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BolshieBastard
4th January 2011, 20:58
Erm perhaps not. 20% VAT rate is here to stay. Apparently.

George Osborne hints he would lower income tax before cutting VAT - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/8238830/George-Osborne-hints-he-would-lower-income-tax-before-cutting-VAT.html)

The Chancellor said he considered the new 20 per cent VAT rate “permanent” and refused to say it would come down once the economy recovers and the deficit paid down.

Oh, the 20% VAT rate is a price worth paying apparently, Yes, just like 4 million unemployed was a price worth paying, wasnt it lamont?

cojak
4th January 2011, 20:59
:tumble:

Gordon Brown.

suityou01
4th January 2011, 21:10
It's very rare I actually have an opinion, but this time I do and the OP has got my gander up a little I'm afraid.

The country is in uncomprehensible amounts of debt. Just as if you had a lot of credit cards to pay off, you would have to try and cut your cloth to fit. The previous tossers pissed away all our money knowing that they would not ever be voted in again, in what to my mind was wreckless and essentially treason (or crimes against the state, whichever, I'd hang the ****ers anyway).

This economy is totally ****ed, and any measures to try and fix it get my backing. Granted now beer is over £3 a pint I will visit the pub less. Basics cost more so I will have to cut back on luxuries. Tough shit, seriously. JFDI

Previous generations actually HAD to struggle. I hate this generation of moaning, whinging, "oooh look my kids got ADHD", "I need my own psychiatrist", "my garden is posher than your garden", have a bunch of kids and ponce off the state, asbo ridden, spoilt little bastards that call themselves hoodies and think they are owed respect because they carry knives, effette arseholes.

We are in debt. We need to pay this down. It will be tough, it's supposed to be. No one made people borrow 70 times their salary to buy a 7 bedroom mansion, we have been greedy. Time to pay the piper, so let's get on with it.

No offence like, :wink

MarillionFan
4th January 2011, 21:16
WSYS except Im not cutting back because I
can afford beer, fags and luxury goods cause Im a CONTRACTOR!!!!

Bloody permies.

AtW
4th January 2011, 21:21
Erm perhaps not. 20% VAT rate is here to stay. Apparently.

And you probably wish you did not need to pay that and other indirect taxes by registering with some "clever" offshore scheme? :eyes

cojak
4th January 2011, 21:30
And you probably wish you did not need to pay that and other indirect taxes by registering with some "clever" offshore scheme? :eyes

Ouch! :laugh

Spacecadet
4th January 2011, 21:37
WSYS except Im not cutting back because I
can afford beer, fags and luxury goods cause Im a CONTRACTOR!!!!

Bloody permies.

I'm actually increasing my supply of the above mentioned just to help pay the deficit back (hopefully in time for the NHS to look after my tobacco related disease ridden corpulent body)

AtW
4th January 2011, 21:39
I'm actually increasing my supply of the above mentioned just to help pay the deficit back (hopefully in time for the NHS to look after my tobacco related disease ridden corpulent body)

Sir, you are a real patriot!

:hug:

P.S. The only way you can top it up is by passing away before your pension is due...

Doggy Styles
4th January 2011, 22:24
No spending cuts, no tax increases. Vote for me.

Ed Milliband

gingerjedi
4th January 2011, 22:32
I'm getting confused, whose turn is it to use the 'Tax Bombshell' billboard posters?

cojak
4th January 2011, 22:38
I'm getting confused, whose turn is it to use the 'Tax Bombshell' billboard posters?

The Lib Dems.

Oh no, wait a minute...

TimberWolf
4th January 2011, 23:08
Why don't Labour enter into coalition with the Conservatives and Liberals?

Freamon
4th January 2011, 23:57
No spending cuts, no tax increases. Vote for me.

Ed Milliband

No spending cuts, no tax increases, just a gilt strike.

Platypus
5th January 2011, 11:53
Erm perhaps not. 20% VAT rate is here to stay. Apparently.

A result of labour wrecking the economy. Thank Gordo for this one, Bolshie.

Please re-title all your anti Tory posts as "Another inevitable consequence of Labour's last **** up"

gingerjedi
5th January 2011, 11:57
A result of labour wrecking the economy. Thank Gordo for this one, Bolshie.

