Out to in to out Out to in to out
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  1. #1

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    Default Out to in to out

    Current contract ends in a few weeks and moving on. Have a strong likelihood of a new role with a big bank on a big rate. However it’s PAYE meaning aside from loads of tax there’s no expenses, which for me are substantial. Considering suggesting to the client I would sign up on the proviso that as soon as they ‘relax’ their ban on engaging PSC’s they would revert my engagement to and outside IR35 one.

    Would appreciate your thoughts please? Any red lights here?

  2. #2

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    good luck with that.
    let us know how you get on.
    Entropy is NOT what it used to be.
    Inertia, however........................

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by oliverson View Post
    Current contract ends in a few weeks and moving on. Have a strong likelihood of a new role with a big bank on a big rate. However it’s PAYE meaning aside from loads of tax there’s no expenses, which for me are substantial. Considering suggesting to the client I would sign up on the proviso that as soon as they ‘relax’ their ban on engaging PSC’s they would revert my engagement to and outside IR35 one.

    Would appreciate your thoughts please? Any red lights here?
    See my magic bean thread


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  4. #4

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    Ok so we're not in general (or Kansas).

    Think about it. Please.

    You're self declared outside based on... I will assume you had your contract and working arrangements reviewed and confirmed as outside.

    You then accept the client's offer that the only way you can work for them, doing the same work, is via a PAYE scheme. This immediately implies that your previous outside self determination was sketchy. So you may as well sue them for unpaid benefits.

    You then strike a deal that says you self determine as outside once the client relaxes their policy. So you're now saying the client was wrong in their inside determination and they obviously agree as they're going to switch back with no qualms whatsoever. So you may as well sue them for unlawfully deducted taxes.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by ladymuck View Post
    Ok so we're not in general (or Kansas).

    Think about it. Please.

    You're self declared outside based on... I will assume you had your contract and working arrangements reviewed and confirmed as outside.

    You then accept the client's offer that the only way you can work for them, doing the same work, is via a PAYE scheme. This immediately implies that your previous outside self determination was sketchy. So you may as well sue them for unpaid benefits.

    You then strike a deal that says you self determine as outside once the client relaxes their policy. So you're now saying the client was wrong in their inside determination and they obviously agree as they're going to switch back with no qualms whatsoever. So you may as well sue them for unlawfully deducted taxes.
    Apologies. I wrote this post on the train and didn’t make it explicit. Current client is not in the equation anymore. The potential one is a new one.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by ladymuck View Post
    Ok so we're not in general (or Kansas).

    Think about it. Please.

    You accept the client's offer that the only way you can work for them is via a PAYE scheme.

    You then strike a deal that says you self determine as outside once the client relaxes their policy. So you're now saying the client was wrong in their inside determination, for exactly the same role, and they obviously agree as they're going to switch with no qualms whatsoever. So you may as well sue them for unlawfully deducted taxes.
    There you go, I've updated my response in light of your additonal information.

    Of course, you could leave, work elsewhere for 6-12 months and return with a new status, completely different work and working practices. Do you want to add that as an additional clarification too?

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by oliverson View Post
    Apologies. I wrote this post on the train and didn’t make it explicit. Current client is not in the equation anymore. The potential one is a new one.
    Train wine drinking is a curse

    What’s your new clients policy ?


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  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by GhostofTarbera View Post
    Train wine drinking is a curse

    What’s your new clients policy ?


    Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum
    No wine, I'm on a Spanish train and they don't do the buffet cart!

    But as an aside, this site is far from good on mobile, especially with deteriorating eyesight.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by ladymuck View Post
    There you go, I've updated my response in light of your additonal information.

    Of course, you could leave, work elsewhere for 6-12 months and return with a new status, completely different work and working practices. Do you want to add that as an additional clarification too?
    There's no 'self-determination' post April as I'm sure you're aware.

    Is there a real risk in transitioning, if even possible, this future PAYE contract to an outside IR35 contract, should the bank relax its policy? I'm finding it hard turning down a £ 200k deal even if it is PAYE (some holiday, sick pay and pension included but not sure of the precise details so far) but I'd be better off on their usual contract terms on an outside basis, given the considerable annual expenses I'd incur (c. £ 28k a year).

    What's the risk of the revenue sniffing around for contracts suddenly on PAYE? Would they look at the history of that person? Hmm, you've accepted a PAYE deal with bank X, so we'd like to review your 16 years previous contracts (I'm sure the window is less but you get the point).

  10. #10

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    me again.

    I woke up in the middle of the night thinking of this and this morning did a few calculations. Even on the rate, it's an absolute non-starter when all the tax is deducted and having to pay the expenses myself. I'd be better off on a very average rate back home in the North.

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