Now it emerges that the World Wars were fought in vain ....

[sasguru]

... and Germany is the de facto dominant power in Europe, what are we to conclude?

[DimPrawn]

... and Germany is the de facto dominant power in Europe, what are we to conclude?

That you are a first class Cretin?

[suityou01]

... and Germany is the de facto dominant power in Europe, what are we to conclude?

Sat in the pub last night with two colleagues having the exact same discussion.

I concluded that the fallen heroes were the very reason we were able to sit there in peace time getting sozzled on Hefe Weissen.

We also concluded that Britain is fooked, never really was a part of Europe and after 60 years of governments borrowing like fook to pay for promises made to get votes the pendulum is well and truly about to swing back.

Also we concluded that the euro project was largely a failure in that it is happy enough to dictate the shape of a banana, but not a level of taxation for each of it's nations.

We are Germany's bitch now, so best to accept it, rake in the coins and not worry too much as the inevitable will happen.

[Mich the Tester]

... and Germany is the de facto dominant power in Europe, what are we to conclude?

Erm, I think Germany is somewhat accidentally the dominant power in Europe. Conclude? Stop believing that services alone can keep a large economy afloat, stop teaching crap like Golf Course Management or personal shopper qualifications, stop discouraging mobility, support high tech and manufacturing, turn 'business studies' into a training for people who already have skills instead of an undergrad degree and make high quality stuff people want to buy, like BMWs, Mercedes, Siemens, Bosch, AEG and others, where you'll struggle to get anywhere near the boardroom without having serious technological nouse.

Or move to Germany.

[original PM]

yeah - hmm I think the fact that one of the main outcomes of ww2 was the downfall of the third reich and nazi party.

This meant that countries could run themselves and as suity says we enjoy many freedoms today.

The fact that German seems to be taking over Europe by stealth is down to many things but ultimately it is driven by personal greed and an interest in self and not what a combined Europe should be.

Having said that at least Germany is run by the Nazi Party (I think!)

[suityou01]

yeah - hmm I think the fact that one of the main outcomes of ww2 was the downfall of the third reich and nazi party.

This meant that countries could run themselves and as suity says we enjoy many freedoms today.

The fact that German seems to be taking over Europe by stealth is down to many things but ultimately it is driven by personal greed and an interest in self and not what a combined Europe should be.

Having said that at least Germany is run by the Nazi Party (I think!)

Not even close. Merkel is a pussy cat.

[Mich the Tester]

The fact that German seems to be taking over Europe by stealth is down to many things but ultimately it is driven by personal greed and an interest in self and not what a combined Europe should be.

No, Germany is in charge because Germany has the money. It has the money because it has a track record of good government spending mostly within its means in the post war period and well run businesses producing good stuff that people all over the world want to buy. In the meantime, other European countries fooked themselves up. Arguably it's German enlightenment philosophy and work ethic that's at the basis of this, but the same time German enlightenment philosophy arguably ended up being abused and led to the bloody mess of two world wars. Read some Kant, Nietzsche, Hegel, Schopenhauer etc.

[amcdonald]

If Germany really was in charge, surely at least our trains would run on time

[suityou01]

No, Germany is in charge because Germany has the money. It has the money because it has a track record of good government spending mostly within its means in the post war period and well run businesses producing good stuff that people all over the world want to buy. In the meantime, other European countries fooked themselves up. Arguably it's German enlightenment philosophy and work ethic that's at the basis of this, but the same time German enlightenment philosophy arguably ended up being abused and led to the bloody mess of two world wars. Read some Kant, Nietzsche, Hegel, Schopenhauer etc.

Yep work set them free.

[Mich the Tester]

Not even close. Merkel is a pussy cat.

Schröder made people think he was a pussycat and a lefty, but his government set up the Hartz reforms which have helped make Germany's economy so strong recently. Merkel makes people think she's an iron lady and a capitalist, but she's starting to disappoint.