Please re-title all your anti Tory posts as "Another inevitable consequence of Labour's last **** up"

That's partly true but there's no getting away from the fact it was Labour that lowered VAT and the Tories who put it up.

suityou01
5th January 2011, 11:59
That's partly true but there's no getting away from the fact it was Labour that lowered VAT and the Tories who put it up.

:spel Labour that cut VAT to get votes

HTH

DodgyAgent
5th January 2011, 12:15
That's partly true but there's no getting away from the fact it was Labour that lowered VAT and the Tories who put it up.

There is also no getting away from the fact that the last two times labour have been in power they have bankrupted the country

suityou01
5th January 2011, 12:20
There is also no getting away from the fact that the last two times labour have been in power they have bankrupted the country

WDAS

Peoplesoft bloke
5th January 2011, 12:25
Yeah right "Labour wrecked the economy" - and they also wrecked the US, Iceland, Ireland, Spain, Portugal, France, Germany and Greece's economies.

We are so tighly wedded to the Septics that when they tank, so do we. It's true that Labour wrecked the Economy, but the only way not to have done so would have been a radical move away from the basically Thatcherite consensus of leaving things to the bankers. Unlikely to happen. Anything else is just tinkering. Most of the stuff that Labour did would have been done by the Tories. Don't forget the last time VAT went up it was because John Major had wrecked the economy. The idea that one party ruins an economy and another can mend it is old fashioned, dogmatic and frankly thick. All/any party pretends they can fix things but they don't.

Platypus
5th January 2011, 12:27
That's partly true but there's no getting away from the fact it was Labour that lowered VAT and the Tories who put it up.

Yes, Labour lower VAT, ostensibly to stimulate the flagging economy. Then they LABOUR put it back up to 17.5%.
Remember that business had to bear the cost of this government stunt, i.e. repricing every product in every store across the land. If you speak to people in business, which I do, their view is that the costs they incurred in managing this repricing exercise, only to reverse it again a year later, offset any benefits.

It's interesting to look back,
BBC NEWS | Business | Lower VAT rate comes into force (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7757854.stm)


It is estimated the change will cost the Treasury around £12.5bn and save the average earner around £170 a year.

But retailers say it will cost £300m during the next two years to cover the expense of implementing the change.

...

Our correspondent said: "But with the budget deficits set to reach £118bn next year, these VAT cuts might prove to be a very expensive gamble."

Platypus
5th January 2011, 12:31
Yeah right "Labour wrecked the economy" - and they also wrecked the US, Iceland, Ireland, Spain, Portugal, France, Germany and Greece's economies.

So was it some 'global crisis' that led to the UK's massive budget deficit and national debt?

No. Don't be an idiot.

Peoplesoft bloke
5th January 2011, 12:37
So was it some 'global crisis' that led to the UK's budget massive deficit and national debt?

No. Don't be an idiot.

FFS I bow to your genius - Labour ruins everything and the Tories make everything glorious and shiny for us. I will report for retraining immediately.

DodgyAgent
5th January 2011, 14:12
Yeah right "Labour wrecked the economy" - and they also wrecked the US, Iceland, Ireland, Spain, Portugal, France, Germany and Greece's economies.

We are so tighly wedded to the Septics that when they tank, so do we. It's true that Labour wrecked the Economy, but the only way not to have done so would have been a radical move away from the basically Thatcherite consensus of leaving things to the bankers. Unlikely to happen. Anything else is just tinkering. Most of the stuff that Labour did would have been done by the Tories. Don't forget the last time VAT went up it was because John Major had wrecked the economy. The idea that one party ruins an economy and another can mend it is old fashioned, dogmatic and frankly thick. All/any party pretends they can fix things but they don't.

You are not getting away with that abrogation of responsibility.

When labour were in power at the time of the collapse Gordon Brown was spending and borrowing for several years as if there was no tomorrow. You lefties want it both ways. You want high public spending but do not want to take any responsibility when things go wrong. And using your own argument that the collapse was due to external factors, then labour inherited a very strong economy from John Major and Thatcher-that they did not create. And also by your own argument the boom that preceded the "bust" was down to the entrepreneurial spirit of British business rather than the job prevention policies of the labour government. During these boom years labour were first to claim that the strong economy was down to them and them alone. Well if they are going to do that then they can take full responsibility when it all goes "ti*s up". It works both ways.

