East Londoner's killed in US drone strike

[scooterscot]

For a moment I thought Merkel fast tacked her tax plans for London.

Two British terror suspects killed in US drone strikes in Pakistan | World news | The Guardian

Two British terror suspects killed in US drone strikes in Pakistan

[vetran]

hmm 'British' from Algeria.

Carefully omitted from all the reports - had to dig.

Isn't it strange we can take care of all the worlds dropouts but like to let our grannies die of cold?

[NotAllThere]

...
Isn't it strange we can take care of all the worlds dropouts but like to let our grannies die of cold?

Can't we take care of all the world's dropouts and save the grannies? In what sense were these lads drop out? If you bothered in your digging, you'd find that Ibrahim Adam did well at school and then got involved in Islamist extremism. What has being born in Algeria have to do with it? Perhap one or both of his parents were British. Did you find out where Mohammed Azmer Khan was born? The fact is, these two are home-grown Islamist terrorists. This has nothing to do with immigration.

Anyway, they emigrated* four years ago.

* Fled the country.

[lilelvis2000]

hmm 'British' from Algeria.

Carefully omitted from all the reports - had to dig.

Isn't it strange we can take care of all the worlds dropouts but like to let our grannies die of cold?

Those grannies could easily sell their properties at vast profit and move into old-age villages or cheaper flats. But that's another debate.

I joke the UK immigration policy is "bring us your illiterate, your ill, your destitute, your idiots and your criminals - and will pay them to breed".

[xoggoth]

This has nothing to do with immigration

The same old nonsense. People who cling to their roots, sometimes for generations, who have more affiliation with their countries of origin than with Britain, who come and go there freely mixing with who knows who, who put the values they brought with them above British values, who do all they can to get more in, who put those from their own countries above the British, are EVERYTHING to do with immigration.

This argument is all so convenenient for the mass immigration is good lobby. High birth rates producing loads of children in our schools who don't speak English? Nope, that cost is not counted in studies showing the benefits of immigration as they are British. Fatherless Afro Caribean kids joining gangs in London? Nope, that's a British problem due to racism, the fact that the high rate of kids with no paternal input is exactly the same in Jamaica is pure coincidence.

[Paddy]

Can't we take care of all the world's dropouts and save the grannies? In what sense were these lads drop out? If you bothered in your digging, you'd find that Ibrahim Adam did well at school and then got involved in Islamist extremism. What has being born in Algeria have to do with it? Perhap one or both of his parents were British. Did you find out where Mohammed Azmer Khan was born? The fact is, these two are home-grown Islamist terrorists. This has nothing to do with immigration.

Anyway, they emigrated* four years ago.

* Fled the country.

+1

Unfortunately there have been thousands of innocent people killed in drone attracts and the easy way out for governments is to just accuse innocent people of being terrorists

The same old nonsense. People who cling to their roots, sometimes for generations, who have more affiliation with their countries of origin than with Britain, who come and go there freely mixing with who knows who, who put the values they brought with them above British values, who do all they can to get more in, who put those from their own countries above the British, are EVERYTHING to do with immigration.

This argument is all so convenenient for the mass immigration is good lobby. High birth rates producing loads of children in our schools who don't speak English? Nope, that cost is not counted in studies showing the benefits of immigration as they are British. Fatherless Afro Caribean kids joining gangs in London? Nope, that's a British problem due to racism, the fact that the high rate of kids with no paternal input is exactly the same in Jamaica is pure coincidence.

For my point I do not agree with mass immigration to any country in particular to the already overcrowded UK, but that does not mean that once in our country they should be treated differently either in a positive or negative way.


Loyally should be to your host country and not to be split with affiliation to their countries of origin …. However, there seems to be an acceptance in this country particularly with MPs that Israel comes first and the UK comes second or even third after the US.
.

[vetran]

The reason we can't do both is there is not enough money in the pot. I assume you live on a 'dollar a day' to show your solidarity? Many countries this is the reality 'the race to the bottom' (in a globalization sense) is something that needs to be managed carefully and is now happening.

