Labour and Tory rebels plan to keep UK in EEA

[SueEllen]

It may be separate in the sense that non-members of the EU are signed up to it, but they are signed up based on agreeing to the four freedoms.

The "Hard Brexit" cannot exist if we are part of the EEA.

Stop being thick.

The government, regardless of party, is going to lie and properly implement directive 2004/38/EC

This means they can keep track of EEA, EU and Swiss citizens like every other EEA and EU country.

[sal]

So Yes EEA No CU separates us from the vision of the EU states. That's enough for me.

Huh, this is rather pointless and not worth the damage already caused by Brexit, let alone what's to come. Which country do you want an FTA that you can't have on while part of the EU? Lets look at the top 20 by GDP:

USA - get ready for chlorine washed chicken, pink slime and hormone "enhanced" beef. GMO plants and overall decimation of the UK farming industry. Whats not to like?
China - UK steel industry for example can't compete against Chinese steel even without FTA, imagine what will happen with an FTA in place
Japan - EU is process of securing FTA and will probably finish it sooner than a potential one with post-Brexit UK
Germany - We have it now
UK - N/A
France - we have it now
India - India already mentioned that they will demand some sort of free movement as a price for FTA - GL with that
Italy - We have it now
Brazil - EU is process of securing FTA and will probably finish it sooner than a potential one with post-Brexit UK
Canada - we have CETA now, close enough
South Korea - We have it now
Russia - GL with that
Australia - I believe the Australia officials mentioned they will prioritize FTA with EU over UK
Spain - We have it now
Mexico - We have it now
Indonesia - EU is process of securing FTA and will probably finish it sooner than a potential one with post-Brexit UK
Turkey - We have it now
Netherlands - We have it now
Switzerland - We have it now
Saudi Arabia - This one is a winner

[PurpleGorilla]

Labour and Tory rebels plan to keep UK in EEA

Huh, this is rather pointless and not worth the damage already caused by Brexit, let alone what's to come. Which country do you want an FTA that you can't have on while part of the EU? Lets look at the top 20 by GDP:

USA - get ready for chlorine washed chicken, pink slime and hormone "enhanced" beef. GMO plants and overall decimation of the UK farming industry. Whats not to like?
China - UK steel industry for example can't compete against Chinese steel even without FTA, imagine what will happen with an FTA in place
Japan - EU is process of securing FTA and will probably finish it sooner than a potential one with post-Brexit UK
Germany - We have it now
UK - N/A
France - we have it now
India - India already mentioned that they will demand some sort of free movement as a price for FTA - GL with that
Italy - We have it now
Brazil - EU is process of securing FTA and will probably finish it sooner than a potential one with post-Brexit UK
Canada - we have CETA now, close enough
South Korea - We have it now
Russia - GL with that
Australia - I believe the Australia officials mentioned they will prioritize FTA with EU over UK
Spain - We have it now
Mexico - We have it now
Indonesia - EU is process of securing FTA and will probably finish it sooner than a potential one with post-Brexit UK
Turkey - We have it now
Netherlands - We have it now
Switzerland - We have it now
Saudi Arabia - This one is a winner

So we should stay in the customs union then?

Switzerland is outside it, and Norway. Both are successful nations.

[sal]

So we should stay in the customs union then?

Switzerland is outside it, and Norway. Both are successful nations.

Give me one advantage of leaving it. (just don't mention taking back control of our borders pls)

The potential disadvantages are:

- disruption to commerce - both domestic and foreign, UK companies losing business, UK customers losing access to goods they are used to. higher prices for goods from countries we will have to renegotiate trade deals with. FYI this process takes years and we haven't even started.
- disruption to traffic near the ports - the infrastructure for customs checks is long gone, recreating it will be costly and impossible in some cases where the land has been sold/re purposed. This means long cues of lorries clogging the roads.

Plenty of nations are outside of the CU and are successful, what is your point? No one is saying the UK can't be successful outside the CU, the question is, is it going to be better or worse off. I don't pretend to be an expert on Global trade etc. but I don't see what can make it better outside of the CU with all the negotiating power (and arguably mammoth bureaucracy) of the EU.

