dfieldsend

I can see you are trying to steal my thunder on this one. The answer is that clients already pay for contractors and agencies and keep paying through extortionate agency rates. Paying a one-off fee is simple when you know that is all you pay and get the best staff possible. Clients choose contractors when they do not want to hire permies with the expenses entailed e.g. sickness, pernsions etc. and need to complete a short term project. When clients have already resolved to hiring new staff, they already commit to the expense that this involves regardless of client size. The smaller the cost and the greater value in it the better and that's where I come in. What income do you propose just to keep the site running and staffed? Regardless, I need a web designer who can work with a database back end and anyone else who can feel they can contribute their time - no money needed to invest in this, just your time and vision to see this through. Come on dfieldsend, get your e-mail to me if you want to see this through:

1st August 2002, 13:08
There are many sites out there which do pretty much what is being proposed in this thread eg <a ref ="www.contractdb.com" (http://www.contractdb.com") </a>, this one is totally free.

There are at least 4/5 more I'll post the details when I remember them.

Agencies Lie
1st August 2002, 13:35
Yes, I have seen these websites - to be honest they are poorly designed, rarely updated and virtually unknown. The search engine on contractdb.com is a disaster! See any good jobs on there of late? What's wrong with a user friendly website? Front page - type in your skill, press enter,see jobs advertised and the times they were posted. Having a man in a gorilla suit on the front page doesn't do it for me. We are professionals - why not expect a professional service?

1st August 2002, 14:11
As I understand it you are going to charge clients a one off fee to gain access to a pool of available contractors. If you can’t find me a contractor do I get my money back? If not I’ll go to an agency who can offer just that (no contractor – no Fee). If I want to avoid agencies, why don’t I just go to one of the contractor databases and avoid any fees (like ScotsPine’s site mentioned above)? In fact why don’t I just post my vacancy in this forum? I assume clients don’t do this because they are happy with agencies.

What evidence do you have that clients want an alternative to an agency? The client I’m with at the moment insisted that I work through an agency, even though I found the contract myself and wanted to work direct (saving them money)! I would have to assume that they are happy with the service they get from the agency.

Agencies Lie
1st August 2002, 14:57
You seem to be missing the point. Yes there are contractor databases just as there are agency databases. Are these databases updated and reliable? Do they match client requirements to contractor skills and avavailability at any one specific time? Supposedly agencies perform this duty but regularly fail miserably. The planned website will act just as Jobserve and others do - matching live positions to available and skilled contractors or permies. Are you seriously suggesting that a job website cannot find the right candidate in today's market? Of course money would be returned if the position is not filled. You could post an advert in this forum but will you get the response needed? It is quite clear that IT agencies are undermining clients' confidence in IT - they charge huge rates and do not match ideal candidates to IT positions. Yes clients will approach agencies because there is no realistic alternative. This 'I'm alright, Jack' attitude is fine for you - What about other contractors, clients and the whole industry?

1st August 2002, 15:33
Then clearly I am missing the point. Sounds like what you’re talking about is an agency, but run on an ethical and co-operative basis (non profit?) with fees up front from the clients. Will you pay contractors as agencies currently do? Where will you get the money for this? (I guess this is one of the things clients like about agencies. Just one bill to pay, rather than one from each contractor)

I wasn’t trying to say, “I’m alright Jack”, just wondering why clients use agencies when they are offered a cheaper alternative.

Anyway, I genuinely wish you the best of luck. Let us know how you get on.

1st August 2002, 16:28
Personally I think you may either be a troll or just incredibly niave.

Agencies Lie
1st August 2002, 16:42
Nodash you had your say yesterday, you're bitter because you couldn't exploit the contractor - £100 for contacts collected on the Internet? Please! Then expect £1,500 for a nothing domain name...Now you start throwing insults. That's ok - you can now crawl back under your rock. Go find some tasty grubs!

