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jonny7_2002
31st March 2008, 12:03
Is it just me (more than likely) or is there hardly any 2nd/3rd Line IT support Contracts about?
I am in the west midlands, which is as dead as a churchyard normally so if there is a slump it just kills it!

Does anyone share my feelings?

It should pick up in the newfinancial year shouldnt it??
is the "credit Crunch" affecting contracting in any way?

Jonny Moron :frown

ferret
31st March 2008, 12:59
Bumping before it disappears off front page.

PAH
31st March 2008, 13:14
Looking a bit slow for me too, and I'm on the .net bandwagon, or was, which I was under the impression is at the more buoyant end of the market.


Even the latest vacancy I've applied for seems to have every agency in the area advertising it since I threw my CV into the ring. Not sure what that means, in the past at most two agencies would be chasing the same vacancy I applied for on jobserve, this one has 4 or 5! The optimist in me says it's because there's a lack of applicants so the client is casting their net wider by using more agencies. The pessimist in me says it's the client trying to find as many applicants as they can, so they can get the cheapest one that looks capable of doing the job.

Hopefully things will pick up in april if many companies are waiting for new budgets to be released.

Francko
31st March 2008, 13:15
Is it just me (more than likely) or is there hardly any 2nd/3rd Line IT support Contracts about?


Plenty of them. As long as you live in China or India.

sasguru
31st March 2008, 13:16
Is it just me (more than likely) or is there hardly any 2nd/3rd Line IT support Contracts about?
I am in the west midlands, which is as dead as a churchyard normally so if there is a slump it just kills it!

Does anyone share my feelings?

It should pick up in the newfinancial year shouldnt it??
is the "credit Crunch" affecting contracting in any way?

Jonny Moron :frown

I like your honesty.

jonny7_2002
31st March 2008, 13:17
Plenty of them. As long as you live in China or India.

The only problem is i dont speak Chinese or Indian/Punjab (i dont mean to offend just not sure of the language over there)

King Cnvt
31st March 2008, 13:22
Is it just me (more than likely) or is there hardly any 2nd/3rd Line IT support Contracts about?

Yes.

I am in the west midlands, which is as dead as a churchyard normally so if there is a slump it just kills it!

Yes.

Does anyone share my feelings?

Yes.

It should pick up in the newfinancial year shouldnt it??

No.

is the "credit Crunch" affecting contracting in any way?

Yes.

Jonny Moron :frown

Yes.

HTH

jonny7_2002
31st March 2008, 13:23
HTH

HTH??? what does that mean? sorry im a bit slow (maybe thats why i cant find many contracts! :laugh)

gingerjedi
31st March 2008, 13:34
Tell me about it...

It's the same in the South West, I've been benched for 8 weeks now but the only roles I see are paying less than I have ever taken and that includes being a complete ‘noob’ 5 years back, I thought about doing numpty rollout work to keep going but even that is thin on the ground.:eek:

Sign 'o' the times I guess, if you specialise in something there are still some great rewards but the risk of shelling out to train up in something that could be old hat by the time you're up to speed is just too great, I plan to kick the arse out of every contract I get until the mortgage is paid off then take a permie role so I don't have to worry about eating at least… a long way from my lofty dreams of a few years ago but I just feel disillusioned by it all these days.:(

unemployed
31st March 2008, 13:41
Tell me about it...

It's the same in the South West, I've been benched for 8 weeks now but the only roles I see are paying less than I have ever taken and that includes being a complete ‘noob’ 5 years back, I thought about doing numpty rollout work to keep going but even that is thin on the ground.:eek:

Sign 'o' the times I guess, if you specialise in something there are still some great rewards but the risk of shelling out to train up in something that could be old hat by the time you're up to speed is just too great, I plan to kick the arse out of every contract I get until the mortgage is paid off then take a permie role so I don't have to worry about eating at least… a long way from my lofty dreams of a few years ago but I just feel disillusioned by it all these days.:(

:rollin: try being benched for 104 weeks :banana:

gingerjedi
31st March 2008, 13:43
:rollin: try being benched for 104 weeks :banana:

You don't want to work... even I would have taken a bar job by week 52!

jonny7_2002
31st March 2008, 13:43
Tell me about it...

