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Should I request a loan write off - when and how?

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    Should I request a loan write off - when and how?

    The above question is being asked with increasing frequency and in an effort to answer it, please see below.

    Loans arise in many, many contractor schemes even though they may sometimes be described as something else.

    If you received money that was not taxed at the time it was paid, chances are that it was a loan or other form of credit. If it was not, then what did you think it was at the time it was paid?

    There are not many choices.

    Remuneration - probably not as it was not taxed.
    Gift - really?
    Investment pay out - where was the investment?

    No. Probably a loan.

    Which means that somewhere there is a contract with your name on it which says that you are obliged to repay the money.

    Where the original lender is still around (IOM trust or other company), then tracing the present manager of the agreement is simple.

    Where the original lender has been liquidated/dissolved etc, the loan asset they held does NOT disappear. It goes to the shareholders. Check company records for the identity of these.

    Where the original lender was a trust, it is not possible for a trustee to unilaterally "dispose" of the trust assets or to walk away. A trustee who wishes to resign needs to find a substitute. Some countries have trust registers and these can be tracked. Others do not but you can ask the last trustee you know of to tell you who they passed the work to. If they refuse, go to the local Regulator.

    So. it's a myth that a loan can vanish. It cannot.

    You may have been told that the loan has depreciated and has been repaid for a low value. Entirely legally possible, but unlikely. The loan charge ignores this action in any event. If you think that has happened, trace the lender and have them confirm this - IN WRITING.

    Be aware that HMRC will view such a letter as having very limited value.

    Let's assume however that you have found your lender, there is a loan and you wish to remove it from your life.

    If you have settled under CLSO 1 - being years to 2010/11 - that should not create a further tax charge.

    If you have settled under CLSO 2 - the latest settlement opportunity - and have a contract that says there will be no more tax charges.

    Then having the loan written off should cause no more tax charges to arise.

    If you have not settled, a loan write off is potentially taxable under section 554C ITEPA.

    A lot will depend on whether the sum in question has been taxed previously, but the answer is usually that it has not.

    So a loan which has not had tax paid on it in the past (ignoring any claim that the interest on such loan has been taxed - irrelevant for this purpose) will attract a tax charge if it is written off now.

    This is therefore to be avoided if:

    1. You are planning on settling (perhaps HMRC will launch CLSO 3 soon?)
    2. You are planning to litigate or challenge the position.

    A charge on a write off will negate both the above.

    If you have taken part in some form of loan cleansing, then the scenario may be more complex. In general however a loan cleansing scheme sees one loan replaced with another which is magically less than the original.

    Chances are that the cleansing activity has created a PART 7A tax charge already. If so, then this will be a "credit" against any subsequent tax charge on the later write off of the replacement loan.

    I hope this helps a bit.
    Best Forum Adviser & Forum Personality of the Year 2018.

    (No, me neither).

    #2
    Thank you.

    Comment


      #3
      Very useful webberg, thanks.

      For someone with pre-2010 closed years, but outstanding loans, who want closure or negate the possibility of any future loan recall by trustees (perhaps on death?) - is there any course of action possible?

      Comment


        #4
        Aah brilliant. So I've worked for nothing then ? Just simply ripped of by crooks. I had no idea whatsoever about the loan scheme. I contracted for six weeks. I had a job lead on Friday and started on Monday. The umbrella was recommended by the agency. I signed up in good faith. The loan bit was on page 22 out of 24 ! I was never told it was a loan scheme. Over two years after I left the outfit they sent me text messages offering me a £50 bonus if I'd rejoin ! How is this allowed to happen ?

        Comment


          #5
          It was "allowed to happen", because the scheme promoters were selling a product which was not regulated, had no external oversight in terms of quality control, did not have to comply with any common standard of practice, there was no body - legal or Government - that had the ability to intervene.

          (In fact the last statement remains true today).

          The situation has been compounded by the fact that when the authority (HMRC) picked up on the fact that you had money which had been taxed very little (or not at all), they were unable to treat all people the same and send all users an enquiry and then progress those enquiries.

          Instead we have a rats nest of some with enquiries, some not, some working, some not, some contractors getting letters, some not.

          So you had a promoter who either did not understand the tax consequences of what they were selling, or more likely did understand but chose to present a different analysis (or sometimes did not mention tax at all) and a tax authority who came to the party late and then scattered invitations to all, randomly.
          Best Forum Adviser & Forum Personality of the Year 2018.

          (No, me neither).

          Comment


            #6
            Why would these outfits write off the loans anyway ? That's what confuses me. If they've no legal requirement to write them off then why should they? Baffled by it all tbh.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by RickG View Post
              Very useful webberg, thanks.

              For someone with pre-2010 closed years, but outstanding loans, who want closure or negate the possibility of any future loan recall by trustees (perhaps on death?) - is there any course of action possible?
              Yes.

              Contact HMRC. Tell them the facts.

              Ask them to confirm - in writing - that a loan write off will not be taxed.
              Best Forum Adviser & Forum Personality of the Year 2018.

              (No, me neither).

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Culps67 View Post
                Why would these outfits write off the loans anyway ? That's what confuses me. If they've no legal requirement to write them off then why should they? Baffled by it all tbh.
                Many of these loans are now in the hands of third parties who have to administer them but collect no fees. Why would they not write off if it made them a few quid?

                Almost no loans remain with the original employers.
                Best Forum Adviser & Forum Personality of the Year 2018.

                (No, me neither).

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by webberg View Post
                  Yes.

                  Contact HMRC. Tell them the facts.

                  Ask them to confirm - in writing - that a loan write off will not be taxed.
                  Sorry - want to understand this a little better. Given your first post said:

                  If you have not settled, a loan write off is potentially taxable under section 554C ITEPA.
                  If one has not settled - and their loans are pre-2010 with the year closed, so let's presume for a second HMRC cannot obtain any tax because there is no open enquiry - why would HMRC not then wait for a loan write off for a second bite of the cherry? I.e. why would they agree to a loan write off not being taxed?

                  Edit - I should add - this scenario is not for me, as I do not have any pre-2010 loans. I just found the point interesting and wanted to understand the impact of 554C - is it HMRC allowing themselves a chance to obtain tax potentially from both ends. If they can't get the tax when the loan was issued (because they forgot to open an enquiry), they get it when the loan is written off.
                  Last edited by RickG; 3 February 2020, 16:46.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by RickG View Post
                    If one has not settled - and their loans are pre-2010 with the year closed, so let's presume for a second HMRC cannot obtain any tax because there is no open enquiry - why would HMRC not then wait for a loan write off for a second bite of the cherry?
                    That's a very good question.
                    Scoots still says that Apr 2020 didn't mark the start of a new stock bull market.

                    Comment

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