1st August 2002, 17:12
How do you intend to adress the following:
Clients not getting inudated by applicants who are not suitable
Clients being inundated by agencies cold calling them as soon as they see the ad.
Indian s/w houses inundating clients.
How do you intenf to makret your idea to companies?
Do you have a salesforce?
What would you charging structure be?
Try and answer these questions and maybe I will think that you are serious.
PS £1500 wasn't for the domain name it was for a copy of the Directory

1st August 2002, 17:17
"Yes, I have seen these websites - to be honest they are poorly designed, rarely updated and virtually unknown. The search engine on contractdb.com is a disaster! See any good jobs on there of late? What's wrong with a user friendly website? Front page - type in your skill, press enter,see jobs advertised and the times they were posted. Having a man in a gorilla suit on the front page doesn't do it for me. We are professionals - why not expect a professional service? "

At least these databases are designed, yours is still in your head, without any idea on how to develop it.

Agencies Lie
1st August 2002, 18:01
Clients names would not be advertised on the proposed website so no cold calling. The website would act as brokers between the client and candidate You say market the idea? - I don't envisage a 'sales force' however getting the word out and establishing the website as a credible option is the goal and achieving this can be explored. Pricing options would vary - I don't intend to offer an exact structure just yet, that's why I'm seeking others to participate in a cooperative style to eventually become profitable. There will be no quick riches! Providing a database with a facility to search on key skills is hardly rocket science! I have created many before just as user-friendly and effective as Jobserve. This isn't a new idea, it has been tried before and will be tried again. But I believe if the website and service is done well and with commitment - it can work. I know there are many contractors 'between contracts' out there, how about e-mailing me your ideas to add to mine and offer some time in getting this started. There are questions when starting every new venture, as long as the basis of the project is sound; answers follow. E-mail me at:

2nd August 2002, 13:03
Although I admire your conviction and desire to succeed in this venture you are missing the main point that people are trying to get through to you. No matter how good your database is, how fast, how many contractors are on there etc... you will have to sell/market it to clients. Obviously sales & marketing is an area you have no experience in at all and appear to not understand. Have you got a client contact list? Do the clients want a service like yours? Who will do the selling? How much budget have you got? Have you ever tried cold calling someone who is having a bad day/doesn't want your service/has been rung 50 times that day already by people offering a similar service for FREE or is just arrogant? Oh and by the way you will be marketing/selling in competition with Jobserve (estimated worth of £100 million) and agencies such as Computer People (part of £1billion turnover group). The very best of luck!

2nd August 2002, 13:33
Can I come out form under my rock now?

3rd August 2002, 11:35
Please read this. You are not looking at the big picture.

Clients love agencies and are generally happy with them, as they:

1. Believe that putting an agency in between the contractor helps protect them from employment/tax liability laws.

2. Shield them from no-hoper contractors. They believe agencies filter out the dross. Compare with 100's of unsuitable candidates calling the client direct. The HR department would be up in arms.

3. Act as a single supplier. Once a month the agency invoices the client for mant contractors, maybe hundreds. Compare with having 100 contractors all invoicing the client on different dates for different anounts. The clients purchasing department would be up in arms.

4. Single contract. A single contract between the client and agency covers 100 contractors. Compare with 100 separate contracts. The clients legal department would be up in arms.

There are many other reasons.

To summarise for the hard of thinking.

Clients have the money. Clients like using agencies. Agencies are here to stay. Get over it.

What contractors like or don't like or think clients would like is irrelevant.

Convince me I am wrong.

Agencies Lie
3rd August 2002, 13:45
All I hear is defeatism. That's fine for no hopers with no imagination and no vision. To say that things are the way they are and offer some flimsy rationale for keeping the staus quo smacks of pure indifference and lethargy. Clients have not yet been offered an attractive alternative - pure and simple. Do you think clients are out to line the pockets of middlemen? No, if offered a choice I know what their accountants would choose.

I am not out to convince anybody, yes discuss the idea but to continue a thread of hopelessness and self pity is pathetic. Regardless, we now have our numbers to begin and so we have work to do. Thank you all for your contributions. As for that 'rant' against Blair, well what can I say? It's so reasonable even for the hard of thinking! I can see that you are somebody who can make big changes and maybe bring down the government. Stick to the day job...when the agency gets you one.

3rd August 2002, 14:34
Agencies Lie,

You have yet to put together any rational argument why your offering is better for CLIENTS. There is nothing new in your idea. Clients just want the quickest, easiest and least risky way to bet bums on seats. If your system gives them any hassle or risk (real or perceived), it is a no hoper.

