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Clippy
18th May 2011, 21:21
Another nail in the coffin for this project? (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-13430375)

Anyone currently working on this?

What's the view from the coalface?

Spacecadet
18th May 2011, 21:39
They should have just settled on a data standard which hospitals/trusts and other healthcare organisations had to adhere to, allow them all to go electronic organically and then move towards a centralised repository

MarillionFan
18th May 2011, 21:48
They should have just settled on a data standard which hospitals/trusts and other healthcare organisations had to adhere to, allow them all to go electronic organically and then move towards a centralised repository

The issue isn't technology. The technology is easy. Canada have had integrated primary/secondary healthcare for 20+ years. There are already data standards in place.

The problem is politics. Patient data is 'owned' by individual
Surgeries with Doctors who think they know best. It is
Incredible the notes they write on patient records which they don't want shown elsewhere. It is the doctors themselves. If you look at EMIS the leading supplier for
primary healthcare you'll see they hold this programme as hostage.

Within the British armed services integrated health systems already exist. A medic can pull up a soldiers medical records on a handheld while flying in a helicopter FFS. We've been sold short by doctors, tosser liberals, weak leadership and consultancies at the trough.

russell
18th May 2011, 21:53
The issue isn't technology. The technology is easy. Canada have had integrated primary/secondary healthcare for 20+ years. There are already data standards in place.

The problem is politics. Patient data is 'owned' by individual
Surgeries with Doctors who think they know best. It is
Incredible the notes they write on patient records which they don't want shown elsewhere. It is the doctors themselves. If you look at EMIS the leading supplier for
primary healthcare you'll see they hold this programme as hostage.

Within the British armed services integrated health systems already exist. A medic can pull up a soldiers medical records on a handheld while flying in a helicopter FFS. We've been sold short by doctors, tosser liberals, weak leadership and consultancies at the trough.


I agree the technical aspect isn't the problem it's organising all the awkward public sector people to get on board with it.

PSK
19th May 2011, 10:32
Happy to be corrected but I thought GP practices were profit-making private sector bodies, doing what I'd expect businesses to do. Even without GP commissioning being introduced, equity GPs can earn large payments - Anger over £665,000 for Britain¿s highest-paid GP | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1382362/Anger-665-000-Britain-s-highest-paid-GP.html)

I've no criticism of these business men/women, though think it seems clever that they are not perceived as running profit-motivated businesses.

BlasterBates
19th May 2011, 11:25
err why can't they just install the same version of Word, use a few common templates and store the documents in a directory with the patients name and Cipher key unlockable by the Doctors GP

£7bn.....pheweee

Old Greg
19th May 2011, 11:45
err why can't they just install the same version of Word, use a few common templates and store the documents in a directory with the patients name and Cipher key unlockable by the Doctors GP

£7bn.....pheweee

Agreeing common templates for clinical documentation is what I do for a living (or some of what I do). One of the zillion difficulties is that hospital doctors have a dual accountability - to their employer and to their professional body (college). As for GPs, they'll do what they like.

TykeMerc
19th May 2011, 11:57
The lessons learnt exercise on a failed £7bn project will cost a fair few million...

I'm willing to bet all of the conclusions will have been predicted in the early stages and are probably on the unresolved section of the risk register. Of course mismanagement by senior civil servants and politicians won't feature heavily.

PSK
19th May 2011, 12:52
I've not read any of the NAO reports in detail and I wasn't close enough to have a firm opinion over what was well or badly managed though I recall the NHS IT 'Czar' was a private sector consultant (Deloitte?) before being recruited to deliver CfH (though he became a civil servant on recruitment - possibly the highest paid civil servant at that time?).

I'd be interested in the opinions of those involved regarding the proportion of delivery done by civil servants compared with private sector - the impression I got was that most delivery was outsourced to the private sector big systems integrators, there was a considerable 'one man band' contractor population within the programme though I'd be surprised if the big strategic decisions were't made by senior civil servants and the politicians (with the support of one or more of the big consultancies).

Old Greg
19th May 2011, 12:56
I've not read any of the NAO reports in detail and I wasn't close enough to have a firm opinion over what was well or badly managed though I recall the NHS IT 'Czar' was a private sector consultant (Deloitte?) before being recruited to deliver CfH (though he became a civil servant on recruitment - possibly the highest paid civil servant at that time?).

I'd be interested in the opinions of those involved regarding the proportion of delivery done by civil servants compared with private sector - the impression I got was that most delivery was outsourced to the private sector big systems integrators, there was a considerable 'one man band' contractor population within the programme though I'd be surprised if the big strategic decisions were't made by senior civil servants and the politicians (with the support of one or more of the big consultancies).

Dear old Mr Richard Granger. In the words of his dear old mum:

''I can't believe that my son is running the IT modernisation programme for the whole of the NHS."

Health service IT boss 'failed computer studies' | Society | The Observer (http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2006/nov/12/epublic.technology)

Spacecadet
19th May 2011, 12:59
Dear old Mr Richard Granger. In the words of his dear old mum:

''I can't believe that my son is running the IT modernisation programme for the whole of the NHS."

Health service IT boss 'failed computer studies' | Society | The Observer (http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2006/nov/12/epublic.technology)

:rollin: