Contracting / Seeking Govt Help

**SimonMac** · 11 November 2013, 15:59

Originally posted by evilagent View Post

preamble:
I have been running my own company for coming onto 11 years, and work as a freelance software developer, and also as a recruiter in my niche area.
I have been interacting with this site for a few months.

question:
I have noticed there have been a few threads about Job Seekers Allowance, and getting govt to pay stuff (the details escape me), and I wonder if this is a new phenomenon?

What I mean is, I thought we were freelancers, independent business owners, etc.
I don't understand what appears to be a tendency to fall on govt help the moment a gig ends.

I am sure there are individual circumstances, etc, but shouldn't govt help be a last resort?

What would be the trigger for you to seek additional govt help in your search for a gig?

There are two schools of thought on this.

1) If I am entitled to it (and most who do try and claim it genuinely are if they are benched and stop all other forms of income including dividends) I will claim it

2) Its too much hassle and as most "good" contractors will easily have £6,000 in savings for when they are benched its a hassle that most do not want unless you are Welsh.

**MPwannadecentincome** · 11 November 2013, 16:02

my trigger is running out of money - which in my case will be beginning of January

**Old Greg** · 11 November 2013, 16:08

Originally posted by SimonMac View Post

There are two schools of thought on this.

1) If I am entitled to it (and most who do try and claim it genuinely are if they are benched and stop all other forms of income including dividends) I will claim it

2) Its too much hassle and as most "good" contractors will easily have £6,000 in savings for when they are benched its a hassle that most do not want unless you are Welsh.

I think the complexity is around what constitutes unemployment. I have no problem with someone claiming contribution based (therefore not means tested) JSA if they have savings and are unemployed, because the have paid National INSURANCE. I don't think it's right to be out of a contract and then 'make yourself redundant' from your company when there is money in the company to pay your salary, and then rehire yourself when you have a contract. It seems like a fiddle to me, even if it may be allowed.

**Bellona** · 11 November 2013, 16:09

I'll admit to being confused ( easily done !) by these posts too, but unlike the OP am new to contracting.

I am only employee of Ltd Co.
I am on the bench ( coming up to 2 months now), but still pay myself minimum (PAYE) wages even though I am on the bench. Use my warchest from last dividends for day to day living: I thought that was what warchests were for.

Surely I couldn't claim JSA ( not that I intend to ) unless I sacked myself ?

**Old Greg** · 11 November 2013, 16:13

Originally posted by Bellona View Post

I'll admit to being confused ( easily done !) by these posts too, but unlike the OP am new to contracting.

I am only employee of Ltd Co.
I am on the bench ( coming up to 2 months now), but still pay myself minimum (PAYE) wages even though I am on the bench. Use my warchest from last dividends for day to day living: I thought that was what warchests were for.

Surely I couldn't claim JSA ( not that I intend to ) unless I sacked myself ?

I believe people are sacking themselves.

**northernladuk** · 11 November 2013, 16:15

Originally posted by Old Greg View Post

I think the complexity is around what constitutes unemployment. I have no problem with someone claiming contribution based (therefore not means tested) JSA if they have savings and are unemployed, because the have paid National INSURANCE. I don't think it's right to be out of a contract and then 'make yourself redundant' from your company when there is money in the company to pay your salary, and then rehire yourself when you have a contract. It seems like a fiddle to me, even if it may be allowed.

This is my feeling as well. It maybe allowed reading the letter of the rules but it just seem to be part of running a business. Seems ridiculous that we want to use loopholes available to small business and spend a lot of time trying to understand and defend ourselves for legislation aimed at small businesses yet people want to run to JSA the minute they don't have any work. I don't need to and personally wouldn't but other people that haven't been able to, or are too daft to build a warchest might feel the need. Maybe it is just about situation.
Not having a warchest to fall back on for a month or so is a pretty poor situation though bearing in mind the way we work and the fact it is 100% certain you will need to fall back on it at some point or another in the not too distant future.

If this becomes more prevalent the govt will attempt to clamp down on it but you can guarantee it will be a bloody poor attempt judging by past experiences.

**minestrone** · 11 November 2013, 16:16

If I was hard up I would do it, no question.

But by that point I would be so numb from having to let the staff go I would be past caring.

**MPwannadecentincome** · 11 November 2013, 16:20

Originally posted by northernladuk View Post

Not having a warchest to fall back on for a month or so is a pretty poor situation though bearing in mind the way we work and the fact it is 100% certain you will need to fall back on it at some point or another in the not too distant future.

Having a (soon to be ex) wife trying to spend the money sometimes means that warchests are difficult to build up in the first place - bitch doesn't understand the concept of "saving for a rainy day"

**malvolio** · 11 November 2013, 16:25

See. If you read the PCG's guide, all would become clear...

JSA is not means tested, so if forty-odd quid a week will help then fine. All you have to be is unemployed with a P45. You paid the taxes that put it there, so what's the problem, beyond having to deal with Jobcentre world. After that it gets complicated. For example stuff like mortgage interest relief is means tested.

Personally I aim to keep six month's money handy at all times. Not everyone can.

Contracting / Seeking Govt Help