Alabama - WTF!

[BrilloPad]

A bit like shaving for a man


Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum

Women shave too.

I think Manflu is a far better example.

[BrilloPad]

One lady in Texas knows how to take revenge: -

Texas anti-masturbation bill moves closer to becoming law | The Independent

The Texas Democrat knows her bill has no hope of becoming law, and has introduced it to satirise how women have been affected by targeted healthcare legislation in her state, particularly relating to abortion.

[WTFH]

logically some form of criteria has to drawn up and agreed upon then regularly reviewed

i just have a problem with zealots at either end of the spectrum

Unfortunately logical criteria don't always go well with medical reality.

If a blanket ruling of "at x weeks, the foetus has a right to life", then does this override the mother's right to life, if her life is at risk?
Also, if the foetus has an abnormality that would mean it will not survive outside the womb, where would that fit in the legal argument
Then there's the people who are happy to have abortions because circumstances change.
And the consideration of partners, etc.

It's a minefield and I hate to ever have to make that decision with someone else, or on behalf of them

[Old Greg]

Unfortunately logical criteria don't always go well with medical reality.

If a blanket ruling of "at x weeks, the foetus has a right to life", then does this override the mother's right to life, if her life is at risk?
Also, if the foetus has an abnormality that would mean it will not survive outside the womb, where would that fit in the legal argument
Then there's the people who are happy to have abortions because circumstances change.
And the consideration of partners, etc.

It's a minefield and I hate to ever have to make that decision with someone else, or on behalf of them

Exceptional cases also need to be considered. What if a woman or girl in very late stages of pregnancy escapes from a man who had been keeping her imprisoned and raping her? She is determined to have an abortion and her doctor agrees that it is in her best interest. How do you solve that dilemma, and is it the place of criminal law to decide that she must progress to a live birth?

[BrilloPad]

If a blanket ruling of "at x weeks, the foetus has a right to life", then does this override the mother's right to life, if her life is at risk?

A very long while ago someone I worked with raised this very issue. He said it was simple. Raising a child on your own is awful. And you can always have another child. So you save the mother.

I hope never to have to be in that position.

[ladymuck]

Even with your headings you have opened up a minefield.

What constitutes movement, an amputated frogs leg can be made to move with electrical impulses, i.e. does an uncontrolled muscular spasm constitute movement.

similar argument could also be applied to feeding and excretion. I think we all know what you mean but for legal clarity it would have to be defined and then how do you prove that is occurring. You can't see or prove that the Foetus is feeding, and you can't say well its alive so it must be feeding because you are using feeding as one of your 6 proofs of life - a circular argument. the same applies to excretion. I could go on but you get the general idea that you need good unquestionable legal definitions. As has already been said its a minefield out there

If the parasite were separated from its host, could it move about without you sticking an electrode on it, would the feeding reaction take place (it's autonomic in babies for a short while), can it breathe unaided/minimal aid (premature babies have underdeveloped lungs so do need some help but will swiftly manage on their own), etc etc

I'm not talking about what's it's doing while still in the womb - what are it's chances of independent survival if it were to be born at the point the termination is being considered. The argument for lowering the time at which a termination should take place is related to the advances in medical science where foetuses born at 20 weeks are now able to survive with the right level of intensive care.

[Yorkie62]

If the parasite were separated from its host, could it move about without you sticking an electrode on it, would the feeding reaction take place (it's autonomic in babies for a short while), can it breathe unaided/minimal aid (premature babies have underdeveloped lungs so do need some help but will swiftly manage on their own), etc etc

I'm not talking about what's it's doing while still in the womb - what are it's chances of independent survival if it were to be born at the point the termination is being considered. The argument for lowering the time at which a termination should take place is related to the advances in medical science where foetuses born at 20 weeks are now able to survive with the right level of intensive care.

Absolutely agree with your last point.

Brain the size of a planet and I still have to communicate with morons

[Old Greg]

If the parasite were separated from its host, could it move about without you sticking an electrode on it, would the feeding reaction take place (it's autonomic in babies for a short while), can it breathe unaided/minimal aid (premature babies have underdeveloped lungs so do need some help but will swiftly manage on their own), etc etc

I'm not talking about what's it's doing while still in the womb - what are it's chances of independent survival if it were to be born at the point the termination is being considered. The argument for lowering the time at which a termination should take place is related to the advances in medical science where foetuses born at 20 weeks are now able to survive with the right level of intensive care.

20 weeks gestation? Possibly very occasionally they may survive.

[Eirikur]

The diverse group of lawmakers who passed Alabama’s recent abortion bill

[filthy1980]

The diverse group of lawmakers who passed Alabama’s recent abortion bill

thank you for your enlightened contribution to the discussion