Climate change and Ocean fertilisation

[DodgyAgent]

As the Warsaw convention on climate change draws to a close having given every fanatical climate change puritan the opportunity to bolster their credentials (by walking out of a conference they should never have been invited to in the first place) Warsaw Climate Change Conference - November 2013 we see the usual scrap fpr power and let's face it money.

I found this article that embodies everything that the climate change nutters are about:

The Greens

What happened was an American millionaire businessman (hang him) "dumped" a whole load of iron in the sea next to a village in South america without any permission from any higher authority and the sh*t hit the fan. The fact that fish grew and the villagers were happy was neither here nor there.

[darmstadt]

Apparently at the conference, lobbyists outnumbered attendees ant the highest proportion of lobbyists were from the coal industry...Make what you will of that....

Amy Goodman: Corporate Lobbyists Flood Warsaw Climate Talks - Truthdig
http://corporateeurope.org/blog/cop1...orate-lobbying

[DodgyAgent]

Apparently at the conference, lobbyists outnumbered attendees ant the highest proportion of lobbyists were from the coal industry...Make what you will of that....

Amy Goodman: Corporate Lobbyists Flood Warsaw Climate Talks - Truthdig
http://corporateeurope.org/blog/cop1...orate-lobbying

You mean someone is at the conference promoting their own self interest?

[darmstadt]

You mean someone is at the conference promoting their own self interest?

I suspect the only people at this, or in fact any other, conference not promoting their own self interests are the poor buggers working for the conference hall owner...

[hyperD]

Nothing quite so entertaining as a load of dramagreens frothing at the mouth of cognitive dissonance. Well, apart from a masturbating chimpanzee in a glass cage.

[DodgyAgent]

Nothing quite so entertaining as a load of dramagreens frothing at the mouth of cognitive dissonance. Well, apart from a masturbating chimpanzee in a glass cage.

If they are that "passionate" about halting climate change why don't they set up businesses, make vast fortunes and use it to build wind farms everywhere? Is AtW in Warsaw?

[pjclarke]

Hmmm ... here's what happened, Russ George, the former chief executive of the defunct Planktos Inc whose previous failed efforts to conduct large-scale commercial dumps near the Galapagos and Canary Islands led to his vessels being barred from ports by the Spanish and Ecuadorean governments pursuaded the villagers of Haida to fund the dumping of iron suplhate into the nearby ocean to stimulate plankton and therefore salmon growth. The theory is that this mimics the natural depositing of volcanic mineral dust which is known to fertilise the seas. Trouble is, nobody knows if it works, and we won't actually know if the fish stocks were boosted, or what the unintended side-effects are (e.g. nutrient depletion downstream of the experinment area) until next year, and dumping such pollutants in the sea is illegal for vey good reasons:

It is difficult if not impossible to detect and describe important effects that we know might occur months or years later," said John Cullen , an oceanographer at Dalhousie University. "Some possible effects, such as deep-water oxygen depletion and alteration of distant food webs, should rule out ocean manipulation. History is full of examples of ecological manipulations that backfired.

It is likely we will never have proper scientific assessment of the 'experiment'

...signs the experiment was lacking in traditional scientific rigour showed through. Dozens of foam pool noodles were dropped off the side of the boat, supposedly to track the currents. But only one person on the scientific team — the sonar operator, Peter Gross — had a graduate degree, in physics. The chief biologist, Tegan Sime, was hired straight out of university. The mechanical engineer had more work experience as a soft drink ambassador, according to the LinkedIn page of David Gourlay.

Most important, the “chief scientist” did not have a university degree, although he is sometimes referred to as Dr. George, a reference to the initials for Darcy Russ George. His own LinkedIn page lists his education as “the school of hard knocks.”

And it appears George may have not been entirely frank with his backers :

The president of the Haida nation, Guujaaw, said the village was told the dump would environmentally benefit the ocean, which is crucial to their livelihood and culture.

"The village people voted to support what they were told was a 'salmon enhancement project' and would not have agreed if they had been told of any potential negative effects or that it was in breach of an international convention," Guujaaw said

Which may be why they have since fired him

This thread embodies everything that under-researched, knee-jerk anti-scientists are about.

Source 1

Source 2

[DodgyAgent]

Hmmm ... here's what happened, Russ George, the former chief executive of the defunct Planktos Inc whose previous failed efforts to conduct large-scale commercial dumps near the Galapagos and Canary Islands led to his vessels being barred from ports by the Spanish and Ecuadorean governments pursuaded the villagers of Haida to fund the dumping of iron suplhate into the nearby ocean to stimulate plankton and therefore salmon growth. The theory is that this mimics the natural depositing of volcanic mineral dust which is known to fertilise the seas. Trouble is, nobody knows if it works, and we won't actually know if the fish stocks were boosted, or what the unintended side-effects are (e.g. nutrient depletion downstream of the experinment area) until next year, and dumping such pollutants in the sea is illegal for vey good reasons:



It is likely we will never have proper scientific assessment of the 'experiment'



And it appears George may have not been entirely frank with his backers :



Which may be why they have since fired him

This thread embodies everything that under-researched, knee-jerk anti-scientists are about.

Source 1

Source 2

Which entirely proves my point. The last thing these people wish to see is a solution to climate change. What is interesting is that we are perfectly happy dumping millions of tons of just about everything into the oceans and then when someone drops a few hundred tons of Iron (how many sunken ships is that do you think) there is a lot of talk of possible consequences.

Instead of looking at the positive aspects of the technology (such as it seemed to work an the villagers of the tribe were happy) the left wing press and climate change establishment smear it firstly by using the word "dumping" and then by referring to this guy as a "millionaire"

If a scientist were to look at this positively it would be pretty obvious that the basic concept is pretty sound. The "dumping" of iron is clumsy and probably highly inefficient and therefore expensive. You are probably feeding the harmful blue algae as well as the zooplankton that feed into the skeletal organism food chain. These are two such examples that I know have been already overcome. (cos I am now a scientist )

In Australia they are even trying to get Ocean fertilisation banned when instead they should be pooling information to further research it. The Japanese have given up on paying out vast amounts of money on complying with International climate change rules and are instead using the money to develop new technology.

If the money spent on supporting these climate change quangos was used instead to investigate new technologies the world would be a better place. During world war two the greatest advances in technology were made and they were done without the tribes of hangers on going to conferences and whining about problems.

[BlasterBates]

No worries this is the greens last gasp. In 5 years the green movement will be more or less dead, wiped out by falling temperatures and growing ice caps. Hard to demonstrate about global warming in a snow storm.

Here is something interesting:

50% of climate scientists think AGW is bunk:

The 97% consensus myth – busted by a real survey | Watts Up With That?

...these are hard core atmospheric scientists and meteorologists, not Social Scientists with a degree in Georgraphy and a Greenpeace membership card.

[DodgyAgent]

No worries this is the greens last gasp. In 5 years the green movement will be more or less dead.

Here is something interesting:

50% of climate scientists think AGW is bunk:

The 97% consensus myth – busted by a real survey | Watts Up With That?


...these are hard core atmospheric scientists and meteorologists, not Social Scientists with a degree in Georgraphy and a Greenpeace membership card.

There is a real irony here. The Haida are defending the human right to act as stewards of nature, while the warmists, who claim to be the elite of the most sophisticated society the world has ever seen, call for submission to the limits of the primitive earth. The Haida support scientific research to advance the human condition, while the allegedly cultured warmists superstitiously insist that such knowledge is to be shunned, and its practitioners suppressed. One must ask: Which side represents civilization?



What then will all the Green lefties have in their bank to consign everyone to the dark ages I wonder?