DodgyAgent
5th January 2011, 14:19
FFS I bow to your genius - Labour ruins everything and the Tories make everything glorious and shiny for us. I will report for retraining immediately.

As a matter of fact the Tories made life absolutely wonderful for IT contractors. Their policies enabled you to work as a low tax paying freelancer, and then they handed business to you on a plate by freeing up the banks and energy companies, and through privatisation of nationalised industries. You ungrateful hypocrites are so tied up in your own leftie guilt you are utterly blind to how you have got so fat and comfortable.

Churchill
5th January 2011, 14:49
As a matter of fact the Tories made life absolutely wonderful for IT contractors. Their policies enabled you to work as a low tax paying freelancer, and then they handed business to you on a plate by freeing up the banks and energy companies, and through privatisation of nationalised industries. You ungrateful hypocrites are so tied up in your own leftie guilt you are utterly blind to how you have got so fat and comfortable.

Sorry Dad. :emb

DodgyAgent
5th January 2011, 14:56
Sorry Dad. :emb
next time it is a spanking

Peoplesoft bloke
5th January 2011, 14:59
As a matter of fact the Tories made life absolutely wonderful for IT contractors. Their policies enabled you to work as a low tax paying freelancer, and then they handed business to you on a plate by freeing up the banks and energy companies, and through privatisation of nationalised industries. You ungrateful hypocrites are so tied up in your own leftie guilt you are utterly blind to how you have got so fat and comfortable.

Bollocks.

The guilt thing - I thought we'd done this. I am not gulity about earning more cash than others. Neither do I feel any gratitude to Labour, Tory or any other politicians for anything to do with my work. I make my own way in this world as I get the lucky (or otherwise) breaks - I don't consider contracting is some paradise created for me by any politcian. If they change the rules, I'll do something else - it's no picnic anyway.

Unlike you, I'm not so blinded by party dogma that I can't see the bigger picture. Sure El Gordo spent too much, but to keep on claiming with the mock righteous indignation of the Daily Wail that we're all going to hell in a hand cart as a result of his awful crimes is missing the point about why things all went wrong in the first place - which is that a few people considerably richer than any of us wrecked up the banking system using a model created by Thatcher and Reagan and not significantly challenged by any subsequent politician.

You can pin the 20% VAT rise on Gordo - fine - no arguments - I reckon that Labour would have done the same, but it only got to 17.5% because John Major wrecked the economy - and just for the record, in 1997 the Tories handed over a deficit - yes that golden economic miracle of increased taxes yielded a deficit - so let's get a bit of perspective.

lilelvis2000
5th January 2011, 15:13
Yup, they have complained about all of GB's tax increases in the past...but they're keeping each and every single of them. That's pretty typical of any government (except may the American's), once the sheep-like public get used to paying a tax, the govt. of the day gets used to paying it...it stays.

Pretty normal stuff there.

With Pints in pubs now so expensive I fully expect the two pubs which managed to open in my area to close again soon. One has already put its lease up for sale.

DodgyAgent
5th January 2011, 15:28
Bollocks.

The guilt thing - I thought we'd done this. I am not gulity about earning more cash than others. Neither do I feel any gratitude to Labour, Tory or any other politicians for anything to do with my work. I make my own way in this world as I get the lucky (or otherwise) breaks - I don't consider contracting is some paradise created for me by any politcian. If they change the rules, I'll do something else - it's no picnic anyway.

Unlike you, I'm not so blinded by party dogma that I can't see the bigger picture. Sure El Gordo spent too much, but to keep on claiming with the mock righteous indignation of the Daily Wail that we're all going to hell in a hand cart as a result of his awful crimes is missing the point about why things all went wrong in the first place - which is that a few people considerably richer than any of us wrecked up the banking system using a model created by Thatcher and Reagan and not significantly challenged by any subsequent politician.

