Ending a contract early - Dilemma

**northernladuk** · 29 March 2020, 19:00

Originally posted by ManiAnanth View Post

I have been asked to focus on only one project, when earlier, I was also working on a couple of other projects (all in the same technology). I used to be part of the meetings for the other projects but not any more. I no longer get invited to any of those meetings.

Well you've obviously got IR35 problems. Client telling you what to work on when is very bad for you, particularly at the moment. Did you get a determination before April? What's the score around that? IMO if they are treating you inside you've got to go anyway before the tax liability you will get stung for gets too big. You also mention the word manager a load of times. She/they are not your managers.

(loads of irrelevant hearsay and guessing stuff snipped)

Now, I have a 4 weeks notice with the agency and the agency has a 4 weeks notice with me and I have a confirmed offer for another contract (need to sign and send it latest by Tuesday).- direct with the client (no agency involved).

Ah.. now I see where this is going.

Admittedly, I would not be in the good books of the client (the agency may not care, as they would happily represent me if I am making them money - I hope?), but given that the manager is unhappy with what I am doing (imho, it is unwarranted and unsubstantiated as I have been delivering what the project requires but she is unhappy as she thinks that I was also getting involved, at the expense of not delivering my project, in certain other things in order to ensure best practices etc., all relating to the same technology).

In fact, I went over and beyond what was requested by writing coding guidelines and introducing design patterns etc., to a team which was using neither and solved some problems which the existing team could just not solve! :-)

Sounds like more D&C going on here...

I think the best option for me is to give notice and leave.

Agreed.

Questions:
The contract does not specify any penalty and I would be more than happy to serve the notice period of 4 weeks and do a complete and thorough hand over to the existing team. Apart from the fact that the client would not touch my CV with a 10 foot pole / the manager would not hire me again, is there anything else that I need to be concerned about?

Ah OK. Didn't go where I thought. I guessed you were going to ask about quitting earlier than the 4 week period.
If you plan to honour the notice period then no. You are adhering to the contract so no comeback at all. The one thing that might happen is the client bins you on the spot. No one wants someone who they already think is crap winding down. Just be prepared to be told not to come in tomorrow at any point during the 4 weeks.
You have no come back if they do. You are paid to do work. If they do not give you work you don't get paid. The 4 weeks will continue but you just don't earn any money. Effective instant dismissal.

This is my first contract (used to be a permanent employee for a number of years)

I think we are getting that with the terminology and IR35 issues you have.

and I have never had any issues with any of my previous employers. (Everywhere I have resigned, I have been asked to stay and have always been offered a pay rise.)

Doesn't matter what you put beyond this. YOU ARE NOT A PERMIE NOW. Anything you knew from those days are gone. You are a very expensive specialist supplier now. She is not your manager, she is your client. You and only you have to look after yourself now. You getting that. Very important... Anyway.. onwards.

Hence, a little bit of guilty feeling on me giving a notice. Should I just ignore that guilt and treat it as a business decision - i.e., the client is almost definite to terminate early / definitely not going to renew so look for other avenues?

Well you are a business now so why on earth wouldn't you treat it as a business decision. You do right not give notice so easily. It's not good to be constantly jumping ship and being mercenary but in this instance when you are just about to get the boot with another gig in the bag you'd be stupid not to. The world is turning to rat tulip with the IR35 changes and Covid stuff. Look after number one.
You've got to consider going to close down the IR35 risk you've put yourself at as well.

You really have to get all your perm thinking out of your head. You are a business now, they are your clients etc. If you don't look after yourself you'll be on the bench with no money coming in and believe me it's utter crap on the bench at the moment.

I'm assuming you aren't going to understand much about what IR35 is either.. Fix that pronto.

**ManiAnanth** · 29 March 2020, 19:17

Originally posted by northernladuk View Post

Well you've obviously got IR35 problems. Client telling you what to work on when is very bad for you, particularly at the moment. Did you get a determination before April? What's the score around that? IMO if they are treating you inside you've got to go anyway before the tax liability you will get stung for gets too big. You also mention the word manager a load of times. She/they are not your managers.

Ah.. now I see where this is going.

Sounds like more D&C going on here...

Agreed.

Ah OK. Didn't go where I thought. I guessed you were going to ask about quitting earlier than the 4 week period.
If you plan to honour the notice period then no. You are adhering to the contract so no comeback at all. The one thing that might happen is the client bins you on the spot. No one wants someone who they already think is crap winding down. Just be prepared to be told not to come in tomorrow at any point during the 4 weeks.
You have no come back if they do. You are paid to do work. If they do not give you work you don't get paid. The 4 weeks will continue but you just don't earn any money. Effective instant dismissal.

I think we are getting that with the terminology and IR35 issues you have.

