CV query

[SteelyDan]

I can't find the previous thread on this.

How many years work history do you include on your CV?

To my mind, a CV (course of life) should reflect your whole working life, but as a contractor should I be including perm stuff dating back to the 80's?

Previous work stuff is no longer relevant to what I've done for the past 20 yrs, but thought it was the right thing to be doing...you know, honest & full disclosure of working history and all that...am I over exposing? Or should I just be covering contract related stuff and ditch the irrelevant historic work details (which are set out as bulleted line entries)?

Problem is, I think I'm getting knocked back for roles owing to the 'age' thing...but of course don't want to just show 20 years of work only as they'd probably be expecting a '30-something' turning up at interview.

Anyone able to offer some constructive advice? Thanks.

[simes]

A tough one as;

1. You are no longer expected to add your date of birth to a CV, but;
2. If you include schooling, then a quick mathematical bit of magic will determine that.
3. A common-ish (to be argued) belief is to demonstrate in detail the last 10 years of work, and;
4. For the purposes of a complete timeline, a common-ish (again, to be argued) belief is to line itemise other roles / companies, which again, will demonstrate age.

You could of course leave out the DoB and Not include a complete timeline.

Or, rejig the whole CV to make it Experience based, and/or Industry based, and leave out entirely the timeline. I must admit to not having test driven this one so have never experienced feedback on this format.

[SteelyDan]

A tough one as;

1. You are no longer expected to add your date of birth to a CV, but;
2. If you include schooling, then a quick mathematical bit of magic will determine that.
3. A common-ish (to be argued) belief is to demonstrate in detail the last 10 years of work, and;
4. For the purposes of a complete timeline, a common-ish (again, to be argued) belief is to line itemise other roles / companies, which again, will demonstrate age.

You could of course leave out the DoB and Not include a complete timeline.

Or, rejig the whole CV to make it Experience based, and/or Industry based, and leave out entirely the timeline. I must admit to not having test driven this one so have never experienced feedback on this format.

No, I've never included DoB or schooling..ever

[northernladuk]

I can't find the previous thread on this.

How many years work history do you include on your CV?

To my mind, a CV (course of life) should reflect your whole working life, but as a contractor should I be including perm stuff dating back to the 80's?

Previous work stuff is no longer relevant to what I've done for the past 20 yrs, but thought it was the right thing to be doing...you know, honest & full disclosure of working history and all that...am I over exposing? Or should I just be covering contract related stuff and ditch the irrelevant historic work details (which are set out as bulleted line entries)?

Problem is, I think I'm getting knocked back for roles owing to the 'age' thing...but of course don't want to just show 20 years of work only as they'd probably be expecting a '30-something' turning up at interview.

Anyone able to offer some constructive advice? Thanks.

You are not really selling your self as a valuable commodity to the business anymore. That's perm stuff. You are now focused on proving you have the skills and experience to be able to complete the task the client requires at the rate agreed. That puts a whole different slant on the CV. It is no longer the story of your life. It's a sales brochure for a particular gig.

Also think of the change in audience here. A permie recruitment manager may have the time to read the whole CV and has to determine you are asset to the organisation. An agent has about 60 seconds to make sure you are the best for his role. That alone should give a guide on where to start.

An agent is going to apply a google triangle approach to your CV spending a good 60 seconds max on it. Your main focus is to sell yourself in the first 1/2 page. If it's not blatantly obvious you are the man for the job at this point you are done. If you can do that the 2nd page onwards is more or less totally irrelevant. It can help to prove you've been doing the same stuff for a long time which will help if the other person he's looking at has only been doing it 2 years but you still need to get the attention from the agent first.

Personally I set a limit of 2 pages and fit what I can in on that, not keep adding stuff regardless of size. They simply won't read more than 2 pages. Anything over 4 and they'll probably pass it round the office and take the piss. Not good for your prospects.

Anything I did over 10 years ago and in permie land is a role title, company and dates. Nothing more. I keep adding that until I run out of space and then ignore the rest. I've got a good 10 years of roles missing of mine as it's a waste of time putting it on.

The first page is Profile (3/4 lines), skills (pick 4 of the most relevant to the role and then your gigs. Lots of information for each one so I've only got 2 on the first page. All bullet points are most relevant ones the new role is asking for. Each gig past that on page 2 start dropping in number of bullets to the point the roles are irrelvant so become just a one liner. Only degree or professional qualifications at the bottom, nothing else. No schools, GCSE, A levels. No hobbies or references or any of that crap.

There is a seminar coming up linked at the top which might be useful just as a double check for you.

