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Nothing will change until IR35 changes start to hurt clients

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    #11
    Originally posted by mockedguy View Post
    Excuse my ignorance, but what do you mean by 'permie-tractors'? and why are they referred to as 'them'?

    There are a few here who clearly seem to laughingly take the p*ss out of other contractors as though they aren't real contractors like you are. I'm not being *rsey, just trying to understand what makes you feel you are a valid contractor and the others not?
    Permie-Tractors. HMRC's definition would be be part and parcel of the org and not in business of their own accord. Which judging by what you have said in your original post, they are bang on the money.

    Many contractors, have little or no knowledge of IR35, intermediates reporting requirements, SD&C, etc. I've just come across one who advises on Health and Safety he has never needed business insurance he tells me because he ways always covered by the client!

    HMRC know all this, pre-April 2020 proving someone is in or out was a long haul. Post April 2020 the contractor has done all the hard work, stayed at the same location for years, then hey presto goes PAYE, nothing to prove. Disguised employee, pay on account. Next.

    Was is £4.5 Billion I heard mentioned in the budget for tax avoidance measures. Think its quite obvious where a lot of this is coming from.

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      #12
      C virus has killed everything, the impact of IR35 is hidden, nobody will notice.
      This default font is sooooooooooooo boring and so are short usernames

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        #13
        Originally posted by abz2020 View Post
        Funny this, in my current role (outside ir35), there are only contractors. Zero perm people do what we do.
        If team is full of contractors with no perms, then you are all perms. No team of genuine vendors can deliver if there is no client to deliver to. Also, if you have hired 20 people to do a job and they all work without substantial control then there is no hope of getting the project delivered.

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          #14
          Originally posted by northernladuk View Post
          You first paragraph kinda makes the argument that HMRC have got it right. Years at a client, no idea of being a contractor and just carry on. If they've unearthed all this they are hardly going to admit they dropped a bollock and change anything.

          THIS

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            #15
            Originally posted by mockedguy View Post
            Excuse my ignorance, but what do you mean by 'permie-tractors'? and why are they referred to as 'them'?

            There are a few here who clearly seem to laughingly take the p*ss out of other contractors as though they aren't real contractors like you are. I'm not being *rsey, just trying to understand what makes you feel you are a valid contractor and the others not?
            Everything that everyone above says.

            On CUK there are Professional Forums where people are informed about things such as Professional Insurance, accounts and accounting, IR35, taxes. We are anti-tax avoidance schemes, we are pro-IBOYOA (look it up, that’s what we do), 24-month rule, etc.

            I even wrote up a thread to on how to decide whether people stay or go after April in September.

            All contractors need to do is be curious and google this stuff up and inform themselves, they don’t even need to use CUK.

            But permitractors don’t. They are not curious, they don’t care other than making sure the money goes into their account at the end of the month whereupon they spend it. They are not interested in the nuance of working for the same clients for multiple years. Most will have enough to pay the tax their accountant tells them to pay but some won’t, relying on luck to see them through.

            Sometimes it feels that I am just yelling into a bucket, hearing my own voice yelling back at me.

            We will give advice but we are increasingly unsympathetic with these contractors if they come here weeping “it’s not fair!”.

            Edit: oh, and don’t forget warchests. We LOVE warchest, the bigger the better. Three months minimum, 6 months best practice.
            Last edited by cojak; 17 March 2020, 12:43. Reason: Gotta love them warchests.
            "I can put any old tat in my sig, put quotes around it and attribute to someone of whom I've heard, to make it sound true."
            - Voltaire/Benjamin Franklin/Anne Frank...

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              #16
              Originally posted by cojak View Post
              Sometimes it feels that I am just yelling into a bucket, hearing my own voice yelling back at me.
              And does it scare you as much as us when we hear you yelling?
              We will give advice but we are increasingly unsympathetic with these contractors if they come here weeping “it’s not fair!”.
              And asking, 'Will this work' less than 3 weeks before D-Day.
              'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!

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                #17
                Originally posted by MPwannadecentincome View Post
                C virus has killed everything, the impact of IR35 is hidden, nobody will notice.
                Exactly..many of these posts will become totally irrelevant soon...

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                  #18
                  Originally posted by andydd68 View Post
                  Exactly..many of these posts will become totally irrelevant soon...
                  Some posters would believe I have over 42k of those already.
                  'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!

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                    #19
                    Originally posted by BrilloPad View Post
                    Besides, banks will offshore the work. Plenty of skilled, qualified workers who don't whine, are not self entitled, and get on with it.
                    Have you ever seen the quality of offshore work? The only people who think it is a good idea are managers without any technical background who resent paying for quality software. I worked at a major bank and they offshored their entire IT dept and regretted it severely. It took them 7 years to get it back. One manager told me for one system I had built them it took 6mths to get 1 checkbox correctly added to a screen. I've seen many other companies nearly go into administration doing it (some did). Look forward to lots more data breaches then.

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                      #20
                      Originally posted by Graham1967 View Post
                      Permie-Tractors. HMRC's definition would be be part and parcel of the org and not in business of their own accord.
                      Tell that to nearly every contract up to now where it is made a requirement by the client, not the contractor, you must have your own limited company to work through.

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