You can pin the 20% VAT rise on Gordo - fine - no arguments - I reckon that Labour would have done the same, but it only got to 17.5% because John Major wrecked the economy - and just for the record, in 1997 the Tories handed over a deficit - yes that golden economic miracle of increased taxes yielded a deficit - so let's get a bit of perspective.


So you contractors (and we agents) did not prosper under the Tories then? How did John major "wreck the economy" exactly? The thing I remember about the last years of the Tories leading up to 1997 was the vast amounts of money being paid to contractors by the likes of London electricity. And whilst we are at it, who opened the floodgates to immigration? and when did off shoring take hold of IT?

It is all very well criticising Thatcher for freeing up the banking system, I suppose their mistake was to realise that it would be used as an excuse for the failure of a future labour government. I will also bet good money on you not complaing about the high wages you made during the nineties.

pacharan
5th January 2011, 15:39
Yeah right "Labour wrecked the economy" - and they also wrecked the US, Iceland, Ireland, Spain, Portugal, France, Germany and Greece's economies.

We are so tighly wedded to the Septics that when they tank, so do we. It's true that Labour wrecked the Economy, but the only way not to have done so would have been a radical move away from the basically Thatcherite consensus of leaving things to the bankers. Unlikely to happen. Anything else is just tinkering. Most of the stuff that Labour did would have been done by the Tories. Don't forget the last time VAT went up it was because John Major had wrecked the economy. The idea that one party ruins an economy and another can mend it is old fashioned, dogmatic and frankly thick. All/any party pretends they can fix things but they don't.

Nonsense. The fact of the matter is that Labour frittered away billions while times were good. The Tories would not have endorsed such high levels of spending so, when the sh!t hit the fan, we'd have been better equipped to have dealt with it.

Doggy Styles
5th January 2011, 16:08
I'm afraid the Labour goverment messed up the balance of payments, it's as simple as that.

So now their successors have got to correct it, which logic dictates they cannot do without cutting spending and raising taxes. To complain about that now is very blinkered.

Peoplesoft bloke
5th January 2011, 16:08
Nonsense. The fact of the matter is that Labour frittered away billions while times were good. The Tories would not have endorsed such high levels of spending so, when the sh!t hit the fan, we'd have been better equipped to have dealt with it.

No. The "fact of the matter" is that what the Tories would have done is unknowable - it is easy to make daft claims with 20/20 hindsight, but based on their record, there's nothing to suggest that the Tories wouldn't have needed a 2.5% increase in VAT, just like they did under John Major, because of their own mess ups.

I am neither a Tory or Labour (or Lib Dem) supporter - I will vote for whoever I feel is appropraite at the time, but the blinkered sheep like mentatlity of the "I'd vote for a dead dog with a blue rosette" posters on here is breathtaking.

DodgyAgent
5th January 2011, 16:24
No. The "fact of the matter" is that what the Tories would have done is unknowable - it is easy to make daft claims with 20/20 hindsight, but based on their record, there's nothing to suggest that the Tories wouldn't have needed a 2.5% increase in VAT, just like they did under John Major, because of their own mess ups.

I am neither a Tory or Labour (or Lib Dem) supporter - I will vote for whoever I feel is appropraite at the time, but the blinkered sheep like mentatlity of the "I'd vote for a dead dog with a blue rosette" posters on here is breathtaking.

I am not a doe eyed Tory, but I happen to agree with the basic idealism of their party. Using the "unknowable" argument is utterly ridiculous. How can you make judgements based on the unknowable?? stop and think and try for example applying this philosophy to interviewing someone. "Had things been different I would'nt have f*cked up" is no basis upon which to judge people either individually or collectively. had Liverpool been faced with teams that only turned up with one player then no doubt they would have won the premiership last year.

The only thing to go on is on what people have actually done. If they have done those things well then there is a good chance that they can do well in the future. The Tories didnt make a mess of the economy - labour did - not once but twice in my memory. Yet people still go ahead and vote for labour goodness - knows why.

You are trying to shroud the argument by saying that anyone who disagrees with you is a rabid Tory without bothering to argue the link between such a view (opposite to yours) and "being a rabid Tory".
You have also conveniently ignored my assertation that you are a hypocrite who has personally done extraordinarily well thanks to the policies of previous Tory governments.

