Over qualified? Oh dear!

[gingerjedi]

I once missed out on role working at the local police HQ because I was 'over qualified', judging by the clueless numpties that interviewed me I'm convinced it was because they didn't want someone who was going to show them up.

[nomadd]

I once missed out on role working at the local police HQ because I was 'over qualified', judging by the clueless numpties that interviewed me I'm convinced it was because they didn't want someone who was going to show them up.

Q. How long have you worked with databases?
A. Oh, about 25 years or so.

Q. OK. What can you tell me about Transactions?
A. Well, what type of Transactions do you want to discuss? A non-distributed transaction? A distributed transaction? A co-ordinated transaction against multiple sources? A transaction via an external transaction manager? An idempotent transaction? A compensating transaction? The ACIDic properties of transactions? The transaction options available in the database? The transaction settings available in the JDBC driver? Transaction recovery and rollback? We can discuss any of these things in detail, if you like?

Q. Er... No. It'll be OK.
A. Oh... OK, then.

Phone call from the agent 1 hour later. You didn't get the role, as they thought you didn't know anything about transactions.

True story. Happened to me about 10 years ago.

Interviewed by Numpties? As contractors, we've all been there. Several times!

[CheeseSlice]

judging by the clueless numpties that interviewed me I'm convinced it was because they didn't want someone who was going to show them up.

This sadly happens to me once in a while. Usually when the interview is not by the manager or person hiring (I generally get those), but by other members of the team who you will be working with. They come in pairs, and generally one of them will be the team lead and have a superiority complex. He will be the one who has read your CV and has decided you are a potential threat to his position. He's the one you need to get around somehow and I've never quite figured out how to do it....

[JoJoGabor]

I got thrown out of the SAS for being too hard!
Then I joined MENSA and they threw me out for being too brainy!

You cant win nowadays

[jmo21]

Q. OK. What can you tell me about Transactions?
A. Well, what type of Transactions do you want to discuss? A non-distributed transaction? A distributed transaction? A co-ordinated transaction against multiple sources? A transaction via an external transaction manager? An idempotent transaction? A compensating transaction? The ACIDic properties of transactions? The transaction options available in the database? The transaction settings available in the JDBC driver? Transaction recovery and rollback? We can discuss any of these things in detail, if you like?

Q. Er... No. It'll be OK.
A. Oh... OK, then.

Phone call from the agent 1 hour later. You didn't get the role, as they thought you didn't know anything about transactions.

You probably came across as a twat, why didn't you just describe a few of those things instead of trying to be smart and bullet pointing a whole list of things with a smug "which one would you like to discuss attitude".

But no, they were permit idiots.

They probably gave that knock back reason to wind you up. No smart arses thank you.

[MarillionFan]

You probably came across as a twat, why didn't you just describe a few of those things instead of trying to be smart and bullet pointing a whole list of things with a smug "which one would you like to discuss attitude".

But no, they were permit idiots.

They probably gave that knock back reason to wind you up. No smart arses thank you.

WHS.

The answer you gave, gives the impression that you're being a smart arse without actually understanding and answering the question in a way in which they are comfortable or understand.

Presently working with some guys who when asked a question go into the most non-sensical use of technology jargon I have ever heard outside of an Open University program at 3am in the morning. Once they have suitably bamboozled all around them I then have to clarify the point in a simple & easy manner that the other side understands. ie . Dave says you have to turn it on and off again.

[SteelyDan]

NLUK - Apologies if I appear to be having a go at you; not intended but felt I must respond to your comments

There is a high risk you will find the work boring, beneath you and also find better work/rate else where.

No, the work was/is really interesting, hence the reason I applied. Might add also I travelled a considerable distance for this role, which should indicate a certain level of interest. The rate was/is a good rate, so no issues there.

We all know people jump ship for rate at the drop of a hat in a role they are qualified for so it is a given it will happen to someone over qualified.

No, not applicable in this case, I wanted the role, felt comfortable with it, got interviewed for the role, and the rest is history as they say. I haven’t, and wouldn’t, commit to a contract and then jump ship. Call me old fashioned, but I like to operate ethically & with integrity, although I’m sure some don’t.

MF hits the nail on the head and I am pretty surpised contractors don't get this. You prove you are the best man for that role and no more. It is as simple as that. If it is beneath you dumb your CV down and do the same in the interview. Being better than the role is not a benefit to the client.

