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Mich the Tester
4th June 2009, 09:27
Under this newfangled bonus for scrapping your car scheme (http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/transport/article6429231.ece) that's being rolled out all over Europe, people wil get bonusses if they scrap their ten year old cars and buy a new one.

All very well, but it isn't really having much effect, perhaps because ten year old cars are often just not really ready for the scrapheap. Here's a ten year old car. (http://www.autotrack.nl/owa_dima/owa/att_occ_detail.detail?p_spr_id=179974163&p_type_lijst=RL&o_id=5905973) Isn't it a bit disingenuous to claim that this is good for the environment? Perhaps people don't want to scrap their ten year old cars because they're actually quite happy with them?

DimPrawn
4th June 2009, 09:29
Evidently the take of the scheme in the UK has been so good, the funds will run out in a few months.

It's the stupidity of the British public.

Mich the Tester
4th June 2009, 09:34
Evidently the take of the scheme in the UK has been so good, the funds will run out in a few months.

It's the stupidity of the British public.Stupidity indeed. Wasteful too. I could find countless examples like the BMW above of perfectly useful and in fact very nice cars that are ten years old; it seems this scheme is designed to make consumers even more wasteful than they were during the mad years of the credit boom.

Moscow Mule
4th June 2009, 09:35
It's the stupidity of the British public.

I don't think getting 2-4k off a new car for this 10 year old car I found on Autotrader is that stupid...

1998 DAEWOO LANOS 1.6 SX 5dr Hatchback
Price: £220 ono
Features:
100,000 milesManualSilverPetrolHatchback1598 cc
Full Description:
Glossary of Terms
5 Door Hatchback, Silver, Petrol, Manual. £220 ono.

Troll
4th June 2009, 09:36
Under this newfangled bonus for scrapping your car scheme (http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/transport/article6429231.ece) that's being rolled out all over Europe, people wil get bonusses if they scrap their ten year old cars and buy a new one.

All very well, but it isn't really having much effect, perhaps because ten year old cars are often just not really ready for the scrapheap. Here's a ten year old car. (http://www.autotrack.nl/owa_dima/owa/att_occ_detail.detail?p_spr_id=179974163&p_type_lijst=RL&o_id=5905973) Isn't it a bit disingenuous to claim that this is good for the environment? Perhaps people don't want to scrap their ten year old cars because they're actually quite happy with them?Yer can't beat a 12 year old 4x4

Mich the Tester
4th June 2009, 09:38
I don't think getting 2-4k off a new car for this 10 year old car I found on Autotrader is that stupid...

1998 DAEWOO LANOS 1.6 SX 5dr Hatchback
Price: £220 ono
Features:
100,000 milesManualSilverPetrolHatchback1598 cc
Full Description:
Glossary of Terms
5 Door Hatchback, Silver, Petrol, Manual. £220 ono.Not in that case, no, but are most ten year old cars plenty cheapness daewoos are are most of them actually quite nice cars?

The Lone Gunman
4th June 2009, 09:40
It's another backhanded handout to the lower classes.
People who would always be a couple of grand short of a new car can now trade in the car they can afford and buy a brand new shiney one.

It will provide a spike in new car sales but will kill the second hand market for years to come.

MrMark
4th June 2009, 09:40
I think the point of this scheme has been to get car workers back working on the production line (and it's worked locally - both BMW in Cowley and Honda in Swindon have restarted their production lines). Forget any crap about the environment

Cyberman
4th June 2009, 09:43
My car is 10 years old but worth far more than 2K so the deal does nothing for me. :frown

DimPrawn
4th June 2009, 09:44
I think the point of this scheme has been to get car workers back working on the production line (and it's worked locally - both BMW in Cowley and Honda in Swindon have restarted their production lines). Forget any crap about the environment

The majority of the trade-ins has keen at the really low end of the market.

This is just a way of sending uK taxpayers money to prop-up Korean car manufacturers such as Kia, Hyundai, Perodua, SsangYong and the like.

Mich the Tester
4th June 2009, 09:44
I think the point of this scheme has been to get car workers back working on the production line (and it's worked locally - both BMW in Cowley and Honda in Swindon have restarted their production lines). Forget any crap about the environmentThe way to get car workers back to the production lines is really quite simple; car manufacturers need to tool up to make stuff people want to buy. FIAT are still doing OK in Europe with the 500 and the Alfa Mito; they’re small and efficient and appeal to women (especially Mrs Tester). GM died because they made too many cars in the US that nobody wanted and in Europe they made too many bland cars that couldn’t bring in a good margin. Again we come back to the most basic principle of business; find out and keep monitoring what people want to buy, and sell it to them.

MrMark
4th June 2009, 10:01
The way to get car workers back to the production lines is really quite simple; car manufacturers need to tool up to make stuff people want to buy. FIAT are still doing OK in Europe with the 500 and the Alfa Mito; they’re small and efficient and appeal to women (especially Mrs Tester). GM died because they made too many cars in the US that nobody wanted and in Europe they made too many bland cars that couldn’t bring in a good margin. Again we come back to the most basic principle of business; find out and keep monitoring what people want to buy, and sell it to them.

