ICTs

[Peoplesoft bloke]

It seems to me that they only exist to appease the total bastards that run multinational fascist companies - but what do I know?
Can someone put the cogent case (if there is one) for why it's better for Britain to import thousands of cheap skilled workers rather than train some of our own?

[SimonMac]

It seems to me that they only exist to appease the total bastards that run multinational fascist companies - but what do I know?
Can someone put the cogent case (if there is one) for why it's better for Britain to import thousands of cheap skilled workers rather than train some of our own?

Cause its cheaper for the company, which means more profits to pay crop tax on so the Govt turn a blind eye?!

[eek]

Cause its cheaper for the company, which means more profits to pay crop tax on so the Govt turn a blind eye?!

Its because we don't have the skilled people here any more (or so the ICTs claim). And that is rapidly becoming true as fewer people want to enter IT as a career as pay levels haven't changed in monetary terms for the last 13 years.

[Moscow Mule]

Can someone put the cogent case (if there is one) for why it's better for Britain to import thousands of cheap skilled workers rather than train some of our own?

It's not, but it's quite handy for people like Nissan to bring in people who know how to build cars.

[mos]

Its because we don't have the skilled people here any more (or so the ICTs claim). And that is rapidly becoming true as fewer people want to enter IT as a career as pay levels haven't changed in monetary terms for the last 13 years.

I fear that its not that simple. We already have hundreds of great UK trained professionals who are pushed out and marginalized by the likes of TCS "consultants". The work of risk professionals who are typically highly IT skilled is also bastardized (pardon my language) by professional "Business Analysts" who create sui generis management layer which belittles work of risk professionals. I can give examples of entire teams which resigned after their department has been taken over by these "consultants" - but not all have that option.
In my experience - this foreign cheap workers and even more so expensive business analysts they work under are not capable of creating any value for the business - we are heading to abyss - and since 2008 things are only getting worse.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

So, to summarise, there is no good reason for ICTs except to appease businesses who actually don't give a tulip about the UK

[eek]

In my experience - this foreign cheap workers and even more so business analysts they work under are not capable of creating any value for the business - we are heading to abyss - and since 2008 things are only getting worse.

I can't find the article I wanted to link to but it basically said a company is now as only as good as its developers because they are the only thing that separates them from every other business in the world. Granted it was talking about startups but I think its a true statement the best way to improve profits is to find the best people to identify improvements (whether its cost savings or extra sales) and then get them implemented as well as possible as quickly as possible.

[eek]

So, to summarise, there is no good reason for ICTs except to appease businesses who actually don't give a tulip about the UK

or they own long term business. Unfortunately most companies haven't realised that yet.

[AtW]

Cause its cheaper for the company, which means more profits to pay crop tax on so the Govt turn a blind eye?!

There is 25-ish corp tax on profits that multi-national bothers to declare in this jurisdiction and 50%+ on employed people by said corporation.

[mos]

I can't find the article I wanted to link to but it basically said a company is now as only as good as its developers because they are the only thing that separates them from every other business in the world. Granted it was talking about startups but I think its a true statement the best way to improve profits is to find the best people to identify improvements (whether its cost savings or extra sales) and then get them implemented as well as possible as quickly as possible.

Eek, Thanks for the response but the point which I was trying to make is that import of IT (and BA, Risk, etc. ) workers destroys infrastructure (and therefore the value) of UK businesses created by generations of UK IT professionals. They are not capable of identification or implementation of any improvements - quite the opposite. Marketing of their services - and self confidence in their abilities relative to indigenous professionals is quite another matter.

In other words - if its not broken don't fix it. Continue to grow organically.

Import (and glorification) of these workers may also lower morale of the UK IT professionals - its not only about pay being dragged down as a result.

I am not sure what you were getting at.