Agency problems trying to recover alleged overpaymets on approved timesheets.

[lone ranger]

Hello all,

I am new to this site and am in need of some advice/sense checking of a situation i find myself in.

At the time: 2012
I was a LTD company contractor who was working for a client in a role via a recruitment agency. I worked there full time for 14 months in which time i worked an average of 45 hours a week, sometimes more when i was working aborad for them etc, timesheets were submitted accordingly, approved by the client and and then paid on time via invoicing sent to the agency etc.

In March 2013 i was taken to one side and told i was guilty of overbooking my hours. The number they cam up wasa in the region of 120 hours over a 14 month timescale (my rate wsas £60/hr) this was a false claim and i was furious at the allegation, (the company had an appaling accounts department and almost shambolic expenses/payroll departmet but as i didnt have much to do with them i never really let it bother me).

However i had nothing to "prove" that the hours i had booked were legitimate other than my word I found myself in a corner with no where to turn, anyway after a few days i was working when i was told to collect my things and leave the building immediatly and was escorted out. Within the hour i had recieved an email from the recruitmant agency stating that my contract had been ended immediatley as a result of gross neglegence. And that was the last i heard from them, they failed to pay me my last two weeks invoices and expenses for 3 trips to vendor works i undertook. So thats the back story in a nut shell, needless to say i was shell shocked and totally stunned by the treatment.
Since then i spent approx 10 months out of work unable to get a new role, i had some interveiws but a few of them mentioned my alleged overbooking (my industry is very small and close knit so many managers know each other personally) and i firmly beleived that this cost me those roles, but thats a side isssue.
Anyway, as i was out of work and pocket for so long i had to close down my LTD company.
Recently the recruitment agency in question got in contact with me stating that the original client is trying to persue me for the alleged over booking and to go into the clients office to discuss informally (which i refused as i refute the clain there was an overbooking in the firat place) BUT between then and now the number has grown from about 120 hours (at £60/hr = £7200) which was the figure used when i was removed from my position to a number in the region of £50000 if i break that down with my hourly rate at the time (£50000/£60 = 834 hours) which is almost 20 weeks. How they have arrived at that number i have no idea, i have had nothing in writing just a rather fractious phone call from the agent who was unable or unwilling to listen to my side and a rather informal email again from the agent requesting the details of a solicitor as i said to them that i dont want to speak to them on the phone and i want everything in writing so i can build a possible defence.

Has anyone else had this kind of thing happen to them? Is the agency being serious or is this some kind of bully boy tactic to get money out of me? I am totally at the end of my tether with this and am seriously woried to the point that my health is now being affected.

Can someone please help me out and give me their veiws?
Any feedback woudl be greatly appreciated.

Ranger.

[Clare@InTouch]

Is your company now struck off? If so they have no one to pursue for the supposed debt, as it would be the company that was liable (they could get a company reinstated if there was fraud involved, but they would have to prove that was the case).

That said, I'd suggest legal advice would be your first port of call. Don't engage in any communication with them at all, other than to say "I'm taking legal advice".

[SueEllen]

You seriously saying as a limited company director you kept no copies of your invoices, time sheets, expenses and mileage lots whether held electronically or on paper? If you haven't then you are negligent.

Regardless for the company to have a case against you they need to take you to court and provide evidence long before it goes before a judge.

Depending on what the contract said the liability stops with the company unless you were stupid and you agreed to take on personal liability. If the company doesn't exist then there is no-one to chase for the money.

If however you agreed to personal liability regardless of whether you have assets or not I would bluff it and act like you have evidence to dispute their claims.

Tell the agency if they phone you up to put their concerns in writing. I would also make a log of their calls with the time, date and who you spoke to. I would keep this and after a couple of nasty calls from the ask write them a polite email listing what they have said and ask them to provide their evidence.

[VectraMan]

What Claire said.

Also:

I was a LTD company contractor who was working for a client in a role via a recruitment agency. I worked there full time for 14 months in which time i worked an average of 45 hours a week, sometimes more when i was working aborad for them etc, timesheets were submitted accordingly, approved by the client and and then paid on time via invoicing sent to the agency etc.

Do you still have that proof?

I'd bet the client still owes money to the agent and is using this to try to get out of it. Personally I'd be inclined to just laugh at them.

[Scruff]

You seriously saying as a limited company director you kept no copies of your invoices, time sheets, expenses and mileage lots whether held electronically or on paper? If you haven't then you are negligent.

Regardless for the company to have a case against you they need to take you to court and provide evidence long before it goes before a judge.

Depending on what the contract said the liability stops with the company unless you were stupid and you agreed to take on personal liability. If the company doesn't exist then there is no-one to chase for the money.

If however you agreed to personal liability regardless of whether you have assets or not I would bluff it and act like you have evidence to dispute their claims.

Tell the agency if they phone you up to put their concerns in writing. I would also make a log of their calls with the time, date and who you spoke to. I would keep this and after a couple of nasty calls from the ask write them a polite email listing what they have said and ask them to provide their evidence.

What Sue-Ellen said.

Best learn the correct use of grammar, as well as how to write, spell and punctuate before proceeding with any written communication is my suggestion?

[lone ranger]

Thanks for the responses guys.

With regards to use of the word "Proof" I apologise, I wasnt very clear.

I have copies of all the approved timesheets submitted to my agent along with the associated invoices and a record of all payments and in and out of the buisness account including all expenses submissions and payments. But despite me having this evidence this didnt stop them accusing me in the first place so this is where I feel it's a case of my word against theirs.

But if the consensus is that as the LTD company HAS been struck off then there is no one to persue. Also, there is no persoanal liability issue.

I will keep a log of all attempted communication and not engage them directly.

Once again many thanks.

[craig1]

Can I suggest an alternative approach? Go get yourself an hour or two of a small business/self-employed specialist lawyer's time and ask them specific questions about these subjects:

- how protected you are by limited liability now the company is struck off. He'll need to see your contract and any letters or emails that have gone between you and the agency on the subject as you may have strayed into personal liability somewhere accidentally, or even had it sneakily added by the agency and you've signed or agreed without noticing.
- is there a way you can go on the offensive by sending them a solicitor's cease and desist letter on behalf of a private individual being harrassed over a now defunct company issue? While he's at it, get him to demand that they cease and desist defaming you to anyone as this is directly impeding your career and income.

It'll probably cost you £250 or so but will probably be worth every penny.

Don't sit back and let them drive it as you'll be persistently on the back foot, responding to them. Attack is the best defence.

Also, don't ignore it, it'll probably not go away now that they're still going on about it and seem to want to escalate. That said, don't discuss, verbally or in writing, the debt they say you have at all beyond very, very bland "Your contract was with a now defunct company, I have no debt to you". Certainly do not show any sign of compromise in admitting any liability, debt or that you even have anything to do with your old company's responsibilities or you get into some very iffy territory around contract law and third parties.

[lone ranger]

Ok, many thanks Craig. I will take that onboard.

Regards.

[Platypus]

Great advice from craig.

IIRC it's a criminal offence to accuse someone of a criminal offence such as fraud.

get legal on them.

[tarbera]

Can you think of no reason why client would claim this.?

example.

Access pass showed you were on site for 30 hours and claimed for 45 ?

or System logon times shown the same.?

What is the basis for there claims.? did you work from home.?