It's the same in the South West, I've been benched for 8 weeks now but the only roles I see are paying less than I have ever taken and that includes being a complete ‘noob’ 5 years back, I thought about doing numpty rollout work to keep going but even that is thin on the ground.:eek:

I just feel disillusioned by it all these days.:(



i now have a small contract which finishes in 2 weeks; rubbish IT ADMIN - setting up 2000 odd SAP accounts and a few Roles which is soo MUNDANE it is unbelievable! :tired

Im looking at anything at the moment to keep me going and hoping the company budgets are set free in the new financial year to employ me and pay my bills! there are a few rollout positions out there but it seems like their are plenty in my shoes who are looking and they are all flooding the agencies with CV's.

Do you ever get that sinking feeling when you wonder what the benefits of contracting are any more!!

It doesnt help when the agencies ring you tryin to get a peek of your :moon: ................ "I might have a position for you but i NEED TWO REFEREES........ so i dont have to talk to you anymore and can tout for business at all your previous contracts!"

LOVE IT!!!:rolleyes:

Churchill
31st March 2008, 13:44
:rollin: try being benched for 104 weeks :banana:

You are what's known in the trade as a "lazy bastard".

unemployed
31st March 2008, 13:46
You don't want to work... even I would have taken a bar job by week 52!

No i just refuse to work for crap , however long it takes.
Pity no one else thinks like this as house prices would be acceptable and wages would be brilliant.

jonny7_2002
31st March 2008, 13:48
No i just refuse to work for crap , however long it takes.
Pity no one else thinks like this as house prices would be acceptable and wages would be brilliant.

so who pays for your broadband connection so you can S1t on you :moon: all day?

NotAllThere
31st March 2008, 13:50
Is it just me (more than likely) or are there hardly any 2nd/3rd Line IT support Contracts about?

It's because the quality of programming has got so high, what with all the offshoring, so there's nothing for you to support.

unemployed
31st March 2008, 13:54
so who pays for your broadband connection so you can S1t on you :moon: all day?


Me of course :banana:

gingerjedi
31st March 2008, 13:54
No i just refuse to work for crap , however long it takes.
Pity no one else thinks like this as house prices would be acceptable and wages would be brilliant.

I'm with you on that but I can only last so long or all the hard work of financially elevating myself above a permie gets undone, one minute its all skiing holidays and Porsches the next its Butlins and buses.:o

TheFaQQer
31st March 2008, 14:01
HTH??? what does that mean? sorry im a bit slow (maybe thats why i cant find many contracts! :laugh)

Hope that helps.

HTH

ChimpMaster
31st March 2008, 14:10
If it really is that bad out there I might have to convert to permie status and take that £60k job :(

Sockpuppet
31st March 2008, 14:16
No i just refuse to work for crap , however long it takes.
Pity no one else thinks like this as house prices would be acceptable and wages would be brilliant.

Are you technically still looking or are you now retired?

jonny7_2002
31st March 2008, 14:18
Are you technically still looking or are you now retired?

technically living with his parents in the spare room selling computer parts to pay for his broadband line.... :banana:

unemployed
31st March 2008, 14:21
Are you technically still looking or are you now retired?


Still looking ?

unemployed
31st March 2008, 14:31
technically living with his parents in the spare room selling computer parts to pay for his broadband line.... :banana:

Hey how do you know so much about me :rollin:

PAH
31st March 2008, 14:48
Hey how do you know so much about me :rollin:

It's a common theme amongst us benched contractors.