Peoplesoft bloke
5th January 2011, 16:49
So you contractors (and we agents) did not prosper under the Tories then? How did John major "wreck the economy" exactly? The thing I remember about the last years of the Tories leading up to 1997 was the vast amounts of money being paid to contractors by the likes of London electricity. And whilst we are at it, who opened the floodgates to immigration? and when did off shoring take hold of IT?

It is all very well criticising Thatcher for freeing up the banking system, I suppose their mistake was to realise that it would be used as an excuse for the failure of a future labour government. I will also bet good money on you not complaing about the high wages you made during the nineties.

FFS

In order -

1. I never said some people didn't make cash - not me as it happens since I wasn't a contractor then. The problem is that you seem to think that I should be eternally grateful without taking into account other things that that government did, or recognising that times change, and to continually vote Tory on the basis of a few good years 20 years ago (which I didn't get anyway) isn't very bright.

2.I dunno - you'd better ask him why he felt he had put up VAT by 2.5% depsite there having been a brilliant Tory miracle government in power for so long at that time - perhaps you could ask why we had airport departure tax and insurance premium taxes for the first time too - but if a 2.5% VAT hike now is because someone wrecked the economy, how was it not the same then?

3. Michael Howard actually, since you ask, a Tory.
4. Over the last ten years, not opposed in any way by Tories

And now a question for you -

Who was to blame for the banking crisis? (I ask in earnest and in anticipation of a considered answer)

I notice we haven't returned to your "guilt" speech and for that I thank you.

DodgyAgent
5th January 2011, 16:52
FFS

In order -

1. I never said some people didn't make cash - not me as it happens since I wasn't a contractor then. The problem is that you seem to think that I should be eternally grateful without taking into account other things that that government did, or recognising that times change, and to continually vote Tory on the basis of a few good years 20 years ago (which I didn't get anyway) isn't very bright.

2.I dunno - you'd better ask him why he felt he had put up VAT by 2.5% depsite there having been a brilliant Tory miracle government in power for so long at that time - perhaps you could ask why we had airport departure tax and insurance premium taxes for the first time too - but if a 2.5% VAT hike now is because someone wrecked the economy, how was it not the same then?

3. Michael Howard actually, since you ask, a Tory.
4. Over the last ten years, not opposed in any way by Tories

And now a question for you -

Who was to blame for the banking crisis? (I ask in earnest and in anticipation of a considered answer)

I notice we haven't returned to your "guilt" speech and for that I thank you.

I will keep the guilt bit for when I get desperate!

banking crisis is an example of the worst excess of capitalism, so the fault lies with the bankers and the governments.

minestrone
5th January 2011, 16:57
Anyone that thinks Labour were sailing the ship in the right direction and the tories are buggering up the economy should be sectioned.

RichardCranium
5th January 2011, 17:04
I am not a doe eyed Tory, but:eek:

:confused:

:freaky:

Actually, DA... :eyes

TykeMerc
5th January 2011, 17:06
Anyone who thinks any politician or political party is capable of doing a good job needs their head examined.

Especially in these days where a very significant number of politicians have only ever been politicians since their university days, their grasp of the real world and what it needs is tenuous at best.

Churchill
5th January 2011, 17:07
Anyone who thinks any politician or political party is capable of doing a good job needs their head examined.

Especially in these days where a very significant number of politicians have only ever been politicians since their university days, their grasp of the real world and what it needs is tenuous at best.

Good point.

DodgyAgent
5th January 2011, 17:07
:eek:

:confused:

:freaky:

Actually, DA... :eyes

What I meant to say was that the Tories are too left wing for me.

amcdonald
5th January 2011, 17:07
FFS

Who was to blame for the banking crisis? (I ask in earnest and in anticipation of a considered answer)


Gordmong

Churchill
5th January 2011, 17:11
What I meant to say was that the Tories are too left wing for me.

I always thought you were the product of a drunken tryst between Thatcher and Tebbit... :happy

Peoplesoft bloke
5th January 2011, 17:12
Good point.

