PDA

View Full Version : No rate increase on renewal



jezosaurus
14th May 2012, 20:57
Annual renewal come up. As usual, I have requested that the rate goes up in line with the rate of inflation. (This is Belgium - everything gets indexed). They have flatly refused.

The rate is poor, but the contract is for a large institution, and could last for years. That's pretty much the only reason (and a 10 minute commute) that I accepted the contract.

Normally, I would just be very upset and resentful at the agency's refusal to increase the rate, but in this case, not only has every other contractor had some sort of increase, but I've confirmed that the end client actually has this in their budget.

So the agency are lying to me (again) and I can prove it.

Question is: What can I do about it?

:ladybags:

GeekyGrandad
14th May 2012, 21:25
Annual renewal come up. As usual, I have requested that the rate goes up in line with the rate of inflation. (This is Belgium - everything gets indexed). They have flatly refused.

The rate is poor, but the contract is for a large institution, and could last for years. That's pretty much the only reason (and a 10 minute commute) that I accepted the contract.

Normally, I would just be very upset and resentful at the agency's refusal to increase the rate, but in this case, not only has every other contractor had some sort of increase, but I've confirmed that the end client actually has this in their budget.

So the agency are lying to me (again) and I can prove it.

Question is: What can I do about it?

:ladybags:

Walk.

Simples.

BolshieBastard
14th May 2012, 21:32
Walk.

Simples.

Yep +1. One wonders why the OP has asked what can he do. Obviously though he's in his comfort zone and doesnt want to walk. If that's the case, why did he ask?

Wanderer
15th May 2012, 02:21
AQuestion is: What can I do about it?

Why are you asking the agency for a rate increase? Speak to the client - you work for them not the agency...

NotAllThere
15th May 2012, 05:08
Why are you asking the agency for a rate increase? Speak to the client - you work for them not the agency...

An interesting perspective. :ohwell

All rate increases I've ever had started with telling the agency - I want more money.

mudskipper
15th May 2012, 05:12
An interesting perspective. :ohwell

All rate increases I've ever had started with telling the agency - I want more money.

It depends on how the renewal is approached.

With me, client approached me directly and asked me if I'd be interested in a renewal. I said I was enjoying the work, but wasn't happy with the rate, so any renewal would be dependent on ££££. Then left it to him and the agent to fight about.

MarillionFan
15th May 2012, 06:54
It depends on how the renewal is approached.

With me, client approached me directly and asked me if I'd be interested in a renewal. I said I was enjoying the work, but wasn't happy with the rate, so any renewal would be dependent on ££££. Then left it to him and the agent to fight about.

WSS

northernladuk
15th May 2012, 07:18
Annual renewal? Expecting rate increases? Rate of inflation? Contract last for years?

That is a perm contract you have there IMO.

Support Monkey
15th May 2012, 07:27
Why are you asking the agency for a rate increase? Speak to the client - you work for them not the agency...

WRONG
you supply your services to the agency, they then supply you as a resource to the end client, you invoice the agency not the client, you are paid by the agency not the client, any rate increase will need to come from the agency

eek
15th May 2012, 07:32
Annual renewal? Expecting rate increases? Rate of inflation? Contract last for years?

That is a perm contract you have there IMO.

Its Belgium. A different country with different rules.

Wanderer
15th May 2012, 08:20
WRONG
you supply your services to the agency, they then supply you as a resource to the end client, you invoice the agency not the client, you are paid by the agency not the client, any rate increase will need to come from the agency

Contractually, yes that's true but in reality, I've never supplied services to an agency. Most times, I've never even met them.

I see the agency as a facilitator who introduces me to the client and factors my payments so I can be paid on a reasonable schedule. Once I've been introduced I try to deal directly with the client directly if at all possible as it helps keep the agent honest and can prevent them ripping both the contractor and the client off by taking excessive margins.

I realise that not all contractors and client's are willing to work this way but that's my style, you are of course free to do business whichever way you like. :)

TheFaQQer
15th May 2012, 08:45
Yep +1. One wonders why the OP has asked what can he do. Obviously though he's in his comfort zone and doesnt want to walk. If that's the case, why did he ask?

WBBS - either suck it up and stay, or walk. No-one here can advise on what is best for you - you know what you want to do, so do it.