EDIT : If you want to PM me I'll be happy to cast an eye over it. You need to get as much feed back on it, take the ideas and chose which to apply. I'm still tweaking mine 10 years in to contracting.

[northernladuk]

No, I've never included DoB or schooling..ever

Nor has anyone. It's just Simes' usual pointless posting.

[northernladuk]

A tough one as;

1. You are no longer expected to add your date of birth to a CV, but;
2. If you include schooling, then a quick mathematical bit of magic will determine that.
3. A common-ish (to be argued) belief is to demonstrate in detail the last 10 years of work, and;
4. For the purposes of a complete timeline, a common-ish (again, to be argued) belief is to line itemise other roles / companies, which again, will demonstrate age.

You could of course leave out the DoB and Not include a complete timeline.

Or, rejig the whole CV to make it Experience based, and/or Industry based, and leave out entirely the timeline. I must admit to not having test driven this one so have never experienced feedback on this format.

What a complete waste of internet space....

[SteelyDan]

You are not really selling your self as a valuable commodity to the business anymore. That's perm stuff. You are now focused on proving you have the skills and experience to be able to complete the task the client requires at the rate agreed. That puts a whole different slant on the CV. It is no longer the story of your life. It's a sales brochure for a particular gig.

Also think of the change in audience here. A permie recruitment manager may have the time to read the whole CV and has to determine you are asset to the organisation. An agent has about 60 seconds to make sure you are the best for his role. That alone should give a guide on where to start.

An agent is going to apply a google triangle approach to your CV spending a good 60 seconds max on it. Your main focus is to sell yourself in the first 1/2 page. If it's not blatantly obvious you are the man for the job at this point you are done. If you can do that the 2nd page onwards is more or less totally irrelevant. It can help to prove you've been doing the same stuff for a long time which will help if the other person he's looking at has only been doing it 2 years but you still need to get the attention from the agent first.

Personally I set a limit of 2 pages and fit what I can in on that, not keep adding stuff regardless of size. They simply won't read more than 2 pages. Anything over 4 and they'll probably pass it round the office and take the piss. Not good for your prospects.

Anything I did over 10 years ago and in permie land is a role title, company and dates. Nothing more. I keep adding that until I run out of space and then ignore the rest. I've got a good 10 years of roles missing of mine as it's a waste of time putting it on.

The first page is Profile (3/4 lines), skills (pick 4 of the most relevant to the role and then your gigs. Lots of information for each one so I've only got 2 on the first page. All bullet points are most relevant ones the new role is asking for. Each gig past that on page 2 start dropping in number of bullets to the point the roles are irrelvant so become just a one liner. Only degree or professional qualifications at the bottom, nothing else. No schools, GCSE, A levels. No hobbies or references or any of that crap.

There is a seminar coming up linked at the top which might be useful just as a double check for you.

EDIT : If you want to PM me I'll be happy to cast an eye over it. You need to get as much feed back on it, take the ideas and chose which to apply. I'm still tweaking mine 10 years in to contracting.

Anything I did over 10 years ago and in permie land is a role title, company and dates. Nothing more. I keep adding that until I run out of space and then ignore the rest. I've got a good 10 years of roles missing of mine as it's a waste of time putting it on.

I think I'll either a) ditch some of the older one liner roles which have no relevance today, or b) just remove the associated dates, & test the waters.

Great response, appreciated.

[northernladuk]

Anything I did over 10 years ago and in permie land is a role title, company and dates. Nothing more. I keep adding that until I run out of space and then ignore the rest. I've got a good 10 years of roles missing of mine as it's a waste of time putting it on.

I think I'll either a) ditch some of the older one liner roles which have no relevance today, or b) just remove the associated dates, & test the waters.

Great response, appreciated.

I've wanted to keep the one liners in as I've been working in some for of Service Management for 20 odd years and even though they are very old they are service related so thought it looked better. The stuff I did when I was an electrical engineer have gone. If the titles of the roles I have on were not related to my contracting career I'd have dropped those off as well. If you get what I am saying.

You are welcome.

[MonkeysUncle]

Nor has anyone. It's just Simes' usual pointless posting.

You say this but I just had to tell my cousin last week to take off his DOB AND Address!!!

But then he is just out of uni looking for graduate schemes! Naivety on his part

[MonkeysUncle]

To add to this.
My timeline of previous work is on the second page.
As a PM I have structured my CV to have Profile, skills/qualifications and a list of the my last few successful projects on the first page.

Second page is then a timeline of where I have worked with dates and a line as to what project was carried out there.

Seems to be working for me so far.