I'm hoping all those recent new members who are making the jump from permie to contracting succeed, so there's at least a permie job for us to fall-back onto when we get desperate and give up contracting for a while. :rollin:

lukemg
31st March 2008, 16:01
I am suffering splinters too, out since New Year. in 3 months only managed to get 3 interviews, 2 telephone, 1 face-to-face.
THINK I have struck lucky on the last one, going for a face-to-face/meet the team on Wednesday, will prepare for interview and hope it's a formality...
It has been TOUGH getting back in the game, real roller coaster, hopes raised and dashed, roles being pulled, agents being agents.
Tried to be chilled about it and made plans to get some useful training to open doors (I think I am missing out sometimes to increased numbers who have the certificates to put on the table Prince2/ITIL).
I packed in a work-away contract, this was a big mistake, I should have stayed and found something else first, hindsight is great.
Good luck to all out there, try to keep your confidence up but you can't flog a dead horse, if you aren't getting enough calls/interviews, then you need to have a rethink, get some training, contact everyone you have ever worked with and consider Permie - I certainly have been.

shelby68
31st March 2008, 16:43
Hey how do you know so much about me :rollin:

I'm curious, how you feel a prospective employer is going to view someone who has been out of work for 2 yrs from choice?

How are you going to integrate back into 9-5 or whatever hours you end up working after all that time.

Turion
31st March 2008, 18:26
I am suffering splinters too, out since New Year. in 3 months only managed to get 3 interviews, 2 telephone, 1 face-to-face.
THINK I have struck lucky on the last one, going for a face-to-face/meet the team on Wednesday, will prepare for interview and hope it's a formality...
It has been TOUGH getting back in the game, real roller coaster, hopes raised and dashed, roles being pulled, agents being agents.
Tried to be chilled about it and made plans to get some useful training to open doors (I think I am missing out sometimes to increased numbers who have the certificates to put on the table Prince2/ITIL).
I packed in a work-away contract, this was a big mistake, I should have stayed and found something else first, hindsight is great.
Good luck to all out there, try to keep your confidence up but you can't flog a dead horse, if you aren't getting enough calls/interviews, then you need to have a rethink, get some training, contact everyone you have ever worked with and consider Permie - I certainly have been.


Bet you wish you'd stayed permie. Maybe this story should be in the first timers guide. Good luck, with the interview. I do know several permie PM's talking seriously about going contract. Think they could be onto a loser in the short term at least. Bench time tends to weaken contractors resolve when it comes to agents. Hope that have not been singing like a canary. :ohwell

DiscoStu
31st March 2008, 18:51
You're going to have to learn how to do the needful if you want a support gig...

unemployed
31st March 2008, 23:54
I'm curious, how you feel a prospective employer is going to view someone who has been out of work for 2 yrs from choice?

How are you going to integrate back into 9-5 or whatever hours you end up working after all that time.

I really don`t view it as a problem , i have worked with some big companies in the past and looked after hundreds of servers with no help to begin with.

The problem lies where in the past you have 1 guy for AD 1 guy for Exchange another guy For citrix and so on , Now employers want you to do all these jobs on your own.

lukemg
1st April 2008, 08:40
Bet you wish you'd stayed permie. Maybe this story should be in the first timers guide. Good luck, with the interview. I do know several permie PM's talking seriously about going contract. Think they could be onto a loser in the short term at least. Bench time tends to weaken contractors resolve when it comes to agents. Hope that have not been singing like a canary. :ohwell

No, I don't wish I had stayed perm, I have earned at least twice as much in the last 18 months (2 contracts) even with the 3 months off !
Just be aware, if you are planning to jump, it would be advisable to have a plan B that you can pick up and drop for the quiet times (e.g. HGV driver who posts on here !) or a favourite hobby that can fill in the time, I love golf but not in the winter !
There are always some roles in demand and London/South-East seems to be a reasonable conveyor belt of jobs (not financial now though !) but if you are somewhere more remote (North-West !!) it can be very patchy !

Epiphone
1st April 2008, 12:39
The problem lies where in the past you have 1 guy for AD 1 guy for Exchange another guy For citrix and so on , Now employers want you to do all these jobs on your own.

For £10 an hour too.

AlfredJPruffock
1st April 2008, 17:03
Lets face it support jobs are so simple that why not get the contractor to do it all.

All work and no play makes Alf a dull chap

unemployed
1st April 2008, 17:34
Lets face it support jobs are so simple that why not get the contractor to do it all.

