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  1. #11

    I live on CUK

    Old Greg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by original PM View Post
    But not a European Super State with a centralised dictatorship though.

    Not quite the fooking same is it?
    That would be why he opposed the Nazis and supported a European association of independent nations, such as the EU.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bean
    I admit that I'm a lazy lying cretin, but so what?
    25 June 2018

  2. #12

    Nice But Dim

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    Quote Originally Posted by original PM View Post
    1930 was a long time ago.

    You know before the Germans decide to murder 6 million innocent people because they did not fit the profile.

    Before the Spanish civil war

    And the greek civil war

    And the Italian civil war

    In fact it would probably be fair to say that Europe in 1930 was a completely different place than Europe in 1950.

    So it would also I imagine be fair to say that people's views and attitudes may also have changed.
    He also said in 1950 during a debate on the Schuman Plan.
    Hansard, June 27th 1950

    Quote Originally Posted by Winston Churchill
    No one can contend that sovereignty will be affected by our participation in the discussions in Paris which are the subject of our Motion and the Amendment tonight. They are well protected by the cumulative safeguards which I mentioned earlier. Nevertheless, there is a great moral and idealistic issue which, though irrelevant to our immediate purpose, has been stirred by the discussions which have taken place. We are asked in a challenging way: "Are you prepared to part with any degree of national sovereignty in any circumstances for the sake of a larger synthesis?" My right hon. Friend the Member for Warwick and Leamington, with his prolonged experience in foreign affairs, has faced the issue, hypothetical though it be, plainly 2159 and squarely. The Conservative and Liberal Parties say, without hesitation, that we are prepared to consider, and if convinced to accept, the abrogation of national sovereignty, provided that we are satisfied with the conditions and the safeguards.

    Nay, I will go further and say that for the sake of world organisation we would even run risks and make sacrifices. We fought alone against tyranny for a whole year, not purely from national motives. It is true that our lives depended upon our doing so, but we fought the better because we felt with conviction that it was not only our own cause but a world cause for which the Union Jack was kept flying in 1940 and 1941. The soldier who laid down his life, the mother who wept for her son, and the wife who lost her husband, got inspiration or comfort, and felt a sense of being linked with the universal and the eternal by the fact that we fought for what was precious not only for ourselves but for mankind. The Conservative and Liberal Parties declare that national sovereignty is not inviolable, and that it may be resolutely diminished for the sake of all the men in all the lands finding their way home together.
    You don't see the Leavers rolling that one out though do you?

    In fact they only way they could get Winston "on board" was to actually fabricate a quote from two completely unrelated occasions over 20 years apart.
    Last edited by DaveB; 18th June 2019 at 08:28.
    "Being nice costs nothing and sometimes gets you extra bacon" - Pondlife.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Whorty View Post
    Someone needs to research Hansard and confirm what he really said rather than relying on xenophobic lies from the internet

    Here's a clue, he supported the creation of a United States of Europe, sponsored by the UK, USSR and the USA.
    FTFY.

    He supported us helping in the creation of, never did he say we should join.
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Greg
    Given that you refuse to work for Jews, because you believe that they are only out for themselves and that they see gentiles as just there to be used, WGAS what you think.
    You do me old chum, obviously

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Greg View Post
    Churchy says that May Day is a Zionist Occupation Government conspiracy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Greg
    Only it is somewhat suspicious that this unsubstantiated claim has been made against the object of Alt-Right antisemitic conspiracy lies.

  4. #14

    Nice But Dim

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zigenare View Post
    FTFY.

    He supported us helping in the creation of, never did he say we should join.
    Actually he did.

    Winston S. Churchill: His Complete Speeches Vol. 8 page 8681
    July 1957, Westminster Hall Speech:

    He welcomed the formation of a ‘common market’ by the six, provided that, “the whole of free Europe will have access.” He added, “we genuinely wish to join.”
    August 1961
    LETTERS No longer relevant >> 12 Jun 1993 >> The Spectator Archive
    “I think that the Government are right to apply to join the European Economic Community...”
    Churchill supported the ‘welding’ of West Germany, France, Italy, Belgium, Holland and Luxembourg into ‘an organic whole’, which he described as a ‘happy outcome’ of the European Economic Community. Churchill added:
    "We might well play a great part in these developments to the profit of not only ourselves, but of our European friends also."
    You might also want to consider the opinions of his family, who actually knew him.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Nicholas Soames, Churchills Grandson
    Sir Nicholas told The Independent newspaper:
    “Winston Churchill was a profound believer in the values of European co-operation and the need for it, and I am very disappointed to see these people twisting his views to suit their own ends.”
    Last edited by DaveB; 18th June 2019 at 08:42. Reason: Typo
    "Being nice costs nothing and sometimes gets you extra bacon" - Pondlife.

  5. #15

    More fingers than teeth

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    The UK won't be the UK for very long after it leaves in October.

    Britain’s Next Prime Minister Has Probably Already Lost Scotland

    England will be so busy trying to sort out its own split that Europe will be able to kick "rest UK" around.

    I'm alright Jack

  6. #16

    More fingers than teeth

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    I find it quite amusing how all the Eurosceptics go on about the breakup Eurozone and are blind to their own country falling apart. If there is a "real Brexit" the pound also might fall apart.

    I'm alright Jack

  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by original PM View Post
    But not a European Super State with a centralised dictatorship though.

    Not quite the fooking same is it?
    There is no centralised dictatorship. That's just in your little paranoid head.

    Try reading and understanding what he really said, and not what you read on Facebook groups or other right wing lying sources. Also, I know Churchill is the hero of xenophobes, but he is only one man and it's not just his view that counts.

    FFS, you guys really are precious. Even when faced with fact your blinded hatred of others blinkers you
    I may not know Karate, but I know crazy and I'm not afraid to use it

  8. #18

    Prof Cunning @ Oxford Uni

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zigenare View Post
    FTFY.

    He supported us helping in the creation of, never did he say we should join.

    Only if you selectively twist his words and meanings.

    He's the kind of politician who would take up a rifle to fight against right wing extremism.

    Unlike Farage, who openly stated, with no comment about it being an allegory, that he would take up a rifle to fight anyone who disagreed with his right wing views.
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  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by WTFH View Post
    Only if you selectively twist his words and meanings.

    He's the kind of politician who would take up a rifle to fight against right wing extremism.

    Unlike Farage, who openly stated, with no comment about it being an allegory, that he would take up a rifle to fight anyone who disagreed with his right wing views.
    He didn't quite say that though, did he?

    Would you say that the "European Union" is a "Common Market", or something more?
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Greg
    Given that you refuse to work for Jews, because you believe that they are only out for themselves and that they see gentiles as just there to be used, WGAS what you think.
    You do me old chum, obviously

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Greg View Post
    Churchy says that May Day is a Zionist Occupation Government conspiracy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Greg
    Only it is somewhat suspicious that this unsubstantiated claim has been made against the object of Alt-Right antisemitic conspiracy lies.

  10. #20

    Contractor Among Contractors

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winston Churchill
    to accept, the abrogation of national sovereignty
    Surprised Old Greg et al haven't started a séance to ask Winston exactly how our sovereignty has been lost...
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Greg
    I admit I'm just a lazy, lying cretinous hypocrite and must be going deaf
    ♕Keep calm & carry on♕

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