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NorthWestPerm2Contr
18th April 2013, 10:51
To get £200/day.

WTF is wrong with these NHS guys trying to bring talent into the organisation and insisting on them having NHS experience whilst paying a ludicrously low rate.

It is tantamount to telling somebody: You are asked to apply for this shoe shining job but in order to qualify for it you must have experience of wiping my a$$

Mich the Tester
18th April 2013, 10:53
To get £200/day.

WTF is wrong with these NHS guys trying to bring talent into the organisation and insisting on them having NHS experience whilst paying a ludicrously low rate.

It is tantamount to telling somebody: You are asked to apply for this shoe shining job but in order to qualify for it you must have experience of wiping my a$$

People with experience of other, more effective organisations might bring in good ideas that derail somebody's gravy train.

NorthWestPerm2Contr
18th April 2013, 10:55
People with experience of other, more effective organisations might bring in good ideas that derail somebody's gravy train.

£200/day gravy train?

northernladuk
18th April 2013, 10:56
That is the NHS for you. It is a very strange place to work. When I moved on the the NW spine as part of NPFiT (or summat like that) we had a half day induction just on the culture of the NHS as it would be a shock to those that have just come of a defense or bank project.

They don't do desk banging high pressure deadlines as the NHS IT guys are so under pressure as it is and just don't get paid enough for it so it's kids gloves. If you go in demanding change, hitting tight deadlines and get upset at delays you won't last a week so they have to have someone with experience.

I wouldn't assume the want NHS experience as it makes you specialised like you would expect when you are going for a banking gig. It's about knowing the culture and being proven to put up with it IMO......

The fact the rates are rubbish isn't really related as it would be in other industrys

Mich the Tester
18th April 2013, 10:57
£200/day gravy train?

No, the Crap Gemini/Accidenture/Logicack/<insert relevant insultancy> gravy train.

NorthWestPerm2Contr
18th April 2013, 10:58
That is the NHS for you. It is a very strange place to work. When I moved on the the NW spine as part of NPFiT (or summat like that) we had a half day induction just on the culture of the NHS as it would be a shock to those that have just come of a defense or bank project.

They don't do desk banging high pressure deadlines as the NHS IT guys are so under pressure as it is and just don't get paid enough for it so it's kids gloves. If you go in demanding change, hitting tight deadlines and get upset at delays you won't last a week so they have to have someone with experience.

I wouldn't assume the want NHS experience as it makes you specialised like you would expect when you are going for a banking gig. It's about knowing the culture and being proven to put up with it IMO......

Must be absolute fools: We only want people who can put up with the tulipness of the NHS rather than those who are willing to do something about it!

Mich the Tester
18th April 2013, 11:00
Must be absolute fools: We only want people who can put up with the tulipness of the NHS rather than those who are willing to do something about it!

Yep, many organisations seem to follow that logic. I wish I could do something about it. Christians seem to have found a way of dealing with this;

"God, give us grace to accept with serenity
the things that cannot be changed,
courage to change the things
which should be changed,
and the wisdom to distinguish
the one from the other."

bobspud
18th April 2013, 11:02
Remember that you are not necessarily being punished by not being allowed in!

I have some (three weeks to clear up a seriously screwed up account) experience of NHS and the personalities involved made the MOD look like a bastion of efficiency and effectiveness :tumble:

NorthWestPerm2Contr
18th April 2013, 11:09
Remember that you are not necessarily being punished by not being allowed in!

I have some (three weeks to clear up a seriously screwed up account) experience of NHS and the personalities involved made the MOD look like a bastion of efficiency and effectiveness :tumble:

Don't really want to go in on the rates they are offering.... Just find it stupid I get calls asking if I would accept £200/day AND that I must have NHS experience in order to get it!

northernladuk
18th April 2013, 11:18
Don't really want to go in on the rates they are offering.... Just find it stupid I get calls asking if I would accept £200/day AND that I must have NHS experience in order to get it!

Indeed but understand they are different things. Your experience is nothing to do with the rate, it is whether you will survive in the environment. It doesn't make you more valuable in this case.

When you have done a stint with them it will become very clear.

I haven't done it and correct me if I am wrong but isn't the requirement for having history in IB's the same situation, not because you are the greatest contractor, just you can survive in an unusually high pressure environment where the ability to make money means more than anything else?

DodgyAgent
18th April 2013, 11:24
I am just sending some people for interview

http://www.bigskygypsy.com/Images/gypsy%20caravans.jpg

nomadd
18th April 2013, 12:35
To get £200/day.

And forced to be inside IR35.

Might as well work at McDonalds.

cojak
18th April 2013, 12:40
And forced to be inside IR35.

Might as well work at McDonalds.

Yep, it's probably got to do with that - they're probably trying to bring people in below the £220 pd limit.

KentPhilip
18th April 2013, 13:12
Is it not possibly one of these cases where the client tries to hire at this low rate, finds nobody, then uses this as justification for shipping someone in from overseas?

