WWDC

[d000hg]

If you're an OSX or iOS developer, then ignoring it and not starting to learn it now would seem quite foolish. Its quite clear the eventual plan is to drop Objective-C altogether.

1)Quite clear based on what?
2)Ah, to work on a platform where they decide that the language everyone uses and pretty much always has done should be dropped. Not even MS tried to stop people using C++ in favour of .NET

[TheCyclingProgrammer]

1)Quite clear based on what?
2)Ah, to work on a platform where they decide that the language everyone uses and pretty much always has done should be dropped. Not even MS tried to stop people using C++ in favour of .NET

Just my opinion, but based on the fact that Apple don't tend to keep old technologies round for any longer than they need to, especially if it creates a barrier to further innovation/development. It may be several years before they are ready to drop Objective C for good, but it will happen. Probably on iOS first, where Apple have full control of the platform.

[doodab]

Just my opinion, but based on the fact that Apple don't tend to keep old technologies round for any longer than they need to, especially if it creates a barrier to further innovation/development. It may be several years before they are ready to drop Objective C for good, but it will happen. Probably on iOS first, where Apple have full control of the platform.

From what I understand they are ABI compatible so there is no reason why objective C continuing to exist should be a barrier to innovation as far as I can see.

[NickFitz]

I watched the keynote, but I didn't see any point in mentioning it on here, as all that happens is the usual people squawking "OMG APPLE ARE SAYING THEY INVENTED ELECTRICITY!!???! THEY DIDN'T!!!1!1! I KNOW SOMEBODY WHO USED ELECTRICITY IN 1998!!!ONE!"

[doodab]

I will be interested to see how they handle the inevitable attempts to implement swift compilers on other platforms.

[MicrosoftBob]

I watched the keynote, but I didn't see any point in mentioning it on here, as all that happens is the usual people squawking "OMG APPLE ARE SAYING THEY INVENTED FLAPPY BIRD!!???! THEY DIDN'T!!!1!1! I KNOW SOMEBODY WHO USED FLAPPY BIRD IN 2012!!!ONE!"

FTFY

[d000hg]

From what I understand they are ABI compatible so there is no reason why objective C continuing to exist should be a barrier to innovation as far as I can see.

I was about to say the same thing. The sheer amount of work people have spent becoming expert in OBJ-C is gigantic. Telling developers "we know better than you which tools you should use" is unwise... many many developers prefer C-style languages to something like Python, or vice versa. Forcing people to work in a single paradigm is daft.

[NickFitz]

I was about to say the same thing. The sheer amount of work people have spent becoming expert in OBJ-C is gigantic. Telling developers "we know better than you which tools you should use" is unwise... many many developers prefer C-style languages to something like Python, or vice versa. Forcing people to work in a single paradigm is daft.

Which is why Apple haven't done that. As they explicitly stated during the keynote, you can use Obj-C/Obj-C++ freely alongside Swift.

[d000hg]

Which is why Apple haven't done that. As they explicitly stated during the keynote, you can use Obj-C/Obj-C++ freely alongside Swift.

Yes, I know. But TCP thinks the fact Swift is released means they plan to phase out OBJ-C and that's what I am responding to... to be fair the fact you can use them interchangeably NOW doesn't mean they won't remove support but I still think it's very unlikely. OBJ-C is pretty much synonymous with Mac development.

[NickFitz]

Yes, I know. But TCP thinks the fact Swift is released means they plan to phase out OBJ-C and that's what I am responding to... to be fair the fact you can use them interchangeably NOW doesn't mean they won't remove support but I still think it's very unlikely. OBJ-C is pretty much synonymous with Mac development.

Indeed. Apart from anything else, Apple have an Obj-C codebase that goes back over a quarter of a century (all those APIs are prefixed "NS" because they come from the NeXT OS, NeXTStep). There isn't any real business value in rewriting the entire platform in a new language just because it's there, so they won't. Maybe all new development will be in Swift, but it'll take a very long time before the entire platform has become like Trigger's mop.

There's also little downside to continuing support: they went about this whole thing by first creating the solid underpinnings for multiple language support by creating LLVM, and only then made Swift. (The lead guy who did LLVM then moved on to create Swift, in fact.) The reason they invested that time and effort at the start will have been because of their own need to support legacy code as much as their customers'.