All work and no play makes Alf a dull chap

:laugh

If you are talking about desktop support yes it is easy, But things get a little more tricky when your talking about Nas installations or setting up servers as clusters Etc. Not fun when 1000 users can`t work.

Although in the early days i can remember supporting developers who thought is was a right to save critical work on the desktop hard drive.
Shame when it fails and they have to call the support monkey to fix it for them.:rollin:

bogeyman
1st April 2008, 17:51
:laugh

If you are talking about desktop support yes it is easy, But things get a little more tricky when your talking about Nas installations or setting up servers as clusters Etc. Not fun when 1000 users can`t work.


That's hardly 'rocket science' either.

That's the trouble. Too many people have had an easy ride in the good times and think their 'skills' are somehow rare and hard to come by, and that they deserve 'decent rates'.

Not so, I'm afraid.

If people only have medium/low-grade 'IT knowledge' skills then they are in for a big shock in the next decade.

The money has gone pal. The 3rd world caught up on your skillz.

Unless you're a very, very good specialist and practitioner, expect to be doing something else for a living in 5 years time.

Unless you're a business genius and entrepreneur (not the country for it) then do something practical, with your brain and your hands.

ruskithebear
1st April 2008, 18:03
I really don`t view it as a problem , i have worked with some big companies in the past and looked after hundreds of servers with no help to begin with.

The problem lies where in the past you have 1 guy for AD 1 guy for Exchange another guy For citrix and so on , Now employers want you to do all these jobs on your own.

I like your self belief, but I think its clouding your judgment somewhat, your two years on the bench, what skills do you possible have now that I can't get from the other candidates who have just rolled off a gig?

Note to all want to be contractors - When you are a contractor, self imposed benching does not put money in your pocket. It might feel right and just but a few weeks of no dough soon chips away at the moral mountain you stand upon.

Self imposed benching - dont do it kids.............

bogeyman
1st April 2008, 18:09
When you are a contractor, self imposed benching does not put money in your pocket. It might feel right and just but a few weeks of no dough soon chips away at the moral mountain you stand upon.

There is no 'Moral Mountain'.

If you have the skills, personality, contacts and track record that the customer actually needs then it all works out.

What you've been doing for every week of your life is only of concern for piss-pot jobs with piss-pot clients.

If you're good enough, enjoy your 'bench' time (beach time for some).

Maybe you're confusing 'contractor' for 'drudge' or something.

sappatz
1st April 2008, 18:29
you are doomed
you can thank the New lie for destroying your ******* country

ruskithebear
1st April 2008, 19:08
There is no 'Moral Mountain'.

If you have the skills, personality, contacts and track record that the customer actually needs then it all works out.

What you've been doing for every week of your life is only of concern for piss-pot jobs with piss-pot clients.

If you're good enough, enjoy your 'bench' time (beach time for some).

Maybe you're confusing 'contractor' for 'drudge' or something.

I am not confused and I feel we agree

"Too many people have had an easy ride in the good times and think their 'skills' are somehow rare and hard to come by, and that they deserve 'decent rates'."

Agreed, and therefore rolling off a gig and sitting on your backside with the above attitude is not going to pay the bills.

I am all for sitting on the bench/beach if its part of your business/life strategy but sitting on it because of a point of principle is blind naivety.

If people only have medium/low-grade 'IT knowledge' skills then they are in for a big shock in the next decade.

Agreed, that train is coming with bells on.

The money has gone pal. The 3rd world caught up on your skillz.

So take the money now, suck it up and don't self impose yourself to the bench, as there will be plenty of time for watching "cash in the attic"

Likely
1st April 2008, 19:29
You should become a plumber.

unemployed
1st April 2008, 21:20
That's hardly 'rocket science' either.

That's the trouble. Too many people have had an easy ride in the good times and think their 'skills' are somehow rare and hard to come by, and that they deserve 'decent rates'.



I would not say my skills are rare I just refuse to work for crap, so some jumped up glorified telephone operator can cream off the rate.