NorthWestPerm2Contr
18th April 2013, 13:38
Is it not possibly one of these cases where the client tries to hire at this low rate, finds nobody, then uses this as justification for shipping someone in from overseas?

So somebody from India is going to have that NHS experience then?

BA to the Stars
18th April 2013, 13:40
So somebody from India is going to have that NHS experience then?

Half of the doctors? :eyes

Mich the Tester
18th April 2013, 13:43
So somebody from India is going to have that NHS experience then?

Yes, I am being highly experiencing and certified in updation of all systems relating to Nagpur Health Service as recent as today morning. Much quickness, plenty cheapness. Yes.

Yours most thoroughly faithfully and sincerely,

Bob S Hawadi-Wadi II PhD, MSc, MBA

istvan
18th April 2013, 13:44
Is it not possibly one of these cases where the client tries to hire at this low rate, finds nobody, then uses this as justification for shipping someone in from overseas?

+1. With NHS experience from Hyderabad?

Mich the Tester
18th April 2013, 13:45
With NHS experience from Hyderabad?

Yes, National Hyderabad Service experience, yes indeed.

KentPhilip
18th April 2013, 13:52
Yes, National Hyderabad Service experience, yes indeed.

Exactly :happy

NibblyPig
18th April 2013, 14:51
Similar situation (at least money wise) with most public sector jobs I think. Recently got a call about a qualified .NET position (market rate around £280/day here) for the local council, paying £15-20/hour.

Mich the Tester
18th April 2013, 15:04
Similar situation (at least money wise) with most public sector jobs I think. Recently got a call about a qualified .NET position (market rate around £280/day here) for the local council, paying £15-20/hour.

Dutch tax office are asking for testers; demanding you work the first two weeks for free and then accept 40 euros per hour. I tactfully explained to the agent that I already have a contract and they might be looking at a different segment of the market anyway.

nomadd
18th April 2013, 15:24
Yes, I am being highly experiencing and certified in updation of all systems relating to Nagpur Health Service as recent as today morning. Much quickness, plenty cheapness. Yes.

Yours most thoroughly faithfully and sincerely,

Bob S Hawadi-Wadi II PhD, MSc, MBA

Wanna buy some fresh kidneys? One owner, hardly used. Can supply other (body) parts on request. PM for details.

bobspud
18th April 2013, 16:25
Is it not possibly one of these cases where the client tries to hire at this low rate, finds nobody, then uses this as justification for shipping someone in from overseas?

No they are not that clever. It's just a passing fad. Not very long ago I had an approach from an agent offering 750 for a lead architect role...

stek
18th April 2013, 16:28
No they are not that clever. It's just a passing fad. Not very long ago I had an approach from an agent offering 750 for a lead architect role...

There's TA roles 80k perm at CfH in Leeds!

eek
18th April 2013, 17:03
No they are not that clever. It's just a passing fad. Not very long ago I had an approach from an agent offering 750 for a lead architect role...

Someone saw the fact that contracts need to be less than £220 a day and used that to set the rate. It won't last long.

darmstadt
18th April 2013, 17:21
Dutch tax office are asking for testers; demanding you work the first two weeks for free and then accept 40 euros per hour. I tactfully explained to the agent that I already have a contract and they might be looking at a different segment of the market anyway.

Volkswagen Bank in Wolfsburg tried something like that with me. First 2 weeks were to be a freebie and then every 1 week in 4 would be as well. I said yes but only at a rate which was double they were offering plus expenses. That shut the greedy ****ers up

darmstadt
18th April 2013, 17:23
To get £200/day.

WTF is wrong with these NHS guys trying to bring talent into the organisation and insisting on them having NHS experience whilst paying a ludicrously low rate.

It is tantamount to telling somebody: You are asked to apply for this shoe shining job but in order to qualify for it you must have experience of wiping my a$$

Surely any visit, say a week or 2, in a hospital is NHS experience, I would suggest telling them that you were in hospital having your tonsils out and does that count?

bobspud
18th April 2013, 18:41
Someone saw the fact that contracts need to be less than £220 a day and used that to set the rate. It won't last long.

This ^

I think there are many departments that are running scared from the treasury guidelines. More worrying is the few perms that seriously resent our wages (who wouldn't?) and would like to drag us down to their level.

Ether way it will sort itself out after a few major screw ups or the big boys will move in and teach them what unprotected anal sex with an elephant feels like...
Either way society will be the losers again...

jmo21
18th April 2013, 21:15
Yes, National Hyderabad Service experience, yes indeed.

I spent 2 weeks in Hyderabad a few years back. It was shite!

portseven
19th April 2013, 07:23
Coming to the end of a 6 month with NHS, could have pushed for longer but had enough of the no / slow results culture. Very top heavy too, colleague of mine who is doing work, has 7 'directors' to report to.

Going back to Banking.....

Pogle
19th April 2013, 09:15
I did an NHS contract a while back as it was local.
Never ever ever ever ever ever ever again.
I'd rather get a permie job with Accenture than work in the NHS again!