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FAO Brillo and Dallas; endurance training

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    FAO Brillo and Dallas; endurance training

    Hi, as you may know I'm intending to ride a couple of gran fondos this summer; probably not the San Remo as 300 kms with two big hills might be too much for now, but 150 kms in Liguria looks good. I'm doing hill training, repeated blasts up a little hill nearby, and on the flat can manage 32-34 kph continually for 1.5 hours. If I ride in a group with the local racers I can manage 40kph for an hour or so. So I have a decent VO2 max and good leg strength, BUT there is a problem. Whether I ride fast or slow, I seem to get knackered and hit a flat spot after an hour and a half and can't get going again. Perhaps logical as I played rugby for so long and that lasts 80 minutes and maybe that's what my body's tuned to do, but I need to be able to ride for 5 or 6 hours at a time, and can only do one long ride for a few hours once every weekend and I'm noticing that the long endurance ride leaves me tired for a few days afterwards in which interval training or strength training just doesn't work. What should I be doing to improve endurance to keep riding all day? Should I spend some weeks just doing nothing but endurance and maybe drop the interval work for a while?
    And what exactly is wrong with an "ad hominem" argument? Dodgy Agent, 16-5-2014

    #2
    Originally posted by Mich the Tester View Post
    Hi, as you may know I'm intending to ride a couple of gran fondos this summer; probably not the San Remo as 300 kms with two big hills might be too much for now, but 150 kms in Liguria looks good. I'm doing hill training, repeated blasts up a little hill nearby, and on the flat can manage 32-34 kph continually for 1.5 hours. If I ride in a group with the local racers I can manage 40kph for an hour or so. So I have a decent VO2 max and good leg strength, BUT there is a problem. Whether I ride fast or slow, I seem to get knackered and hit a flat spot after an hour and a half and can't get going again. Perhaps logical as I played rugby for so long and that lasts 80 minutes and maybe that's what my body's tuned to do, but I need to be able to ride for 5 or 6 hours at a time, and can only do one long ride for a few hours once every weekend and I'm noticing that the long endurance ride leaves me tired for a few days afterwards in which interval training or strength training just doesn't work. What should I be doing to improve endurance to keep riding all day? Should I spend some weeks just doing nothing but endurance and maybe drop the interval work for a while?
    Riding is my bag, to be frank, and I would say you need an energy bar or something. I used to take a banana with me on long rides, oir an energy gel/bar and I'd be grand. If you knock out 1.5/2 hour rides, your body will be low on the instant energy it craves and you'll really struggle. On one 110 mile ride, I didn't eat for 4 hours and started hallucinating (seriously). Carry some energy bars/gels and you'll be fine

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by Mich the Tester View Post
      Hi, as you may know I'm intending to ride a couple of gran fondos this summer; probably not the San Remo as 300 kms with two big hills might be too much for now, but 150 kms in Liguria looks good. I'm doing hill training, repeated blasts up a little hill nearby, and on the flat can manage 32-34 kph continually for 1.5 hours. If I ride in a group with the local racers I can manage 40kph for an hour or so. So I have a decent VO2 max and good leg strength, BUT there is a problem. Whether I ride fast or slow, I seem to get knackered and hit a flat spot after an hour and a half and can't get going again. Perhaps logical as I played rugby for so long and that lasts 80 minutes and maybe that's what my body's tuned to do, but I need to be able to ride for 5 or 6 hours at a time, and can only do one long ride for a few hours once every weekend and I'm noticing that the long endurance ride leaves me tired for a few days afterwards in which interval training or strength training just doesn't work. What should I be doing to improve endurance to keep riding all day? Should I spend some weeks just doing nothing but endurance and maybe drop the interval work for a while?
      Hills??? Holland???

      Have you moved abroad
      "Ask not what you can do for your country. Ask what's for lunch." - Orson Welles

      Norrahe's blog

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by norrahe View Post
        Hills??? Holland???

        Have you moved abroad
        Alright, hillock that's about 100 metres high. A sort of 'big zit' on the landscape. It's OK if I ride up it 20 times.
        And what exactly is wrong with an "ad hominem" argument? Dodgy Agent, 16-5-2014

        Comment


          #5
          I've always considered 90 minutes the point at which endurance cycling training starts. Most reasonably fit people can keep going for about that long, it's a sort of natural duration, but going longer requires specific training (not least for your arse, which can get a bit sore) and the best training is time spent exercising after that initial 90 minutes.

