Originally posted by pauljh
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IR35 Confusion -
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If you’re employing someone that means they have a permie job. You’ve got to run a payroll for them and offer them a company pension. If you’re subcontracting, that’s something entirely different.
Is the person at client on a 50k salary and employees as a consultant who you charge out at 500 per day?The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he didn't existComment
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Originally posted by eek View PostSo the issue comes down to a simple one:-
If the contract is your employee and you do no work for that client you have nothing to worry about - the person who is doing the work is paid via PAYE.
If the contract requires you to do work for the client then you have a problem as if you take money out as dividends you aren't compliant.
How would I determine what part of the dividend is from "my" day rate and what part is from my day rate I charge for my employees?
I'm getting DejaVu...Comment
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Originally posted by pauljh View PostThe contract lists my 2 employees and myself.
How would I determine what part of the dividend is from "my" day rate and what part is from my day rate I charge for my employees?
I'm getting DejaVu...merely at clientco for the entertainmentComment
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Isn't this your third stab at this? First thread Sept 2019, Feb 2020 and then this one?
You managed to post the other two in the right part of the forums? Different forum for lucky third attempt?
Originally posted by pauljh View PostThey have said the contract will be inside IR35. so I've no idea how this will work for my employees and myself..
Surely that would mean your LTD will get paid the money after all normal taxes have been paid? I assume they will want you to take an umbrella on or something so there is no risk paying you gross and relying on you to pay the proper taxes. Unless you can convince them otherwise and work like the agents do.
Originally posted by GhostofTarbera View PostYou business model is bustedLast edited by northernladuk; 27 November 2020, 18:55.'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!Comment
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Originally posted by northernladuk View PostIsn't this your third stab at this? First thread Sept 2019, Feb 2020 and then this one?
You managed to post the other two in the right part of the forums? Different forum for lucky third attempt?
Your business model is all wrong for the clients needs.
Surely that would mean your LTD will get paid the money after all normal taxes have been paid? I assume they will want you to take an umbrella on or something so there is no risk paying you gross and relying on you to pay the proper taxes. Unless you can convince them otherwise and work like the agents do.
This.
I think I might post this to 4chan in the future, 4th time lucky...Comment
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Originally posted by pauljh View PostThe model evolved and has fit my clients needs perfectly. No umbrella is required (they told me this), they will need proof my employees are "proper" PAYE, "I" am the only issue currently.
I think I might post this to 4chan in the future, 4th time lucky...
This is just an accounting question not an IR35 one. Client says you are all inside. That's IR35 taken care off. Now just how to account for it.
How do you grow your business? Not with this client. You aren't running a business selling services, you are providing bums on seats. You are acting as an agency not a consultancy so the only growth is more bums on seats as the client requires them. You are mixing up your business approach. If you want to grow as a consultancy you find another client that you can engage in as a consultancy and sell them a service via a SOW approach which will put you firmly outside IR35.
Surely you realise that your current model has a finite timescale and will all fall apart once the client doesn't need you? If you do think it was going to go on forever as it is then you were inside from day one.
BTW... What are you doing about the fact you thought you were outside and now inside?Last edited by northernladuk; 28 November 2020, 00:32.'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!Comment
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Originally posted by northernladuk View PostSo the only issue is how do you make sure all the income from the client is distributed via PAYE. Your account could advise that?
This is just an accounting question not an IR35 one. Client says you are all inside. That's IR35 taken care off. Now just how to account for it.
Originally posted by northernladuk View PostHow do you grow your business? Not with this client. You aren't running a business selling services, you are providing bums on seats. You are acting as an agency not a consultancy so the only growth is more bums on seats as the client requires them. You are mixing up your business approach. If you want to grow as a consultancy you find another client that you can engage in as a consultancy and sell them a service via a SOW approach which will put you firmly outside IR35.
Surely you realise that your current model has a finite timescale and will all fall apart once the client doesn't need you? If you do think it was going to go on forever as it is then you were inside from day one.
Originally posted by northernladuk View PostBTW... What are you doing about the fact you thought you were outside and now inside?
I ideally want someone to help me negotiate a new contract and help them define the SOW's so i am "safe", hence the request for paid help..!Comment
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Originally posted by pauljh View PostI ideally want someone to help me negotiate a new contract and help them define the SOW's so i am "safe", hence the request for paid help..!
If you’re getting pulled away on BAU work without a contract variation then this has almost certainly been inside all along. Your actual working relationship comes before the contract and, unless you’re proposing to change that fundamentally, no amount of SoW window dressing is going to help. In short, are they really going to treat you differently and you them? Not according to you, as you’re worried about “souring the relationship”. Be honest with yourself.Comment
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