Low grade in mentioned but i imagine the only people that will always be needed in years to come is support, installation work and project managers.
with most of the development work subbed out to india or some where just as cheap.

For the record I don`t intend to stay in IT, just hanging on as circumstances at the moment allow me to. Also i have renovated my house and sold over the past year so it`s not just laziness.

unemployed
1st April 2008, 21:52
You should become a plumber.

:laugh super mario ?

miffy
1st April 2008, 22:00
You should become a plumber.

I'm still tempted to train up as a plumber. Certainly less grief than IT.

An ex permie manager from many moons ago tried setting up his own franchise. It didn't go to plan though and he lost a big wad of cash. I reckon he was thinking too big, too soon. He said there are too many in the game.

Anyone know any plumbers?

unemployed
1st April 2008, 22:13
I'm still tempted to train up as a plumber. Certainly less grief than IT.

An ex permie manager from many moons ago tried setting up his own franchise. It didn't go to plan though and he lost a big wad of cash. I reckon he was thinking too big, too soon. He said there are too many in the game.

Anyone know any plumbers?

That`s the problem there are too many in every game. Low grade contruction work is all done by poles now.

miffy
1st April 2008, 22:21
That`s the problem there are too many in every game.

Indeed.

An old work colleague emigrated to NZ in 2004 and he's coming back next week (said it's too quiet for him).

I think he's in for a shock when he gets back. Has the credit crunch reached NZ yet?

beaker
1st April 2008, 22:57
:rollin: try being benched for 104 weeks :banana:

Dude are you serious?

unemployed
1st April 2008, 23:01
Dude are you serious?

yep

Bumfluff
1st April 2008, 23:04
Why dont you stretch the truth on your CV, focus more on technical skills rather than you were doing support, should open up more developer roles, no shame in haming it up a bit. I feel lucky lots seem on the bench at the moment, keep your pecker up :wave:

expat
1st April 2008, 23:07
I would not say my skills are rare I just refuse to work for crap, so some jumped up glorified telephone operator can cream off the rate.

Low grade in mentioned but i imagine the only people that will always be needed in years to come is support, installation work and project managers.
with most of the development work subbed out to india or some where just as cheap.
Business analysts, architects, non-junior DBAs.
Those whose job involves telling the boss when he's wrong.
People who need to communicate with company-internal users on serious topics.
People who handle sensitive information.
People that the bosses need to talk to, or even just want to have around to yell at (the boss will not yell at India, he'll yell at you and you'll yell at them).
Those in performance tuning, efficiency, and final testing.
Those whose job depends on really understanding the impact on the business.
Those who need to integrate a wide range of skills in the people around them.

Development as I learned it decades ago is already gone.

unemployed
1st April 2008, 23:10
Why dont you stretch the truth on your CV, focus more on technical skills rather than you were doing support, should open up more developer roles, no shame in haming it up a bit. I feel lucky lots seem on the bench at the moment, keep your pecker up :wave:

My pecker is up as we speak :freaky:

gingerjedi
2nd April 2008, 13:55
This is getting serious, over the last 2 days I have called 4 agents with reference to different contracts advertised only to be told that the particular agent I want to speak to is busy, not one has been courteous enough to even return my call and that’s before they know anything about me?? I get the feeling there are hundreds of people like me ringing the instant something goes live and if you're not one of the first 3 calls you're too late as they already have suitable candidates.

It never used to be like this, it used to be the other way round, my main worry is that this is the norm and things won’t pick up, I could be wasting my time when I should be retraining.

Depressed. :(

unemployed
2nd April 2008, 14:20
This is getting serious, over the last 2 days I have called 4 agents with reference to different contracts advertised only to be told that the particular agent I want to speak to is busy, not one has been courteous enough to even return my call and that’s before they know anything about me?? I get the feeling there are hundreds of people like me ringing the instant something goes live and if you're not one of the first 3 calls you're too late as they already have suitable candidates.

It never used to be like this, it used to be the other way round, my main worry is that this is the norm and things won’t pick up, I could be wasting my time when I should be retraining.