Not sure I agree with this. In order to get past the gatekeepers (recruiters) your details have to shine, particularly the way the market is currently, as you yourself have spelt out to myself and others re; CV. I tailored my CV to the spec, and without this (based on personal experience and a lengthy search period) wouldn’t have even been considered by the ‘wipes’ that are recruiters. Therefore if I had ‘dumbed down the CV’ then I would never been put forward at all.

There might be some value though (I concede) that to the senior hiring manager I, as a consultant, could have appeared to outshine him in both experience and qualifications. But if this is the case, then he should have been able to identify this when reviewing my CV, and rejected me at that stage. If they just wanted a ‘body’ then advertise the role as such, and don’t ask for a ‘consultant’.

Sod’s Law, of course, may well dictate that, after all of my whingeing, the ether-based senior role does come off. Naturally I’ll let all and sundry know if it does...if only as a message of optimism for fellow CUK-ers.

Thanks for all the comments & patience; much appreciated.

[northernladuk]

NLUK - Apologies if I appear to be having a go at you; not intended but felt I must respond to your comments

I don't have a problem with that.

There is a high risk you will find the work boring, beneath you and also find better work/rate else where.

No, the work was/is really interesting, hence the reason I applied. Might add also I travelled a considerable distance for this role, which should indicate a certain level of interest. The rate was/is a good rate, so no issues there.

It doesn't matter what you think/want/can do. It is what the client thinks. We all say we will do the same as you say but we see more than enough people on this forum alone jumping ship for better roles and clients are well aware of this. THey don't know you will stay, they have to weigh up the risks.

We all know people jump ship for rate at the drop of a hat in a role they are qualified for so it is a given it will happen to someone over qualified.

No, not applicable in this case, I wanted the role, felt comfortable with it, got interviewed for the role, and the rest is history as they say. I haven’t, and wouldn’t, commit to a contract and then jump ship. Call me old fashioned, but I like to operate ethically & with integrity, although I’m sure some don’t.

Again, it doesn't matter what you think. It is what the clients think and as admirable as your intentions are they are not those of many people.

MF hits the nail on the head and I am pretty surpised contractors don't get this. You prove you are the best man for that role and no more. It is as simple as that. If it is beneath you dumb your CV down and do the same in the interview. Being better than the role is not a benefit to the client.

Not sure I agree with this. In order to get past the gatekeepers (recruiters) your details have to shine, particularly the way the market is currently, as you yourself have spelt out to myself and others re; CV. I tailored my CV to the spec, and without this (based on personal experience and a lengthy search period) wouldn’t have even been considered by the ‘wipes’ that are recruiters. Therefore if I had ‘dumbed down the CV’ then I would never been put forward at all.

Maybe in this case you did. It was a general comment. If you are PM you cannot go for PMO roles. If you are a Programme Manager you cannot go for PM roles. Ok someone will say they did, it does happen, but in general being senior to a role does not mean you are the perfect person, and in fact makes it more of a risk. I mean you dumb it down from PM to PMO if need be. If you did dumb it down to meet the role you were applying for in this instance then you have hit a bit of an unlucky one here.

There might be some value though (I concede) that to the senior hiring manager I, as a consultant, could have appeared to outshine him in both experience and qualifications. But if this is the case, then he should have been able to identify this when reviewing my CV, and rejected me at that stage. If they just wanted a ‘body’ then advertise the role as such, and don’t ask for a ‘consultant’.

Sod’s Law, of course, may well dictate that, after all of my whingeing, the ether-based senior role does come off. Naturally I’ll let all and sundry know if it does...if only as a message of optimism for fellow CUK-ers.

I aggree and that is the weird thing, surely you would expect a client to be happier getting a specialist and someone that can do the job with their eyes closed. As you say you would think this is why they ask for a consultant. Unfortuantely that is the way the cookie crumbles.

If the senior role comes off get it on here. Always good to see a boomed post!

[SteelyDan]

NLUK - cheers; appreciated.

[Joeman]

So ask the agent to suggest to the Client that you fill the Junior role until such time as the Senior role gets sign off, then you can assist the Client in the hiring of a junior to backfill your position as you move to the Senior role.
You'll be better placed to do the Senior role having done a few weeks/months at the 'coal face first' - its a "Win-Win" for everyone right??? (bit of a permie tactic though)