Opt out of Conduct of employment agencies 2003 act?

[cojak]

Am I correct in that opting in or out of the agency regs does not affect the invoicing/payment/tax process at all?

It does affect payment in favour of the contractor but it does not affect invoicing or tax.

I really would recommend that you research the opt-in pros and cons yourself (directly, not merely by asking us and getting second-hand advice).

The biggest sting since IR35? Employment Agency Regulations - the facts and myths for the IT contractor :: Contractor UK

[gman81]

It does affect payment in favour of the contractor but it does not affect invoicing or tax.

I really would recommend that you research the opt-in pros and cons yourself (directly, not merely by asking us and getting second-hand advice).

The biggest sting since IR35? Employment Agency Regulations - the facts and myths for the IT contractor :: Contractor UK

Ok thanks for the advice, also, I received the following from the agency as info to help decide whether to op in or not, not sure if this helps though.

Pros - Advantages of opting out
1. no increase in administration or forms to complete which could result in increased margins/costs to you
2. avoid potential delays in starting your assignments
3. less statutory restriction on your ability to substitute or sub-contract
4. avoid any implication that you are under the client s control at al times (although you may agree to be)
5. will assist in demonstrating that you operate outside IR35
6. easier to show you are in business on your own account
7. increases your marketability to clients & recruiters looking to reduce administration and place candidates quickly
8. only one negotiation of contract terms in each case (rather than at the outset and at point of assignment)
9. less requirements on you to provide information and confirmations
10. more attractive to umbrellas and composite companies as they avoid increased statutory requirements

Cons - Disadvantages of opting out
1. no additional protection regarding potentially onerous contract terms (existing statutory protection remains)
2. no statutory entitlement to information regarding health and safety (although our terms deal with this)
3. no minimal protection when required to work away from home
4. no added protection regarding confidentiality (although Data Protection Act still applies)

[minstrel]

Ok thanks for the advice, also, I received the following from the agency as info to help decide whether to op in or not, not sure if this helps though.

Pros - Advantages of opting out
1. no increase in administration or forms to complete which could result in increased margins/costs to you
2. avoid potential delays in starting your assignments
3. less statutory restriction on your ability to substitute or sub-contract
4. avoid any implication that you are under the client s control at al times (although you may agree to be)
5. will assist in demonstrating that you operate outside IR35
6. easier to show you are in business on your own account
7. increases your marketability to clients & recruiters looking to reduce administration and place candidates quickly
8. only one negotiation of contract terms in each case (rather than at the outset and at point of assignment)
9. less requirements on you to provide information and confirmations
10. more attractive to umbrellas and composite companies as they avoid increased statutory requirements

Cons - Disadvantages of opting out
1. no additional protection regarding potentially onerous contract terms (existing statutory protection remains)
2. no statutory entitlement to information regarding health and safety (although our terms deal with this)
3. no minimal protection when required to work away from home
4. no added protection regarding confidentiality (although Data Protection Act still applies)

Remember the agent is just the guy who has a vested interest in persuading you to opt out.

This is why they gave you 10 reason to opt out and only 4 to stay opted in.

I had an agent tell me the other day that I would be "deemed a direct employee of the client" if I didn't opt out.

Most of the reasons agents give you to opt out are rubbish.

[malvolio]

OK, so let's look at thee one-by-one...


Pros - Advantages of opting out
1. no increase in administration or forms to complete which could result in increased margins/costs to you - rubbish. Makes no difference to you, only the agency

2. avoid potential delays in starting your assignments - Rubbish

3. less statutory restriction on your ability to substitute or sub-contract - Rubbish, and irrelevant

4. avoid any implication that you are under the client s control at al times (although you may agree to be) - rubbish, D&C is not determined by your position under the Regs

5. will assist in demonstrating that you operate outside IR35 - Rubbish, your IR35 status is not linked to the Regs in any way

6. easier to show you are in business on your own account - Rubbish. Why?

7. increases your marketability to clients & recruiters looking to reduce administration and place candidates quickly - Might allow this one, but only becuase agencies cant be a**ed to apply the regs correctly

8. only one negotiation of contract terms in each case (rather than at the outset and at point of assignment) - Total rubbish.

9. less requirements on you to provide information and confirmations - Actually true, but I've yet to hear of an agency that doesn't demand a shedload of material anyway, so pointless

10. more attractive to umbrellas and composite companies as they avoid increased statutory requirements - Rubbish.