Personally, I believe you are a troll, but incase i'm wrong, good luck.

I'll continue taking my medication and have a lie down now...

3rd August 2002, 16:40
The secret is to know your market and who your clients are rather than preaching to the converted (us) about the benefits of going direct.
Truth hurts but DP is right. Clients want (not love) agencies, not because they charge more but because they serve their purpose, this being that they can 'independently assess' the potential candidates thus providing a short list for them and take the blame (blame-game is the keyword) if anything goes wrong even if it is their (the clients') fault. Unless you come across a contractor who is in charge of hiring and probably knows his stuff, it is usually HR or other permanent staff that are responsible for recruiting.
Point is, it is not their money and so it doesn't work on the Easyjet/Go/etc principle of saving the commission.
Secondly, you need to be able to guarantee that the contractor will get his money from the client and for this you may bear responsibility as an introducer (maybe special insurance can sort it out - who is to pay though ?)
Leaving aside all other arguments, I shall return to the main one ie the 'shifting of blame' of which IT management is so good at. This is the reason behing the phenomenal rise of the consultancies that now operate in the previously lucrative areas for individual contractors such as CRM (eg Siebel) and ERP (eg SAP) where the no of contracts has fallen while the work has gone up. A previous posting by another member that was trying to set up consultancies direct using the skills of individual contractors while retaining some sort of overall management structure is a much more original and useful proposal albeit for a small no of contractors (how did it go ?)

3rd August 2002, 17:48
It is much better for a contractor to create a good relationship with several agents or RC's who will make the effort to market him and his skills and abilities. I have been successful at identifying several in the UK lately, and, yes, even in the USA, over the years.

It does help to make friends with such people. At the least, you are not going to be just another CV.

The trouble is not with the system but with the garbage in the system. There are too many people in business whose main talent is taking the piss on the world, and not on doing the hard work required to be successful. (This is pandemic in the USA.) We certainly can identify those individuals in agencies and client companies and maintain a database on those who have a high 'talk to walk' ratio or to express it in another politically correct way, are 'ethically challenged'.

With this information, we can ascertain whether or not their behaviour exhibited to date warrants preferential treatment. Credit rating agencies and credit scorers do this to help lenders determine the riskiness of customers and potential customers. We can do the same. When things swing the other way, those who treated us well and respected as professionals will get our preferred attention while those that do not will not be invited to the party or at least pay a high admission fee to attend.

I have informed RC's and agencies to act likewise. We need to understand that we contractors and agencies offer valuable services to clients. Clients must realise that a pile of thier cash will never get the work done, and at the end of the day, provides nourishment only to vermin. (Gold and silver can't even do that!) It is only through our efforts (and that includes permies) that will enable client companies to be successful and we need to be respected for our knowledge and experience.

It is essential that we determine our boundaries as to what is acceptable behaviour to us in this business. Those that respect us will enjoy the fruits of our labour. Those that do not can go elsewhere and face the consequences. Other service professionals from medicine to mechanics act in this manner and in this time of crisis, so must we.

If we can not respect give value to ourselves, then no one else is likely to do so. We can hold others to account for their actions, but blaming them is not going to help our situation.

We in the UK, and those of us who shall be in the UK, need to take note of this. The British are known worldwide for their understanding and tradition of what is proper behaviour. Much of Western Europe got taught a nasty lesson sixty years ago as to the consequences of being nasty. It is learning that needs to be remembered and constantly applied, in order to avoid similar events or what may well be in America's future very soon. We IT contractors can take the lead in this endeavour.

5th August 2002, 02:48
I agree with both sides of the arguement.... However, I would consider that a hybrid agency would satisfy both parties....

How about a hybrid agency that only would only charge the company or the jobseeker £250 if they are happy with the positive results. How about a agency that only get paid a fixed amount to only filtering the top ten CV's to match the job requirements... Maybe we can give the client the option to advertise jobs at a small price on our site and add the CV filter functionality tool to help them select the best applicant...
If they want extra services, like check references, drafting contracts, PAYE scheme, setting psy.. tests then we can charge a small fixed fee...

Of course this hybrid agency would have a super dupa website like jobserve, but I would consider that hybrid agency will also have the technical and legal knowledge to make employers feel at ease in finding a job applicant or contractor...