Well made and considerably more briefly than I managed.

Peoplesoft bloke
5th January 2011, 17:33
I am not a doe eyed Tory, but I happen to agree with the basic idealism of their party. .
I think that consistently arguing that people who (ever) vote for any other party are guilty hypocrites and that only one party can ever be trusted to run Britain qualifies you.





Using the "unknowable" argument is utterly ridiculous. How can you make judgements based on the unknowable?? .

I can't - I was complaining because someone else was doing it.




The only thing to go on is on what people have actually done.

As I said. The Tories have increased VAT by 2.5% twice - if you accept (and I am fairly happy to) that this time it is because Labour messed up, then the last time they did it after they had been in power for circa 10 years then that must have been because they screwed up.



You are trying to shroud the argument by saying that anyone who disagrees with you is a rabid Tory without bothering to argue the link between such a view (opposite to yours) and "being a rabid Tory". .

No I am only accusing the dogmatic advocates of 100% Tory rule at all times of that. I prefer it when we have a change from time time even thought it doesn't actually make a lot of practical difference.



You have also conveniently ignored my assertation that you are a hypocrite who has personally done extraordinarily well thanks to the policies of previous Tory governments.
For many reasons - we've done it to death already; you may think that if you say enough it will become true, but I don't. Since I don't accept the assertion that I' ve derived significant benefits from it or that even if I had I need to doff my cap and vote Tory for ever and give grateful thanks guvnor.

Freamon
5th January 2011, 19:58
Politicians have limited power (especially over periods of time shorter than a decade).

To say Britain could have escaped a recession and higher govt borrowing had the Labour govt been more sensible is not credible.

But to say the Labour govt didn't make it 5x worse than it needed to be is even less credible.

vetran
5th January 2011, 22:27
As chancellor of the exchequer until 2007, Brown pursued a policy of what he called “light-touch” business oversight and streamlined regulatory bodies, often at the urging of employer organizations such as the Confederation of British Industry.


When Labour came to power in 1997, Brown stripped the Bank of England of its role as banking supervisor and divided regulation between the central bank, the Treasury and Financial Services Authority.

The decision has been criticized by lawmakers in recent years, and the Conservatives say they will return sole responsibility for banking oversight to the Bank of England if elected.

Obviously a disreputable source like Bloomberg covering Brown's desperate pre election U-Turn may not convince people we are still looking for real evidence like stone tablets.

Brown Says He Was Wrong on Bank Regulation, 2007 Tax (Update2) - BusinessWeek (http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-04-14/brown-says-he-was-wrong-on-bank-regulation-2007-tax-proposal.html)

Brown relinquished control that the tories instigated, would the tories have done the same I doubt it, there was already plenty of money in the kitty when the left power. _Pensions were even making money. They would probably have continued skimming off the top unlike the New Lie who skimmed off the bottom line.

Green Mango
5th January 2011, 23:38
Obviously a disreputable source like Bloomberg covering Brown's desperate pre election U-Turn may not convince people we are still looking for real evidence like stone tablets.

Brown Says He Was Wrong on Bank Regulation, 2007 Tax (Update2) - BusinessWeek (http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-04-14/brown-says-he-was-wrong-on-bank-regulation-2007-tax-proposal.html)

Brown relinquished control that the tories instigated, would the tories have done the same I doubt it, there was already plenty of money in the kitty when the left power. _Pensions were even making money. They would probably have continued skimming off the top unlike the New Lie who skimmed off the bottom line.

Yeah, but it's not just the failure with bank oversight.

It is the huge expansion in public spending which was simply unsustainable ....

After Labour has craped on us all, they now tell us that any cut is bad and any tax raise
is unjustified ...

Bagpuss
5th January 2011, 23:51
Brown relinquished control that the tories instigated, would the tories have done the same I doubt it


What did they instigate? IIRC credit default swaps didn't even exist the last time they were in power so how they or the Bank of England would have controlled the growth in this new debt I'd love to know. It's all pretty moot as it's not UK socialism that started this.