Depressed. :(

It is depressing and it`s only going to get worse.

bogeyman
2nd April 2008, 14:37
It is depressing and it`s only going to get worse.

You are correct.

It's all going tits up boys and girls.

Time to emigrate/retire or put plan-B into effect.

I'll be selling Bogey Towers and bogeying off out of this ruined, smoking hole of a country later this year, I hope.

shelby68
2nd April 2008, 14:38
This is getting serious, over the last 2 days I have called 4 agents with reference to different contracts advertised only to be told that the particular agent I want to speak to is busy, not one has been courteous enough to even return my call and that’s before they know anything about me?? I get the feeling there are hundreds of people like me ringing the instant something goes live and if you're not one of the first 3 calls you're too late as they already have suitable candidates.
(

:rollin::rollin::rollin::rollin::rollin::rollin: Sorry for laughing but using the seeing courteous and agent in the same sentence had me rolling. They are generally ignorant B@stards at the best of times.

oracleslave
2nd April 2008, 14:39
You are correct.

It's all going tits up boys and girls.

Time to emigrate/retire or put plan-B into effect.

I'll be selling Bogey Towers and bogeying off out of this ruined, smoking hole of a country later this year, I hope.

Where you headed?

bogeyman
2nd April 2008, 14:42
Where you headed?

Several options: Southern France (Midi Pyrenees), Northern Spain or Cyprus.

Have various friends and relations who live thereabouts and are clued up on things locally - which should help a lot.

Not So Wise
2nd April 2008, 14:44
This is getting serious, over the last 2 days I have called 4 agents with reference to different contracts advertised
End of financial new year/start of new one is generally always worst time of year for contracts (can be even worse than pre-Xmas/new year),lots of contracts ended early march and few new ones starting until late April/Early May, general market turmoil is only making things worse

Was facing being benched early last month but because client could not get their act into gear am going to be able to advoid it for another 2 months, but if things had turned out the other way around would have just gone somewhere sunny until early June because getting a contract at this time of year is like pulling teeth

AlfredJPruffock
2nd April 2008, 14:44
It is depressing and it`s only going to get worse.


As you think you become ... beware of what you think because you might just get it.


So what to do ?

Fire in the East ? Move to the West
Fire in the West ? Move to the East

Chairman Mao

unemployed
2nd April 2008, 14:49
As you think you become ... beware of what you think because you might just get it.


So what to do ?

Fire in the East ? Move to the West
Fire in the West ? Move to the East

Chairman Mao

I think i deserve a job paying £300ph for filling up printers.

I MUST BELIEVE - I MUST BELIEVE

:rolleyes:

oracleslave
2nd April 2008, 14:51
Several options: Southern France (Midi Pyrenees), Northern Spain or Cyprus.

Have various friends and relations who live thereabouts and are clued up on things locally - which should help a lot.

Does that mean you are cashing in your chips so to speak or do you intend doing any IT related work when you get there?

bogeyman
2nd April 2008, 14:58
Does that mean you are cashing in your chips so to speak or do you intend doing any IT related work when you get there?

Dunno. If I go to Cyprus (least favourite, but ok) I can piddle about doing web stuff for tourism sites for a mate of mine. Meager pickings but probably sufficient - and he's a fun guy.

Probably will buy some holiday properties and live mostly on the rents.

vhadiant
2nd April 2008, 19:12
Development as I learned it decades ago is already gone.

Not all development work is going to cheaper cost centres. Just like 1st line support, 1st line sys admin, your run-on-the-mill development work is at risk. And it should be.

The important thing is keep re-inventing yourself and move to areas that are indespensible to the business.

expat
2nd April 2008, 22:47
Not all development work is going to cheaper cost centres. Just like 1st line support, 1st line sys admin, your run-on-the-mill development work is at risk. And it should be.

The important thing is keep re-inventing yourself and move to areas that are indespensible to the business.The old adage, I discovered later than when I needed to know, is that you should be in the same business as the top boss. That way you'll be indispensible.