[PurpleGorilla]

Give me one advantage of leaving it. (just don't mention taking back control of our borders pls)

The potential disadvantages are:

- disruption to commerce - both domestic and foreign, UK companies losing business, UK customers losing access to goods they are used to. higher prices for goods from countries we will have to renegotiate trade deals with. FYI this process takes years and we haven't even started.
- disruption to traffic near the ports - the infrastructure for customs checks is long gone, recreating it will be costly and impossible in some cases where the land has been sold/re purposed. This means long cues of lorries clogging the roads.

Plenty of nations are outside of the CU and are successful, what is your point? No one is saying the UK can't be successful outside the CU, the question is, is it going to be better or worse off. I don't pretend to be an expert on Global trade etc. but I don't see what can make it better outside of the CU with all the negotiating power (and arguably mammoth bureaucracy) of the EU.

It would help to reduce trade barriers with the developing world, much of which is part of the commonwealth.

[sal]

It would help to reduce trade barriers with the developing world, much of which is part of the commonwealth.

But the EU is already in process of signing deals with most of the developing world

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe...ade_agreements

Even then do you think it's worth it to wreck your relationships with the developed world? It makes zero economic sense.

[PurpleGorilla]

Labour and Tory rebels plan to keep UK in EEA

But the EU is already in process of signing deals with most of the developing world

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe...ade_agreements

Even then do you think it's worth it to wreck your relationships with the developed world? It makes zero economic sense.

But under the EU customs union we cannot specifically tailor our trade agreements to support specific industries (eg dairy).

Norway & Switzerland are outside it.

[sal]

But under the EU customs union we cannot specifically tailor our trade agreements to support specific industries (eg dairy).

Norway & Switzerland are outside it.

Have you asked the dairy farmers if they prefer UK Gov "protection" or EU subsidies? The answer might surprise you. Which is of course a mute point, if we are not leaving the EU, but only the CU in which case the CAP will remain in place.

Also again the typical brexiteer notion of having the cake and eat it comes in to light again. Why do you think the other countries will sign trade deals that are only going to be beneficial to the UK?

[bobspud]

Surely if they attempt to do that, come next GE they will be voted out of Parliament, after all the majority of the public voted for Brexit...

Oh, wait, a lot of the 52% didn't vote for hard Brexit, meaning that what we see now is Democracy in action. If the electorate is unhappy with the way their MP acts, it's in their power to sign a petition for the MP recall and trigger by-election. apparently it doesn't work like that...

The PM forcing MPs to vote against their constituencies desires is undemocratic. Separation of powers etc.

What is happening is clear, the minority of the brexiteers that are fro hard brexit want to force it down the throat of the whole Nation at all cost, democracy be damned.

1) As others have said: Its not a transition deal they want. Its a foot in the door to stop it happening at all. Therefor because we are dealing with completely devious self serving bastards that are not enacting the will of the 52% we have to take the hard way out. It would be great if those looking for the mid ground would sign their name on pain of death to use the 3 year wisely. But they wont they will do the same old civil service shuffle as always and just say "oh its a bit hard we better not bother..."

2) We can find billions of pounds to kill innocent Iraqi's or fund jihad by accident in Syria so the same open piggy bank will have to be used at home for once and if that means coming up with some serious plans to help those losing out then guess what? We need to pucker up and spend the money.

3) 52% of the turnout made the decision. Its final. We all knew it was final when we put the cross on the ballot. Whining now is pointless and makes you out to have next to no spine.

Quit bitching and ask what your grandfather or great-grandfather would make of your subservience to a quango. You sound like the archetype squealing brat in a supermarket....

[PurpleGorilla]

Have you asked the dairy farmers if they prefer UK Gov "protection" or EU subsidies? The answer might surprise you. Which is of course a mute point, if we are not leaving the EU, but only the CU in which case the CAP will remain in place.

Also again the typical brexiteer notion of having the cake and eat it comes in to light again. Why do you think the other countries will sign trade deals that are only going to be beneficial to the UK?

So why doesn't Norway and Switzerland join the CU then?