Doesn't matter what you put beyond this. YOU ARE NOT A PERMIE NOW. Anything you knew from those days are gone. You are a very expensive specialist supplier now. She is not your manager, she is your client. You and only you have to look after yourself now. You getting that. Very important... Anyway.. onwards.

Well you are a business now so why on earth wouldn't you treat it as a business decision. You do right not give notice so easily. It's not good to be constantly jumping ship and being mercenary but in this instance when you are just about to get the boot with another gig in the bag you'd be stupid not to. The world is turning to rat tulip with the IR35 changes and Covid stuff. Look after number one.
You've got to consider going to close down the IR35 risk you've put yourself at as well.

You really have to get all your perm thinking out of your head. You are a business now, they are your clients etc. If you don't look after yourself you'll be on the bench with no money coming in and believe me it's utter crap on the bench at the moment.

I'm assuming you aren't going to understand much about what IR35 is either.. Fix that pronto.

OK, just a few clarifications then.

Manager - as in Project Manager working for the piece of work, not a line manager. Bad use of terminology on my part.
Yes, IR35 determination has been done with QDOS and it is definitely outside. The work as described in the contract is upgrade of legacy systems to new version of the same software and in some instances, a re-platform whereas in other instances just a standard upgrade of the underlying software. So, there is no day to day determination of tasks and no supervision as such - i.e., D&C is not an issue at all. I do not fix support issues for existing systems either.
I also have another contract with another company which is inside IR35 but the pay is not much, around £1500 per month which I have just signed and which, even though QDOS says is outside it is inside (and I am treating it as such) based on the working practices

Regarding

The one thing that might happen is the client bins you on the spot. No one wants someone who they already think is crap winding down. Just be prepared to be told not to come in tomorrow at any point during the 4 weeks. You have no come back if they do. You are paid to do work. If they do not give you work you don't get paid. The 4 weeks will continue but you just don't earn any money. Effective instant dismissal.

I do not get this. Sure, they can say that they do not need my services which is perfectly fine but then what does the 4 week notice with the agency imply then. I can then just go on with the new contract immediately which works out OK for me but can you clarify this part

They do not give you work, you don't get paid

then what is the whole point of the 4 week notice?

**ManiAnanth** · 29 March 2020, 19:33

Of course, I get this point, so they will not pay the consultancy...but my question was just the point about the notice period.

If the Consultancy is unable to provide the Services for any reason, it shall not be entitled to receive any
Fees in respect of the period of such inability.

**ladymuck** · 29 March 2020, 19:43

The notice period doesn't mean a huge amount. If there's no work, there's no pay. The client may want you to work your full notice period or they may say they no longer need you as they've got a replacement so toodle-pip.

If the new gig is a dead cert, the best excuse to get out early is to say you've picked up the coronavirus and can't work as you're too ill. If you're not working for a decent period, they'll soon want shot of you.

**Andy Hallett** · 29 March 2020, 19:47

Originally posted by ladymuck View Post

The notice period doesn't mean a huge amount. If there's no work, there's no pay. The client may want you to work your full notice period or they may say they no longer need you as they've got a replacement so toodle-pip.

If the new gig is a dead cert, the best excuse to get out early is to say you've picked up the coronavirus and can't work as you're too ill. If you're not working for a decent period, they'll soon want shot of you.

In theory there should be no MOO. On that level you are ok.

Honesty is key here, to the OP - don't make up some rubbish about have a virus.

You are running a business, be honest with Client A, say ou understand that they are not 100% on your work and you have another project you need to dedicate time to.

**ladymuck** · 29 March 2020, 19:48

Originally posted by Andy Hallett View Post

In theory there should be no MOO. On that level you are ok.

Honesty is key here, to the OP - don't make up some rubbish about have a virus.

You are running a business, be honest with Client A, say ou understand that they are not 100% on your work and you have another project you need to dedicate time to.

Eminently sensible, good sir

**ManiAnanth** · 29 March 2020, 20:46

Originally posted by ladymuck View Post

Eminently sensible, good sir

Thanks both!

**hairymouse** · 30 March 2020, 18:47

You'd better be absolutely sure about that other contract. Roles are getting cancelled all the time now and a signed contract means nothing. If you are just starting to contract then you probably don't have any money saved and you will be absolutely screwed if that next contract gets cancelled.
I'm going to go against the experts and say keep invoicing as long as you can.

**ladymuck** · 30 March 2020, 20:23

Originally posted by hairymouse View Post

You'd better be absolutely sure about that other contract. Roles are getting cancelled all the time now and a signed contract means nothing. If you are just starting to contract then you probably don't have any money saved and you will be absolutely screwed if that next contract gets cancelled.
I'm going to go against the experts and say keep invoicing as long as you can.

I'd agree. I wouldn't jump ship without being damn sure.

The advice being given is based on the OP deciding they want to quit.

Ending a contract early - Dilemma