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Komrade Kolonel Korbyn

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    #11
    Originally posted by northernladyuk View Post
    You could equally be describing capitalism. Just sayin'.
    Yes. Although capitalism also feeds 7 billion people.

    Just sayin’
    See You Next Tuesday

    Comment


      #12
      Originally posted by northernladyuk View Post
      That is true. Corbyn is simply not up to the job.
      And now we have incontrovertible evidence...

      Comment


        #13
        Originally posted by Lance View Post
        Yes. Although capitalism also feeds 7 billion people.

        Just sayin’
        You have dodged the point however. The ends justify the means?

        Comment


          #14
          Originally posted by northernladyuk View Post
          You have dodged the point however. The ends justify the means?
          Not saying that.

          Socialism/communism has demonstrated a lack of ability to feed people. Mainly due to states having control rather than markets.

          Killing millions of people is a human trait not one of a political persuasion. Although between mao and Stalin they’re winning.
          See You Next Tuesday

          Comment


            #15
            Originally posted by Lance View Post
            Not saying that.

            Socialism/communism has demonstrated a lack of ability to feed people. Mainly due to states having control rather than markets.

            Killing millions of people is a human trait not one of a political persuasion. Although between mao and Stalin they’re winning.
            Neither Mao nor Stalin presided over societies in which the working class were in control. Ergo they were not socialist. Unless you have incontrovertible evidence that they were socialist societies?

            Comment


              #16
              Komrade Kolonel Korbyn

              Originally posted by northernladyuk View Post
              Neither Mao nor Stalin presided over societies in which the working class were in control. Ergo they were not socialist. Unless you have incontrovertible evidence that they were socialist societies?
              Has there ever been such a society? Or could there ever be?

              Define socialism....


              I found this

              noun
              a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

              Which basically says the state run everything. State control has failed to work. Stalin and Mao may not have represented the workers very well but they were the state.
              Last edited by Lance; 15 April 2018, 18:38.
              See You Next Tuesday

              Comment


                #17
                As Lance said.

                Socialism, communism, what is there not to like in theory? Reality is the problem. It is human nature, indeed, nature in general, to put yourself, your family and those you connect with first. If you are expected, contrary to these feelings, to work to fund others with who you feel no connection, no sympathy, you a) are going to make less effort or b) find other ways to serve yourself. Why communist states have a) always failed economically and b) always been corrupt.
                bloggoth

                If everything isn't black and white, I say, 'Why the hell not?'
                John Wayne (My guru, not to be confused with my beloved prophet Jeremy Clarkson)

                Comment


                  #18
                  Originally posted by Lance View Post
                  Has there ever been such a society? Or could there ever be?

                  Define socialism....


                  I found this

                  noun
                  a political and economic theory of social organization which advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.

                  Which basically says the state run everything. State control has failed to work. Stalin and Mao may not have represented the workers very well but they were the state.
                  The community as a whole and the state are not equivalent. It seems to me extraordinary that anyone could think so. State control is not a necessary feature of socialism. And according to your definition it can only be a feature of socialism where the community as a whole is in control of the state. Which clearly was not the case under Mao or Stalin, who were dictators.

                  Comment


                    #19
                    Originally posted by xoggoth View Post
                    As Lance said.

                    Socialism, communism, what is there not to like in theory? Reality is the problem. It is human nature, indeed, nature in general, to put yourself, your family and those you connect with first. If you are expected, contrary to these feelings, to work to fund others with who you feel no connection, no sympathy, you a) are going to make less effort or b) find other ways to serve yourself. Why communist states have a) always failed economically and b) always been corrupt.
                    That’s not quite what I was saying.
                    I’ll summarise my view... state control is not as good as the free market in determining the price of goods and therefore, by extrapolation, the production and distribution of said goods.
                    See You Next Tuesday

                    Comment


                      #20
                      Originally posted by xoggoth View Post
                      As Lance said.

                      Socialism, communism, what is there not to like in theory? Reality is the problem. It is human nature, indeed, nature in general, to put yourself, your family and those you connect with first. If you are expected, contrary to these feelings, to work to fund others with who you feel no connection, no sympathy, you a) are going to make less effort or b) find other ways to serve yourself. Why communist states have a) always failed economically and b) always been corrupt.
                      Then why are people willing to die for their country? That doesn't seen to fit with your idea of human nature.

                      Comment

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