Claiming travel and overseas course as business expense?

**Bluebird** · 7 August 2007, 10:34

Originally posted by vhadiant

Hi all, a question if I can do this.

I'll be taking time off to Singapore & Sydney for 2 weeks to visit my family & friends. 1 week in Singapore & 1 week in Sydney. Checking out the finance course down in Sydney they are heaps cheaper than London. There is 1 course near the end of my holiday on the Thursday and I'll be flying back to London on the Sunday.

Well for the course I will definitely classify it as business expenses, however can I classify the travel expenses as 'business related'? Or should I only claim half of the plane ticket? ie: coming back from Sydney to London?

I called my accountant and they can't tell me for sure what's legal or not. They said they won't advise me for putting the travel as business related expense.

Thanks!

I think the HMRC take the view that expenses must be "wholly and justifiably" for Business Purposes - providing you can prove that then you can claim the travel - if not then I don't think you can.

I guess they would take the view that saving £500 on a course does not justify the travel and accomodation expenses you incur by travlleling to Oz....

**Ardesco** · 7 August 2007, 10:34

If it it a holiday it is not a business expense and caliming it as such is tax evasion which is illegal.

HTH

**TheFaQQer** · 7 August 2007, 10:57

I would claim it, if you can justify that the travel etc. makes it better to do the training there.

I did a training course in Goa this year, and expenses the whole lot - but it was much cheaper than doing it in the UK.

**vhadiant** · 7 August 2007, 11:35

Interesting view point.

A similar course in UK is about £700 + VAT while in Sydney it cost $580 or roughly £250 total saving say around £450. If I only claim half of the plane ticket (on the way back to London, I'm flying straight to the client site on Monday morning) isn't it justifiable business travel expense?

The first 2 weeks are considered holiday, thus maybe it's far too stretched to claim it as business expense, but how about the cost to go back to the client side from Sydney?

**Bluebird** · 7 August 2007, 12:11

Originally posted by vhadiant

Interesting view point.

A similar course in UK is about £700 + VAT while in Sydney it cost $580 or roughly £250 total saving say around £450. If I only claim half of the plane ticket (on the way back to London, I'm flying straight to the client site on Monday morning) isn't it justifiable business travel expense?

The first 2 weeks are considered holiday, thus maybe it's far too stretched to claim it as business expense, but how about the cost to go back to the client side from Sydney?

I think the problem you'll get is trying to pick and choose which bits are business and which bits are personal - as Mal always says you should think like a business.

If you Co as your employer is willing to pay to fly you out to and back from Oz, put you up in accommodation and to take a course, then it's ok.

But to claim for just the course and the flight home makes the flight a BIK of some sort - ie if the company didn't fly you back you'd be stuck and therefore these is a benifit to you in them paying for the flight.

You might be better off putting it all through as an expense - depneding on how long the course is in relation to the time of your stay.

**TheFaQQer** · 7 August 2007, 12:42

Originally posted by Bluebird

I think the problem you'll get is trying to pick and choose which bits are business and which bits are personal - as Mal always says you should think like a business.

If you Co as your employer is willing to pay to fly you out to and back from Oz, put you up in accommodation and to take a course, then it's ok.

But to claim for just the course and the flight home makes the flight a BIK of some sort - ie if the company didn't fly you back you'd be stuck and therefore these is a benifit to you in them paying for the flight.

You might be better off putting it all through as an expense - depneding on how long the course is in relation to the time of your stay.

That was exactly the advice from my accountant - I stayed out for two days at the end to wait for a better flight (and relax!) and suggested paying for them myself.

His recommendation was to claim for the whole lot - if you try to split it out, then HMRC might start to look closer, to see what parts are allowable or not.

Claim it all.

**vhadiant** · 7 August 2007, 12:48

Well the only problem is I'm away for 2 weeks and will only be doing the course for 1 day.

I was thinking if I can sort of fit this course and justify the return leg home as business expenses. The course is directly related to the business and a lot cheaper down there.

Maybe it's too risky and I shouldn't bother trying to do this. It's not worth the risk?

**Bluebird** · 7 August 2007, 12:56

Originally posted by vhadiant

Well the only problem is I'm away for 2 weeks and will only be doing the course for 1 day.

I was thinking if I can sort of fit this course and justify the return leg home as business expenses. The course is directly related to the business and a lot cheaper down there.

Maybe it's too risky and I shouldn't bother trying to do this. It's not worth the risk?

You're fine with the course, it's the travel which is not "wholly & justifiable" business expense...

**Jason D** · 7 August 2007, 12:59

Trip

For trips outside the UK you can expense 100% of your travel costs if duration <1 week and trip primarily for business. Yours fails on both counts so the Revenue will look for an allocation of business v pleasure.

Get a formal board minute drawn up authorising the company to pay your flight costs and that you meet your own accomodation costs (in excess of those required for the course).

Get all invoices/bills to be addressed to the company and then personally reimburse the private element, negating any P11D entries.

www.dormerfinance.co.uk

Claiming travel and overseas course as business expense?