          Forget the intensity at first. You need to go long and low with a short low intensity recovery the day after. The usual 3 or 4 week cycles of building up then easing off work well, but build the duration not the intensity.

          I usually make sat or sun 'long ride' day as it's easier to fit in, ideally I try and fit in another 'long' (i.e. over 90 minute) midweek ride once the weekend ones are up to 3-4 hrs.
          While you're waiting, read the free novel we sent you. It's a Spanish story about a guy named 'Manual.'

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by doodab View Post
            I've always considered 90 minutes the point at which endurance cycling training starts. Most reasonably fit people can keep going for about that long, it's a sort of natural duration, but going longer requires specific training (not least for your arse, which can get a bit sore) and the best training is time spent exercising after that initial 90 minutes.

            Forget the intensity at first. You need to go long and low with a short low intensity recovery the day after. The usual 3 or 4 week cycles of building up then easing off work well, but build the duration not the intensity.

            I usually make sat or sun 'long ride' day as it's easier to fit in, ideally I try and fit in another 'long' (i.e. over 90 minute) midweek ride once the weekend ones are up to 3-4 hrs.
            So if I do 2.5 hours this saturday and then 3 next weekend with riding a few times when I get the chance in between, and then try to add 30 minutes each weekend plus interval work on weekdays am I on the right track?

            I know I have to resist the urge to go hard at it but I feel like I look a bit of a prat riding slowly on a racing bike, but maybe I shouldn't care about that. I suppose I'll look less of a prat than a bloke who gives up after 90 minutes.
            And what exactly is wrong with an "ad hominem" argument? Dodgy Agent, 16-5-2014

            Comment


              #7
              Maybe you could find somewhere about 3 hours away to go to for lunch/whatever so you are cycling for long periods as a means of transport rather than exercise, to get used to it?
              Originally posted by MaryPoppins
              I'd still not breastfeed a nazi
              Originally posted by vetran
              Urine is quite nourishing

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by d000hg View Post
                Maybe you could find somewhere about 3 hours away to go to for lunch/whatever so you are cycling for long periods as a means of transport rather than exercise, to get used to it?
                Good idea, but I'm guessing I shouldn't really be looking in the Michelin guide for the lunch spot?
                And what exactly is wrong with an "ad hominem" argument? Dodgy Agent, 16-5-2014

                Comment


                  #9
                  1. [QUOTE=I'm noticing that the long endurance ride leaves me tired for a few days afterwards in which interval training or strength training just doesn't work. .[/QUOTE]

                  technical term for that is bonking

                  2. [QUOTE=What should I be doing to improve endurance to keep riding all day? .[/QUOTE]

                  NOOOOOOOooooooooo start small, build and mix it up, same as running really: couple of long ones, couple of short ones, couple of really fast ones and a couple of recovery ones. If you have time to structure - google other forums and training plans. I have an indoor trainer and dvds - because I am soft

                  3. [QUOTE= Should I spend some weeks just doing nothing but endurance and maybe drop the interval work for a while? .[/QUOTE]

                  To what end, honestly.

                  OK, let me introduce you to the world of nutrition.

                  You can be as fancy (Powerade et al.) or tight (jam sandwiches) as you like.

                  Everyone is different but for me x1 800ml of fluid per hour is normal, after 3 hours if I havent had caffine I'll cry so out come the gels.

                  You need to find a balance too little food/water and you leave yourself open to long recovery and compromising your immune system or too much food/water and a world of stomach pain and more

                  First time I was doing 5+ hours on the bike I set my watch to beep every 15 mins: eat or drink something, just a small amount, but get into the habit of putting stuff in. Remember you are not eating/hydrating for now, it takes ~15 mins to hit your legs so dont wait until you are dehydrated before you drink.

                  A good test I did ages ago was to eat a snickers on an empty stomach and immediately start to run, took 25mins for me to feel the snickers hit my legs - it is like getting a new pair of legs. Play around with it until you find yours. Product wise I aim to get used to what is available on the couse, whatever is being provided I get used to, some delicate souls prefer to carry a days-worth with them - everyone to their own .... and then there is brillo
                  Last edited by Dallas; 11 January 2013, 13:43. Reason: typos

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Mich the Tester View Post
                    Good idea, but I'm guessing I shouldn't really be looking in the Michelin guide for the lunch spot?
                    Why not, just don't go for a full bottle of wine.
                    Originally posted by MaryPoppins
                    I'd still not breastfeed a nazi
                    Originally posted by vetran
                    Urine is quite nourishing

                    Comment

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