Do higher taxes on booze and fags work?

[Mordac]

Are there not studies showing higher prices DO work? As an extreme example look at the 5p carrier bag charge, but more relevantly hasn't Scotland seen their minimum booze pricing have some effect?

Window dressing. It's almost certainly seen an increase in Scots travelling south of the border to buy their liquor of choice. I can imagine quite a gnashing of teeth when they see all those "2 bottles of spirits for £20 - offer not available in Scotland" ads. Kind of ironic really, asking the people to vote for independence from the neighbour where you can buy whisky cheaper.

[original PM]

People are just turning into long living fat pigs instead costing 10% of the NHS budget.

Maybe it was cheaper and more revenue efficient to let people die younger of smoking related diseases.

Exactly this smokers cost the NHS money but they compensate for that with the amount of tax they pay.

Lazy fat people are a much bigger drain on the NHS and nothing is being done.

I think the government needs to stop telling people that it is bad to smoke and drink but not challenge the idea that replacing that with stuffing the front of your head with cheap high fat food is an alternative.

Interestingly enough weed is now legal in Nevada so you can go gamble n good stoned at the same time, legally.

Think the UK needs to be come a bit more progressive really!

[Mordac]

Exactly this smokers cost the NHS money but they compensate for that with the amount of tax they pay.

Lazy fat people are a much bigger drain on the NHS and nothing is being done.

I think the government needs to stop telling people that it is bad to smoke and drink but not challenge the idea that replacing that with stuffing the front of your head with cheap high fat food is an alternative.

Interestingly enough weed is now legal in Nevada so you can go gamble n good stoned at the same time, legally.

Think the UK needs to be come a bit more progressive really!

Interesting story on the news yesterday, apparently the biggest cause of death is now dementia. Such is the price of living longer. Instead of enjoying ourselves, eating, drinking and smoking too much, we are now destined to live our final years drinking through a straw, dribbling most of it away, and costing the NHS trillions. Kind of makes you hanker for the good old days, doesn't it?

[original PM]

Interesting story on the news yesterday, apparently the biggest cause of death is now dementia. Such is the price of living longer. Instead of enjoying ourselves, eating, drinking and smoking too much, we are now destined to live our final years drinking through a straw, dribbling most of it away, and costing the NHS trillions. Kind of makes you hanker for the good old days, doesn't it?

The biggest cause of death is..... old age!!!

But yes this assumption that if I do not drink or smoke and live healthy I will therefore be happy and sprightly until I am 95 is incredibly misleading.

My Grandma died at 93 - but as far as I was concerned my Grandma left us sometime when she was about 87 - after that when she does not know who you are, who she is or where she is all - is that still being alive?

So fook it gonna smoke, drink and die with a smile on my face

[Mordac]

The biggest cause of death is..... old age!!!

But yes this assumption that if I do not drink or smoke and live healthy I will therefore be happy and sprightly until I am 95 is incredibly misleading.

My Grandma died at 93 - but as far as I was concerned my Grandma left us sometime when she was about 87 - after that when she does not know who you are, who she is or where she is all - is that still being alive?

So fook it gonna smoke, drink and die with a smile on my face

Which was precisely my point. My godfather is 94, and he doesn't even recognise his own wife (of 70 years). Once the brain has gone, the person has gone. I dread the same thing happening to my parents.

[DaveB]

Interesting story on the news yesterday, apparently the biggest cause of death is now dementia. Such is the price of living longer. Instead of enjoying ourselves, eating, drinking and smoking too much, we are now destined to live our final years drinking through a straw, dribbling most of it away, and costing the NHS trillions. Kind of makes you hanker for the good old days, doesn't it?

From the NHS perspective dementia is a cheap disease. There is no cure to administer and no expensive drugs to be provided, it requires no palliative medical care like cancer, no surgery or other major intervention by medical staff like heart disease. The vast majority of sufferers live in self funded private care homes, at least until their savings run out when costs are funded by the local authority, not the NHS.

[Mordac]

From the NHS perspective dementia is a cheap disease. There is no cure to administer and no expensive drugs to be provided, it requires no palliative medical care like cancer, no surgery or other major intervention by medical staff like heart disease. The vast majority of sufferers live in self funded private care homes, at least until their savings run out when costs are funded by the local authority, not the NHS.

Whether it's the NHS or the local council taxpayer, someone always pays.

[OwlHoot]

Are there not studies showing higher prices DO work? As an extreme example look at the 5p carrier bag charge, but more relevantly hasn't Scotland seen their minimum booze pricing have some effect?

The 5p carrier bag charge is such a trifling amount the deterrence is often more about avoiding loose change from a total amounting to X pounds and 5p.

Mind you, when having to buy several bags for a weekly supermarket shop, it can mount up.

[DaveB]

Whether it's the NHS or the local council taxpayer, someone always pays.

Yes, but it's not the NHS as you stated, and the LA only starts paying once their own money has gone so it's for a limited time anyway. Those costs are still cheaper than major medical intervention and long term treatment for the other big killers.

Once you're diagnosed you generally have less than 10 years with dementia, and it can be less than 5 depending on the type and age of onset. Selling your home when you have to go into a care home will cover the costs up until death for the majority of people and the LA wont fund care home fees while you still have assets to pay for it yourself.

[Mordac]

Yes, but it's not the NHS as you stated, and the LA only starts paying once their own money has gone so it's for a limited time anyway. Those costs are still cheaper than major medical intervention and long term treatment for the other big killers.

Once you're diagnosed you generally have less than 10 years with dementia, and it can be less than 5 depending on the type and age of onset. Selling your home when you have to go into a care home will cover the costs up until death for the majority of people and the LA wont fund care home fees while you still have assets to pay for it yourself.

So all those millenials hoping to inherit something are completely screwed. Not only do they have to watch their parents live out their last years in indignity, their only hope of ever participating in the home ownership racket might just be tugged from beneath them.