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Could it be worth paying legal fees to challenge an inside determination?

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    Could it be worth paying legal fees to challenge an inside determination?

    Am expecting an inside determination (though have not actually been contacted by end client's HR dept who just ignore emails). Contract runs until end of November 2020. Other contractors in same role, same dept have received inside determinations & are suggesting we engage a lawyer to contest this. Anyone else considered this route? Any views on there being any chance we could win gratefully received. I reckon being inside will incur costs of around £10K for rest of contract, legal fees could be £2K to £3K each.

    #2
    You have the right to appeal, I would try that first.
    "I can put any old tat in my sig, put quotes around it and attribute to someone of whom I've heard, to make it sound true."
    - Voltaire/Benjamin Franklin/Anne Frank...

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      #3
      Originally posted by cojak View Post
      You have the right to appeal, I would try that first.
      And that's about all you can do but it won't make any difference as I suspect there are answers that when combined mean any client company can force an inside verdict.

      Being blunt your options are:

      1) Accept it
      2) Appeal (but expect to lose)
      3) Resign on mass and see if that forces your client to reach a different verdict. However you do need enough people doing it that it forces the department to change it's mind and I suspect you don't have the numbers or the impact that will make the difference.
      merely at clientco for the entertainment

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        #4
        I would plan for and execute option 3.

        1. Get your SDS and CEST responses all lined up for the HR result.
        2. If you know all the contractors where you are, get them to do the same.
        3. Upon receipt of this decision, forward to the relevant person the above responses, so at least they have something to chew on.
        4. And if the HR dept are not willing to listen or discuss, an en masse walk out.

        The thing about a lawyer is that, it is only the contract you can discuss. How will the working practices marry up, which can only be reviewed in time? (Am only mentioning this last as this is how contractors were reviewed when investigated)

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by simes View Post
          I would plan for and execute option 3.

          1. Get your SDS and CEST responses all lined up for the HR result.
          2. If you know all the contractors where you are, get them to do the same.
          3. Upon receipt of this decision, forward to the relevant person the above responses, so at least they have something to chew on.
          4. And if the HR dept are not willing to listen or discuss, an en masse walk out.

          The thing about a lawyer is that, it is only the contract you can discuss. How will the working practices marry up, which can only be reviewed in time? (Am only mentioning this last as this is how contractors were reviewed when investigated)
          Why do 3 - the initial decision has been made. You go with paperwork as to why you think you are outside and give the ultimatum - change the decision based on these facts that we think you've missed / got wrong or we walk..

          But remember in the new world I think any client could (if they so desire) generate a statement that shows that they believe you are inside and expect you to be inside.
          merely at clientco for the entertainment

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by eek View Post
            Why do 3 - the initial decision has been made. You go with paperwork as to why you think you are outside and give the ultimatum - change the decision based on these facts that we think you've missed / got wrong or we walk..

            But remember in the new world I think any client could (if they so desire) generate a statement that shows that they believe you are inside and expect you to be inside.
            Just simes talking rubbish. No way would he do any of that.

            Surprised no one has mentioned client binning everyone and starting again once it's got too far for them. I'd expect this would be around 2nd complaint around determination.
            'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!

            Comment


              #7
              In answer to OPs question.. No it is not.
              'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by northernladuk View Post
                In answer to OPs question.. No it is not.
                Can I make that slightly clearer, if you don't mind..

                No, it is not worth paying legal fees as there is nothing to legally fight...
                merely at clientco for the entertainment

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by eek View Post
                  Can I make that slightly clearer, if you don't mind..

                  No, it is not worth paying legal fees as there is nothing to legally fight...
                  But.. But.. But. We don't like it. It must be illegal
                  'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by eek View Post
                    1. Why do 3 - the initial decision has been made. You go with paperwork as to why you think you are outside and give the ultimatum - change the decision based on these facts that we think you've missed / got wrong or we walk..

                    2. But remember in the new world I think any client could (if they so desire) generate a statement that shows that they believe you are inside and expect you to be inside.
                    1. Fair enough point. But believing in the mantra, 'if you don't ask you don't get', similarly, 'if you don't educate they won't learn'.

                    If you offer information and evidence as to why you feel there is a different answer, it may still fall on deaf ears, to be sure. But the responsible thing in me says, 'hope for the best but plan for the worst'. In this case, hoping for the best would be that someone, somewhere and some time actually reads the response to consider an alternative view. When they are ready perhaps.

                    The worst being my point 4.

                    All this to say, if afforded the chance to speak to the client or forward information, I will take it. Sitting back and silent will ensure the clients will Never learn.

                    As to your point 2, completely agreed. I am just thinking 6-12 months down the line when there is less fearful knee jerk reacting.

                    Let's see...

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