HMRC view on blanket ban? Have we all seen this- taken off LinkedIn HMRC view on blanket ban? Have we all seen this- taken off LinkedIn - Page 2
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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by eek View Post
    +1 - Microsoft have adopted the viewpoint it's not worth the risk - no contractors via a PSC for direct work - we don't know what the secondary angle is yet but that would only impact work within UK.

    The impact on their European consulting model will be substantial - UK contractors provided all the back fill across Europe and made up half the team.
    But the rules will still apply if Microsoft choose to use intermediaries no? And will the intermediaries also blanket ban PSCs?

    If Microsoft’s view is that it is not worth the risk then is that a generalisation or have they looked at each specific case? Sounds to me like a generalisation in which case, has reasonable care been taken to arrive at this position? - I very much doubt it.


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    Quote Originally Posted by ladymuck View Post
    Sadly I agree with the above. Few companies are making blanket determinations, they are making policy statements to not use workers via a certain engagement route.
    Really confusing state of affairs tbh. Hopefully even more clarification comes in March. It’s not helpful if companies are all taking a blanket ban position. They really need to educate themselves on what they want and how to deal with contractors and this won’t be such a big problem for all ....


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  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by TNA57 View Post
    But the rules will still apply if Microsoft choose to use intermediaries no? And will the intermediaries also blanket ban PSCs?

    If Microsoft’s view is that it is not worth the risk then is that a generalisation or have they looked at each specific case? Sounds to me like a generalisation in which case, has reasonable care been taken to arrive at this position? - I very much doubt it.


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    Microsoft were seriously caught out by contractors in America years ago - it would be a very brave (and short-term) country lead who would try and ignore local Government (HMRC) and global HR advice.

    I believe its a corporate blanket ban from on high - there is a risk remove the risk by not allowing it to occur.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TNA57 View Post
    Really confusing state of affairs tbh. Hopefully even more clarification comes in March. It’s not helpful if companies are all taking a blanket ban position. They really need to educate themselves on what they want and how to deal with contractors and this won’t be such a big problem for all ....


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    Why? You may want them to educate themselves, senior management just want to get on with live and reduce risk. IR35 is now a risk that can be easily removed by just banning the use of PSCs. You can sort everything else later by offshoring, recruitment or bringing people in from overseas.
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    Quote Originally Posted by eek View Post
    Why? You may want them to educate themselves, senior management just want to get on with live and reduce risk. IR35 is now a risk that can be easily removed by just banning the use of PSCs. You can sort everything else later by offshoring, recruitment or bringing people in from overseas.
    In theory yes, banning PSC all together seems to remove risk... but is it really?

    As i know, most are now asking their contractors to move inside because they want to keep their resources. And most contractors are obliging to do so. They want to keep their jobs.

    But what if HMRC comes around and start investigating these Contractors. Moving inside from previous outside with same client raises red alert. Then it will get to the clients themselves eventually. So after all, did the risk got removed?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BritishLad88 View Post
    In theory yes, banning PSC all together seems to remove risk... but is it really?

    As i know, most are now asking their contractors to move inside because they want to keep their resources. And most contractors are obliging to do so. They want to keep their jobs.

    But what if HMRC comes around and start investigating these Contractors. Moving inside from previous outside with same client raises red alert. Then it will get to the clients themselves eventually. So after all, did the risk got removed?
    What risk has the corporation got? Prior to April 2020 it's not their responsibility - it only becomes their responsibility on April 6th and they can show that full tax is paid as everyone is being paid is if there were inside IR35.

    Now there is a hell of a risk for HMRC to retrospectively chase after the contractor for money that should have been paid prior to April 2020 but what risk is there for the corporation?
    Last edited by eek; 9th February 2020 at 16:12.
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  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by BritishLad88 View Post
    In theory yes, banning PSC all together seems to remove risk... but is it really?

    As i know, most are now asking their contractors to move inside because they want to keep their resources. And most contractors are obliging to do so. They want to keep their jobs.

    But what if HMRC comes around and start investigating these Contractors. Moving inside from previous outside with same client raises red alert. Then it will get to the clients themselves eventually. So after all, did the risk got removed?
    You seem to be conflating banning PSCs and moving inside. These are two very different things. Banning PSC = No SDS. No SDS = no insider determination. Its not really that complicated.

    So, for the client, yes, banning PSCs removes all risk on their side,

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paralytic View Post
    These are two very different things.
    Yes, 2 different things but are linked so need to view them closely together.

    Banning PSCs = Contractors can't be outside anymore = Move Inside or Leave or Perm.

    Of course could move Perm and that would remove risk for both sides completely but doesn't seem like most contractors are choosing this option though.
    If leave, clients won't be happy as they would be losing their resources. So they'll try upmost best to convince people to move inside.

    So that leaves moves inside. Like I say, contractors moving inside will raise red flag = HMRC *could* start investigation = which would lead back to the client.

    Hope that makes sense!

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    Quote Originally Posted by BritishLad88 View Post
    Yes, 2 different things but are linked so need to view them closely together.

    Banning PSCs = Contractors can't be outside anymore = Move Inside or Leave or Perm.

    Of course could move Perm and that would remove risk for both sides completely but doesn't seem like most contractors are choosing this option though.
    If leave, clients won't be happy as they would be losing their resources. So they'll try upmost best to convince people to move inside.

    So that leaves moves inside. Like I say, contractors moving inside will raise red flag = HMRC *could* start investigation = which would lead back to the client.

    Hope that makes sense!
    How does it lead back to the client - the client wasn't responsible until April 2020 and after that has done everything possible to ensure maximum Employer NI has been paid.
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    have you read the post two up from yours?
    the client has NO problems.

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