Meanwhile, I have indeed kept reinventing myself, quite successfully too. I started over 30 years ago as a mainframe COBOL programmer, went to Assembler, RPG, client-server, C, Windows apps, unix, Oracle, Siebel, and now specialise in Data Migration, especially Siebel.

Ironically I'm not sure that Siebel data migration will get me a job in 10 years, or even 5; but I'm pretty sure that mainframe COBOL will still be around when I retire, and even when I die.

swamp
2nd April 2008, 23:49
I'm amazed anyone manages to contract these days in support.

What do you do exactly? Move a beige box around and switch it on.

jim2406
3rd April 2008, 05:23
i have to say i really dont agree with the 'all development work will be outsourced' sentiment earlier in this thread.

some may be, but there's always going to be a place for highly skilled developers with good soft skills.

a good developer isn't just a code monkey - they might be involved in project management, team leading, business analysis, DBA work, performance tuning, config management, training..

many developers i've met (1) aren't passionate about what they do, (2) are barely able to hold a conversation, (3) don't understand the needs of the business. i think if you've got these covered you're always going to be able to find work.

Ivor Bigun
3rd April 2008, 08:34
i have to say i really dont agree with the 'all development work will be outsourced' sentiment earlier in this thread.

some may be, but there's always going to be a place for highly skilled developers with good soft skills.

a good developer isn't just a code monkey - they might be involved in project management, team leading, business analysis, DBA work, performance tuning, config management, training..

many developers i've met (1) aren't passionate about what they do, (2) are barely able to hold a conversation, (3) don't understand the needs of the business. i think if you've got these covered you're always going to be able to find work.

Jim, I think you're got to consider that the game has changed forever. There is less call for end customer developpers. it is a dying trade.
If you need a parrallel, then look at HTML coders.

Nowadays, there is more "out of the box" software catering for the consumer's needs and the commercial pressure to remove the expensive parts out of IT is immense.
Software suppliers and outsourcing companies are actively trying to maximise profit by driving expensive elements out of IT - That IT is you!
"Dooer" employee skill will be reduced by "leveraging" and de-skilling which lessen the need for what you describe.
Also, headcount may increase because of the opportunity to use cheaper labour but even that may not continue.

It ain't rocket science - you are doomed!

AlfredJPruffock
3rd April 2008, 14:38
Jim, I think you're got to consider that the game has changed forever. There is less call for end customer developpers. it is a dying trade.
If you need a parrallel, then look at HTML coders.

Nowadays, there is more "out of the box" software catering for the consumer's needs and the commercial pressure to remove the expensive parts out of IT is immense.
Software suppliers and outsourcing companies are actively trying to maximise profit by driving expensive elements out of IT - That IT is you!
"Dooer" employee skill will be reduced by "leveraging" and de-skilling which lessen the need for what you describe.
Also, headcount may increase because of the opportunity to use cheaper labour but even that may not continue.

It ain't rocket science - you are doomed!

Ah nostalgia ..whatever happened to HTML coders ... knowledge management , ecommerce and dot net ?

Evaporate ...

gingerjedi
3rd April 2008, 16:56
From today I've noticed a few government install/upgrade project jobs trickle onto the market for a late April start, a few agents even took my calls and sounded interested which hasn't happened much in the last few weeks, maybe the purse strings are loosening at last?

[fingers crossed mode]

Chin up people.:D

shoes
3rd April 2008, 17:53
Nowadays, there is more "out of the box" software catering for the consumer's needs

The customers' needs change. Short term project will crop up every now and again, one driver for this over the last few years has been changing legislation for example. If you've got a short term project and you don't want it screwed up you don't outsource, you get some contractors in.

Of course longer term anyones particular skillset is going to be gone. Can anyone make a living now at what their retired parents did? or their grandparents? In IT the change is faster but it is economy wide. It's not as doom and gloom as 'change or die', it is normal ; 'Change when you need to, you probably won't notice you're doing it.'

If you're smart you'll do ok. A half decent IQ is what makes you a valuable commodity, not x years experience in y technology. If you need to change outside of IT then do it. Who wants to sit in front of a monitor all day anyway.