I think you'll find that both Honda and BMW (with the mini) were selling stuff people wanted to buy prior to the crash.

DaveB
4th June 2009, 10:11
I don't think getting 2-4k off a new car for this 10 year old car I found on Autotrader is that stupid...

1998 DAEWOO LANOS 1.6 SX 5dr Hatchback
Price: £220 ono
Features:
100,000 milesManualSilverPetrolHatchback1598 cc
Full Description:
Glossary of Terms
5 Door Hatchback, Silver, Petrol, Manual. £220 ono.

The catch is that you have to have owned the car for at least 12 months, ie your name on the log book, before you trade it in. It also has to have a currrent MoT.

sasguru
4th June 2009, 10:17
The way to get car workers back to the production lines is really quite simple; car manufacturers need to tool up to make stuff people want to buy. FIAT are still doing OK in Europe with the 500 and the Alfa Mito; they’re small and efficient and appeal to women (especially Mrs Tester). GM died because they made too many cars in the US that nobody wanted and in Europe they made too many bland cars that couldn’t bring in a good margin. Again we come back to the most basic principle of business; find out and keep monitoring what people want to buy, and sell it to them.


Bollux. There's huge overcapacity in the car industry. The large firms were struggling even in the good times (e.g. Ford which makes good cars).
So some car companies MUST go bust for a healthy industry.

Moscow Mule
4th June 2009, 10:21
The catch is that you have to have owned the car for at least 12 months, ie your name on the log book, before you trade it in. It also has to have a currrent MoT.

I realise that, but if I owned a 10 year old Daewoo and fancied a new one, I'd be a mug to not use the scheme.

Brussels Slumdog
4th June 2009, 10:25
The family car is ok Its me thats on the scrap heap due to out sourcing.

TimberWolf
4th June 2009, 10:30
We could do with more reusable cars. Engines for example should be based on an extensible engine pattern that inherits from a simple abstract base engine. That way we could keep an old car and just change the engine. Ditto for the other car parts and functions. We could design cars better and faster which would be more reliable and maintainable. In theory.

NickNick
4th June 2009, 10:34
The majority of the trade-ins has keen at the really low end of the market.

This is just a way of sending uK taxpayers money to prop-up Korean car manufacturers such as Kia, Hyundai, Perodua, SsangYong and the like.

Not sure how you got to that. Apart from the fact that Ssang Yong is Chinese and Perodua is Malay, aren't people more likely to trade in these older cheaper cars? The in laws have just traded in a Daewoo for a new Citroen

gingerjedi
4th June 2009, 11:40
We could do with more reusable cars. Engines for example should be based on an extensible engine pattern that inherits from a simple abstract base engine. That way we could keep an old car and just change the engine. Ditto for the other car parts and functions. We could design cars better and faster which would be more reliable and maintainable. In theory.

Wasn't the Morris Minor one of the few cars that was designed to be repaired? Still see a few about today.

Quite a few products could benefit from a modular design but it goes against the principle of consumerism, everything in modern life is pitched in such a way that the average person needs to keep working in order to keep the economy going, we can’t have people stepping out of line and retiring early can we.:spank:

DimPrawn
4th June 2009, 11:53
Quite a few products could benefit from a modular design but it goes against the principle of consumerism, everything in modern life is pitched in such a way that the average person needs to keep working in order to keep the economy going, we can’t have people stepping out of line and retiring early can we.:spank:


Life's about film stars and less about mothers
It's all about fast cars and cussing each other
But it doesn't matter cause I'm packing plastic
And that's what makes my life so ******* fantastic

And I am a weapon of massive consumption
And it's not my fault it's how I'm programmed to function
I'll look at The Sun and I'll look in The Mirror
I'm on the right track yeah we're onto a winner

expat
4th June 2009, 12:17
Wasn't the Morris Minor one of the few cars that was designed to be repaired? Still see a few about today.

Quite a few products could benefit from a modular design but it goes against the principle of consumerism, everything in modern life is pitched in such a way that the average person needs to keep working in order to keep the economy going, we can’t have people stepping out of line and retiring early can we.:spank:I'd guess that you see Minors around still because so many of them were made. But it's a good point. The Citroen 2CV was also made to be repaired, by a ham-fisted French farmer with a limited set of tools. The trouble is, it is higher-tech that has given us today's cars with longer life and lower fuel consumption.

But cars should not need to be replaced often, just for image. The Model T Ford didn't come with built-in obsolescence: a 1909 Model T was pretty much the same as a 1910 Model T, and a 1911 Model T wasn't much changed either (except that it had front doors). It was General Motors that invented the "model year" to persuade people to keep replacing their cars.

bye GM :wave:


As for consumerism, supporting the economy, and (especially) early retirement/withdrawal from the workforce, I agree too. Right now a big recession and bench time must be impacting on a lot of our plans.....