Poorly managed immigration does have an influence on this situation, in a purely logical fashion if they had remained in French ruined Algeria 2 continents away then they probably wouldn't have been considered British men.

The fact they are presented as 'British' despite their birth seems to be manipulation that is common in the press, one would suspect its by design.

If they had remained in Algeria then they would have been poor (or not they seemed bright) but they wouldn't blame their lot on the hated British and become fundamentals. Its easy to become extremists if you are poor and others are in a different situation.

The fact they are refugees based in Britain having passed a number of safe havens raises my curiosity. Was it an intentional act were their parents sleepers? Were there benefits in avoiding Greece,Spain,Italy & France?

Its quite difficult to see these as innocents, I agree many innocent locals have probably been killed by badly managed drone attacks which is quite horrific, however these guys weren't exactly tourists.

[NotAllThere]

The reason we can't do both is there is not enough money in the pot. I assume you live on a 'dollar a day' to show your solidarity?

Nope. I don't live in Britain and have no interest in returning. So I'm disinterested in what goes on there

Its quite difficult to see these as innocents, I agree many innocent locals have probably been killed by badly managed drone attacks which is quite horrific, however these guys weren't exactly tourists.

They're probably not innocents. I for one won't be shedding a tear over them.

I simply take issue to the simplistic approach that immigration is the cause of all the ills. Being an immigrant myself, that kind of rhetoric does no-one any good. Even when those spouting it say "excluding those present of course".

Immigration needs to be controlled, but many racists use the immigration issue to try to add an aura of decency to their xenophobia.

False dichotomies (keep granny warm or offer sanctuary), especially when the latter is subverted by thinly disguised hatred (harbour terrorists), don't help. Yes, you can do both. Stop wasting money on e.g. stupid big govt. IT projects.

If the government didn't waste so much money on <insert pet hate here> there would be plenty of money to keep granny warm and enhance our own humanity by offering a helping hand to the vulnerable and needy.

[xoggoth]

that does not mean that once in our country they should be treated differently either in a positive or negative way

I agree (although I would once they are citizens) but that does not mean that we should not look at problems due to some groups to determine future policy.

[vetran]

Nope. I don't live in Britain and have no interest in returning. So I'm disinterested in what goes on there

They're probably not innocents. I for one won't be shedding a tear over them.

I simply take issue to the simplistic approach that immigration is the cause of all the ills. Being an immigrant myself, that kind of rhetoric does no-one any good. Even when those spouting it say "excluding those present of course".

There are too many 'needy' in the world if you judge it by our standards, so what do we do let them all in and you will support them? That is what you imply.

Or do we manage it such that their standard of living grows to an acceptable level and the stimulated commerce decreases the chance of psychotic dictators massacring their own people? Whilst we decrease our standard of living or find a way to make it sustainable without raiding other countries?

That is the choice facing us. It has nothing to do with race or religion. We need to approach a compromise and quick.

The money the government has wasted on various projects and benefits could well have been spent on raising other countries ways of life to reduce the need for emigration and provide ideas and the raw materials for making our life more sustainable.

Its like this if you spend all your money on buying your bar room friends beer and pursuing satisfaction, forget to feed your kids and pay the rent you would be considered a bad parent.

If you spent your money teaching your friends how to read, whilst improving yourself and making sure your kids eat well and did well at school you would be considered a good person.

You of course know nothing about me but you feel it acceptable to accuse me of being racist?

Tell you what I will let you introduce yourself.

Why did you emigrate?
Do you feel guilty about depriving you host country about your skills & drive?
If its a suffering home country when you make it will you go back there or support it remotely like many of the Sikhs do with their home villages?
Do you contribute positively to your new host country (including those you displaced)?
If you hadn't moved there would your employer have found an local person to do the job?
Would you have you still contributed positively if the level of immigration had been unsustainable say >5% per generation?
Do you integrate well or have you joined the Ghetto (this may mean you live in a group of like minded immigrants in one place not neccessarily poor)?
Why do you assume racism is the basis of most peoples objections to immigration?

Notice I have never asked what race or colour you are, that isn't important to me or many others.