Cons - Disadvantages of opting out
1. no additional protection regarding potentially onerous contract terms (existing statutory protection remains) - handcuff clauise and payment terms only, both of which are easily circumvented by both client and agency

2. no statutory entitlement to information regarding health and safety (although our terms deal with this) - Total bollocks

3. no minimal protection when required to work away from home - Total bollocks

4. no added protection regarding confidentiality (although Data Protection Act still applies) - Complete and total bollocks if the DPA applies


So, not even close. Look up your agent on LinkedIn. Bet you he was selling sporting goods a year ago.

Who are they, anyway?

[TheFaQQer]

Pros - Advantages of opting out
1. no increase in administration or forms to complete which could result in increased margins/costs to you

I've had to complete extra forms / provide more information, but it's never had any increased cost to me. It's increased the cost to the agency, probably.

2. avoid potential delays in starting your assignments

Only if the agency tw@t about and cause delays, but there is no reason for this.

3. less statutory restriction on your ability to substitute or sub-contract

Wrong

4. avoid any implication that you are under the client s control at al times (although you may agree to be)

Wrong - it makes no difference

5. will assist in demonstrating that you operate outside IR35

Wrong - it makes no difference

6. easier to show you are in business on your own account

Wrong - it makes no difference

7. increases your marketability to clients & recruiters looking to reduce administration and place candidates quickly

Wrong - there is only additional admin for the agency if they don't know what they are doing and drag their feet. They need to determine you are who you say you are, and if you have told them of any qualifications, you have to prove it. Shouldn't take too long, so have no impact on marketability.

8. only one negotiation of contract terms in each case (rather than at the outset and at point of assignment)

Don't even understand that one!

9. less requirements on you to provide information and confirmations

<buzz>Repetition!

10. more attractive to umbrellas and composite companies as they avoid increased statutory requirements

To opt out, you need to do it personally, and the umbrella needs to do it. So, opting out means that there is for the agency to do. They should already be checking you are who you say you are as you are their employee

Cons - Disadvantages of opting out
1. no additional protection regarding potentially onerous contract terms (existing statutory protection remains)

Nicely, vaguely worded. i.e. you can go direct after the contract ends without needing an agent. You have the right to be paid for the work you do, even if the agency gets nothing.

2. no statutory entitlement to information regarding health and safety (although our terms deal with this)

Woo.

3. no minimal protection when required to work away from home

Again, woo.

4. no added protection regarding confidentiality (although Data Protection Act still applies)

What confidentiality are they talking about? See what's in the contract instead.

The agent may have some kind of vested interest in getting you to opt out - they have to do more work, you have the right to get paid, and can bypass them in the future. It's not surprising they tout this tripe.

[gman81]

I will not be opting out, even though "most of their current contractors opt out", however I hope this does not influence the contract terms/conditions.

[quackhandle]

I will not be opting out, even though "most of their current contractors opt out", however I hope this does not influence the contract terms/conditions.

Expect the agent to fob you off and delay the start date "whilst our legal team look at the issue of you not opting out".

qh

[riffpie]

Expect the agent to fob you off and delay the start date "whilst our legal team look at the issue of you not opting out".

qh

Exactly what's happening to me now. Apparently, since 99% of their contractors opt out, they don't quite know what to do, but "legal" want to see me face to face, have certified copies of my passport, copies of all my educational certificates, and a health and safety report, whatever that is. I've contacted the client direct to say I'm happy I be joining their project, but that some red tape is delaying the contract beig signed. I've told the agent that my availability goes up from one day, to four weeks as of tomorrow, which is true. They seem quite adamant I have to opt out, or jump through unreasonable hoops, to secure the contract. Sounds fishy.

[northernladuk]

I will not be opting out, even though "most of their current contractors opt out", however I hope this does not influence the contract terms/conditions.

Even though three of our most senior members have just pointed out you appear to know squat about it?

[Wanderer]

Apparently, since 99% of their contractors opt out, they don't quite know what to do, but "legal" want to see me face to face, have certified copies of my passport, copies of all my educational certificates, and a health and safety report, whatever that is. I've contacted the client direct to say I'm happy I be joining their project, but that some red tape is delaying the contract beig signed

Get the certified copies of the documents and send them in, also tell them you will take the originals with you on your first day for the client to sight when you start work. There is no need to meet with their legal people, they are only going to try and harass or bully you. If you do go and meet them then I would be inclined to record the conversation for your records.

Don't forget that the agency regulations protect the client as well as the worker so it's also in the client's interests for you to stay opted in. Tell the agency quite bluntly that if they mess you around then you will speak to the client and tell them exactly what's going on and that the agency are deliberately being obtuse because you have refused to opt out of the agency regulations.

Good luck