In essence, the hybrid agency would be competitve agency that forces existing agencies to change their bad business habits. By offering a high quality service to both the jobseeker and client at a price which is free, until a perfect match achieved.

I think a hybrid agency can really make a positive impact and surive this market.....

what do you think?

5th August 2002, 23:14
Your idea could work. But then it might not. Only way to know is to try it out.


Remember you posted on this board to ask us for our opinions. I've tracked this conversation for a few days and all I can see is you taking any criticism personally. I know your intentions are honourable, after all I have been shafted by an agency (still in the contract) and I'd love to contract directly. But criticising similar sites such as contractdb.com is not the way to go about it.

Bear this in mind. Why would an IT manager use your site instead of an agency? The agency route saves them the time and hassle of selecting the correct. Also, it's going to be much easier for them to find an agency than a direct contract site. We may not like agencies but the system works. And the dishonest agencies are going to lose out when the market gets back on track.

All we wish is that you do a lot of homework before setting this up. The big word is going to be marketing. You could have the best site in the world, but unless HR or IT managers know about it it's not going to work.

I wish you well. But please - listen to the people who are going to use your site. If you don't, you may as well put the idea to bed now.

www.contractordb.co.uk (http://www.contractordb.co.uk)

27th September 2002, 09:49
I shall be interested in discussing this further.

Fundamentally you are raising 3 points:

1. The unprofessional behaviour of Agencies in an employers market
2. The building of a site that promotes "contractors direct"
3. A possible umbrella company to cater for the need of contractors at no costs to themselves.

I am working on the third proposition and will soon make an announcement

In the mean time I have set up a Board " Agencies Practices" which I trust all of you will visit to share your experiences. I would even suggest " a name and shame campaign", as long as the contributors are aware of Libel laws/implications

No one, I repeat no one, can control/manipulate our future, unless we allow them to do so!

2nd December 2002, 01:03
Our experience has been that employers on the whole much prefer going through agencies.

We charge nothing, to anyone, yet have trouble getting employers with jobs.

e.g. email 300 employers' jobs@ email address, i.e.
all directed, and we'll be lucky to get 1 more employer sign on. Its a real shame.


www.jobshive.com (http://www.jobshive.com)

2nd December 2002, 10:01

IMO, it is because you are not reaching the right "person" within the "employer". This is because employers prefer and seek status co. In addition they tend to favour exixting relationships.

A suggestion would be:

1. Seek real names within employers (ask contractors to give you lead)
2. Target these people making clear how your service is different from others and what value do you add to the process.

Only agencies run by contractors are likely to be successful in future!

Good luck

3rd December 2002, 16:10
looking good at the moment (it's just a file listing of the parent dir)

4th December 2002, 15:41
That's because we closed it, no one was willing to pay, so decided you can only flog a dead horse so much. Moved onto other things now.

5th December 2002, 19:23
Its a pity that the no-hoper who started the thread and who has reapperared still doesnt get the message No-Agency.

Right decision maker indeed!!!! Techies with ideas of granduer. I've never met a techie yet who didnt reckon he new everything better than anyone else.

I tried the DB you sent me. 33% out of date, of the remaining 67% the results were poor. I got a return of 15%. The problem with the DB which made it a little unsuable was to do with the skill lists and missed a last updated column. I changed it a bit but at the end of the day was worth £50 just to mess around with it - so cheers.

8th December 2002, 22:36
""""Only agencies run by contractors are likely to be successful in future!"""

You may all be interested to know that many of the most succesful agencies that have grown up and been sold for small fortunes have been started by contractors!

No agency model is going to work unless people within that agency are prepared to pick up the phone, arrange meetings and get out and "sell".
When will some of you realise that there is far more to building a succesful business than having a flashy website and a sexy brochure.

9th December 2002, 10:48
I do, Dodgy, I do... :(

19th December 2002, 07:49
pick up the phone, arrange meetings and get out and "sell".

Never a truer word spoken. Some Contractors I've come across have trouble asking for their timesheet to signed, never mind making an appointment to sell themselves.

31st December 2002, 13:04
Why not use the PCG Portal? It gives B2B access to anyone who has paid to join, either as a contractor or associate. ;)