Atheist arguments again Christianity Atheist arguments again Christianity - Page 11
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  1. #101

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    Of course, Michael Moorcock wrote about them for a Hawkwind album
    Quote Originally Posted by Old Greg View Post
    Do you believe in the Machine Elves of Hyperspace or are you agnostic or do you believe they don't exist?
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  2. #102

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    Quote Originally Posted by NotAllThere View Post
    No, no and no. I just don't care. I only answer this is the context of your point. If someone started a post out of the blue about Machine Elves of Hyperspace, my only response would be C.f. Great Pumpkin, Reformed Epistemology.

    Does no one have anything interesting to say?
    Do you care about whether the god Zeus exists?

  3. #103

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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Greg View Post
    Do you care about whether the god Zeus exists?
    No.

    I do know this argument - I have done philosophy at university (got a 1st, as it happens). So it seems no one does have anything interesting to say. Just the same old regurgitated stuff.

    Toothfairy, mechanical elves fall to Epistemology. The Zeus argument falls to historic evidence. The "historic evidence proves otherwise" argument is a matter of constructing alternative hypotheses and taking a personal opinion on which is more likely.

    Sometimes it would be nice to see something original.
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  4. #104

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    Quote Originally Posted by NotAllThere View Post
    No. I do know this argument - I have done philosophy at university (got a 1st, as it happens). So it seems no one does have anything interesting to say. Just the same old regurgitated stuff. Sometimes it would be nice to see something original?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paddy View Post
    How was Exeter?
    University of London.
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  6. #106

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    Quote Originally Posted by NotAllThere View Post
    Sometimes it would be nice to see something original.
    Would be good to see something original from the fairy tale followers rather then believing something sheepfeckers made up in the dessert 3000 years ago and stories that have been modified by popes to suit their personal agendas and quoting from it saying it's the truth. Every question a 4 year old asks about why does god allow evil etc are as valid as any critical question, none of which can be answered with tiniest shred of evidence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eirikur View Post
    Would be good to see something original from the fairy tale followers
    Notwithstanding the tired old "fairytale" denigration, I doubt you really want to see something original from any believers. What you want is for us to all go away. I mean, it's irritating when people just go on regurgitating what they've half remembered of what they've half read that's of dubious foundation, and really just shows up their pre-existing prejudices.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eirikur View Post
    ... stories that have been modified by popes to suit their personal agendas... with tiniest shred of evidence.
    You mean like this pope? Pope Francis cancels the Bible and proposes to create a new book
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  8. #108

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    Quote Originally Posted by NotAllThere View Post
    No.

    I do know this argument - I have done philosophy at university (got a 1st, as it happens). So it seems no one does have anything interesting to say. Just the same old regurgitated stuff.

    Toothfairy, mechanical elves fall to Epistemology. The Zeus argument falls to historic evidence. The "historic evidence proves otherwise" argument is a matter of constructing alternative hypotheses and taking a personal opinion on which is more likely.

    Sometimes it would be nice to see something original.
    Why do we need new arguments? Religions still rely on their very old book of fables for their regurgitated arguments.

    It's not up to an atheist to prove the non-existence of god; it's not us who believe that he/her/it exists with zero evidence.

    But hey, if you're happy to believe that this version of your imaginary friend exists, and not the other versions, that's your choice. A strange choice for an adult but the brain washing is very clever.
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    Some Christians have blind faith. I.e. faith without evidence. Some of us have come to believe precisely because of evidence. If you really have an interest, then James Clifford, the Ethics of the Belief is pretty seminal. He evoked what is now known as the Clifford Principle. "It is wrong always, everywhere, and for anyone to believe anything on insufficient evidence". Ergo, your contention that we have zero evidence is wrong. It might not be evidence you accept of course.

    It's awfully simple. You have looked at the evidence that you find around you and come to a conclusion. You think it is obvious that your worldview is the right one, and anyone who holds any other is ignorant, deceived or delusional

    I've looked at the evidence that I've had in my life and come to a conclusion. I think it is obvious that my worldview is the right one, and anyone who holds any other is ignorant, deceived or delusional.

    Many of the criticisms of religion are true. Many of the criticisms of adherents to specific religions are also true. You won't get any argument from me there.

    I respect your worldview, since I held it for nearly half my life and it is fairly coherent. It's also very comforting in the face of Christianity which makes you feel bad. It's just when certain other evidence presents itself you either adopt "True Believer" mode, rejecting any evidence that doesn't fit, or you have to change your worldview.

    My worldview says you choose what to believe or not to. Sometime because of the evidence, sometimes despite. And that applies to everyone. For me, having converted from an atheism and brought up in an atheistic family, I think it's "because of".

    I still reserve the right to take the piss out of stupid comments from our resident cloggie and others. I certainly have no issue with your mockery, because I really don't care.
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  10. #110

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    Quote Originally Posted by NotAllThere View Post
    It's awfully simple. You have looked at the evidence that you find around you and come to a conclusion. You think it is obvious that your worldview is the right one, and anyone who holds any other is ignorant, deceived or delusional

    I've looked at the evidence that I've had in my life and come to a conclusion. I think it is obvious that my worldview is the right one, and anyone who holds any other is ignorant, deceived or delusional.

    Many of the criticisms of religion are true. Many of the criticisms of adherents to specific religions are also true. You won't get any argument from me there.

    I respect your worldview, since I held it for nearly half my life and it is fairly coherent. It's also very comforting in the face of Christianity which makes you feel bad. It's just when certain other evidence presents itself you either adopt "True Believer" mode, rejecting any evidence that doesn't fit, or you have to change your worldview.

    My worldview says you choose what to believe or not to. Sometime because of the evidence, sometimes despite. And that applies to everyone. For me, having converted from an atheism and brought up in an atheistic family, I think it's "because of".

    I still reserve the right to take the piss out of stupid comments from our resident cloggie and others. I certainly have no issue with your mockery, because I really don't care.
    You're even more stupid then I thought, former atheist converted in reli-freak. Who brainwashed you so much?

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