American Bankers Association - SourceWatch (http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=American_Bankers_Association)

The ABA heavily lobbied in the 1990s to champion policies that fueled the current crisis including the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act, which had kept risky investing separate from consumer banking. This left banks with more money for risky investments that ended up in the subprime market.
"The ABA has spent $7 million in the three quarters since the bailout to fight reforms- more than the $6.2 million they spent on lobbying in all of 2007. Along with their lobbying partners in the financial, insurance, and real estate sector, they have unleashed $321 million in lobbying in the nine months following the bailout.

Doggy Styles
5th January 2011, 23:53
Yeah, but it's not just the failure with bank oversight.

It is the huge expansion in public spending which was simply unsustainable ....

After Labour has craped on us all, they now tell us that any cut is bad and any tax raise is unjustified ...and that it was a global problem that had little to do with them.

Bagpuss
6th January 2011, 00:03
Hang on a minute, vat is up by 2.5 points. Why are things going up by much more than this? So far noticed the following going up by much more than this.

Train fares
Gym Memberships
Food
Petrol

I thought we were all in this together? Pay restraint is being encouraged but many large organisations are using this VAT increase as an excuse to raise prices. The Government should step in now and chastise those not in this with the rest of us.

VAT change will be used to hide 8pc price rise - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/retailandconsumer/8237844/VAT-change-will-be-used-to-hide-8pc-price-rise.html)

AtW
6th January 2011, 00:22
That's partly true but there's no getting away from the fact it was Labour that lowered VAT and the Tories who put it up.

:rollin:

Labour lowered it TEMPORARILY and caused a lot of costly problems for sellers - this also cost £13 bln to the Treasury and did exactly fook all to stimulate economy.

AtW
6th January 2011, 00:24
FFS, I go away for short holiday and miss out on some quality tax discussion :mad

RichardCranium
6th January 2011, 00:26
Hang on a minute, vat is up by 2.5 points. Why are things going up by much more than this?Because it is a good excuse to hide price increases. Look at how many people use those machines in the supermarket to count their saved up pennies: those machines take something like 9%. Joe and Jo Public are far too thick to count their pennies for themselves; they certainly cannot do %ages in their heads when shopping.

Just think of it is another Idiot Tax.


So far noticed the following going up by much more than this.

Train faresNormal. Happens every year.


Gym MembershipsWalking is still free.


FoodThat'll be the cost of the oil. And the demand for biofuel. Try buying locally-sourced, in-season fruit & veg. Also, compared to many supermarkets, some of those fruit & veg box schemes are not that expensive.


PetrolNot just related to VAT; petrol has its own duty + the oil companies need to make a profit somehow. The poor lambs. Especially since they keep pissing their oil into the oceans and then having to pay compensation to the Merkins for polluting Mexican beaches.


I thought we were all in this together?:rollin: Oh, you are funny. :laugh


Pay restraint is being encouraged but many large organisations are using this VAT increase as an excuse to raise prices.Yep.


The Government should step in now and chastise those not in this with the rest of us.:rollin: Oh, stoppitt! You're making my sides hurt!


VAT change will be used to hide 8pc price rise - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/retailandconsumer/8237844/VAT-change-will-be-used-to-hide-8pc-price-rise.html)Just bend over, drop your kecks and take your punishment like a good citizen.

And remember not to complain when the MPs give themselves another pay rise and, yet again, allow themselves expenses no-one else in the UK can claim.

RichardCranium
6th January 2011, 00:27
FFS, I go away for short holiday and miss out on some quality tax discussion :madYou've not been on a short cruise to Amsterdam by any chance...?

AtW
6th January 2011, 00:27
Train fares
Gym Memberships
Food
Petrol

Train fares go up because Govt wants to reduce amount of subsidy it provides.

Gym Memberships are up because people cut down on those so remaining members have to make up the difference.

Food goes up because wheat etc are up in world markets (thanks to money printing and general dirty spekulation)

Petrol is up due to VAT, extra duty and also price is pretty effing high - $90+, which is due to money printing and spekulation.

The only thing that does not go up is BagPiss - the only deflation is in Nu Liebor supporters, pity there is no special tax on those :eyes

AtW
6th January 2011, 00:28
You've not been on a short cruise to Amsterdam by any chance...?

No, I was travelling back from Moscow...