NotAllThere
15th May 2012, 09:46
I approach the agency rather than the client, because I can either get an increased rate by the client paying more, or the agent taking less. If I approach the client, then it'll only happen if they pay more. Secondly, agents are good at negotiating; if I can use their skills on my behalf, then I will - some are happy to do this, as it increases their margin as well. If they won't budge, then I might have a chat with the client, explaining I'll leave if more money isn't forthcoming.

While naturally on a day to day working basis, we treat the client as who we work for, when it comes to issues affecting the contract, it's the agent. Of course, not all clients are aware of this, but it's up to make it clear the amount they're paying isn't the amount we get.

jezosaurus
15th May 2012, 11:27
The agency in question are taking over 25% margin. Not only is that the highest markup in years, but I'm also on the lowest rate in years.

And given that all the other contractors who are not going through these scumbags have had some sort of rise, I actually suspect that they've had it and are not passing it on to me.

Time to kick up a stink.

:tumble:

BlasterBates
15th May 2012, 11:38
You have two options you can have a quite word with the client and get him to knock the agency down, or you need to be quite firm with the agency that you get x% or you're leaving. It seems that this a hard nosed agency so you may have play a bit of poker here, I suspect you'll have to go right down to the wire.

Support Monkey
15th May 2012, 11:57
Contractually, yes that's true but in reality, I've never supplied services to an agency. Most times, I've never even met them.

I see the agency as a facilitator who introduces me to the client and factors my payments so I can be paid on a reasonable schedule. Once I've been introduced I try to deal directly with the client directly if at all possible as it helps keep the agent honest and can prevent them ripping both the contractor and the client off by taking excessive margins.

I realise that not all contractors and client's are willing to work this way but that's my style, you are of course free to do business whichever way you like. :)

Well the reality is you do not have a contract with the end client only the agency

I am all for keeping in with the client and using them for leverage in pay negotiation but any negotiation between agency and client is down to them, you can call what they do what you like at the end of the day you supply to the agency not the client.

where you have an agency involved you are taking a percentage of the money they get from the client so its down to the agency what percentage they want to give you

jezosaurus
15th May 2012, 17:45
You can have a quite word with the client
I did just that. And he confirmed that the annual indexation that is in the contract is passed on directly to all freelancers.

Which means I have confirmation that the agency are lying.

Which is utter stupidity on their behalf. Not being open and honest with people is one sure fire way of destroying your goodwill, and people in Belgium are very loyal with who they do business with.

jmo21
15th May 2012, 18:09
So the agency are lying to me (again) and I can prove it.



Unless the client are already paying agency top whack and will not increase it.

Or, they did get an increase but since your contract is with them, they have ZERO obligation to give you an increase.

Your only leverage is threatening to walk.

SueEllen
15th May 2012, 18:19
I did just that. And he confirmed that the annual indexation that is in the contract is passed on directly to all freelancers.

Which means I have confirmation that the agency are lying.

Which is utter stupidity on their behalf. Not being open and honest with people is one sure fire way of destroying your goodwill, and people in Belgium are very loyal with who they do business with.

Then:
1. Tell the client what the agency are up to and inform them that if you cannot get a raise from the agency, mentioning everyone by name, you will go elsewhere. Make sure you inform the client how much the agency margin is in full.

2. Tell the agency that you have informed the client that they have refused to pass on the increase, that you demand the increase and you are going to walk if you don't get it.

Then be prepared to walk.

The reason the agency isn't giving you the rise is because you don't look like you are going to walk. So even if you take a few days off to sort out the issues the agency will be scared you are going walkies.

jezosaurus
16th May 2012, 20:13
Then:
Tell the client what the agency are up to and inform them that if you cannot get a raise from the agency, mentioning everyone by name, you will go elsewhere.

That worked. I didn't quite put it as subtly as that, but I've had a very groveling email today explaining I'd be getting what I asked for, as the client told the agency that's what was going to happen.

And it would seem, from talking to the client, that there's not going to be any more business going the was of that particular agency.

:yay:

SueEllen
16th May 2012, 20:27
That worked. I didn't quite put it as subtly as that, but I've had a very groveling email today explaining I'd be getting what I asked for, as the client told the agency that's what was going to happen.

And it would seem, from talking to the client, that there's not going to be any more business going the was of that particular agency.

:yay:

I learnt a good few contracts ago that if the agency p*sses you off then inform them that you are going to speak to the client, and do so without hesitation if they don't act.

Wanderer
16th May 2012, 20:51
I've had a very groveling email today explaining I'd be getting what I asked for, as the client told the agency that's what was going to happen.

And that's why I try to deal with the client if at all possible, rather than the agency...

Good result!