Labour tax manifesto

[BrilloPad]

Given the links between the Labour Party and Unions at the time, there's some truth in that.

There are still plenty of links between Labour and unions.

I get fed up hearing that it was all the unions fault. Sure they played a part - but plenty of mismanagement too.

[meridian]

Given the links between the Labour Party and Unions at the time, there's some truth in that.

Depending on your point of view, the miners going on strike was a form of extreme capitalism.

How often do we hear on these boards, if you don’t like your contract or your rate then just walk away.

They didn’t like their rate, they withheld their labour.

[malvolio]

Heath was an idiot on several levels, but his government was reacting - very badly - to a set of circumstances brought about by Wilson and Callaghan around the UK economy and the oil crisis brought about by the Arab nations realising their power over the West.

The miners strike was not about wages and conditions, but was a concerted attempt to bring down the sitting government. Thatcher's reforms came on the back of that strike, meaning that secondary picketing was illegal, strikes could not be called by half a dozen union convenors but needed majority agreement and several other lesser measures.

The Labour manifesto is saying they will reverse all those conditions: perhaps you should read it and try to understand what they are actually saying about union involvement in day-to-day management.

[BR14]

There are still plenty of links between Labour and unicorns.

.

ftfy

[Mordac]

Which of course is all the fault of Labour. Anything bad is Labour's fault.

I didn't actually say that. I'm not sure I even hinted at it.

As OG would say, "are you triggered?"...

[BrilloPad]

I didn't actually say that. I'm not sure I even hinted at it.

As OG would say, "are you triggered?"...

If I am, it is Labour's fault.....

[rogerfederer]

Neither do you. Know what I'm talking about, that is. I didn't say I support Labour. I just welcomed their introducing the general concept of increasing overall tax in order to fund state services. Because of ingrained prejudice like yours, it will take a long time for the populace to get on board. But it has to happen. You can rant on about all the inefficiencies of Health, Education, Infrastructure etc but those are inevitable. Stop whining. If you are in a pub and you want another round it's no use complaining about the prices. Get your wallet out or go thirsty.

I have to second Cirrus in this case.

The frightening thing for me, who is registered in multiple countries but currently fully resident in Scotland, is that to a past foreigner it is obvious that the Tories are lying.

The strange campaign tactics of emulating FactCheckUK on twitter and publishing blatant lies is very weird - are you fooled by this Malvolio or any die-hard Boris' Tories?

Publishing the notion of promised new hospitals but them clearly being amalgamations and renovations is dangerous, because it tries to usher in a new world where politicians can blatantly lie - and Boris Johnson is used to that - and get away with it. What would the current Tories (who are clearly a different ilk compared to past ones) have to do to lose your vote?

As per Cirrus I'm not saying vote Labour, but given climate change and other policies it's perfectly acceptable to vote for a party that at least suggests tackling this - if you have children then I'm guessing that you're on side with 99.99% of scientists who have shown it's clearly occurring due to man made emissions and industrialisation; I see scant suggestions from the Tories but at least Labour, the Greens and LibDem are trying to propose some ideas and changes on this front.

The Tories are same-old, same-old and seem to like to keep things the way they are now. On certain fronts this is sensible for continued business and the economy, but when it comes to such major developments - such as climate change - I'd prefer the UK went to the front of developing incredible alternatives, even better than the current offering. There seems to be an incentive with the Tories to just go with the flow and see what happens. Theirs is the least progressive and least radical UK manifesto I've seen in a few decades. It provides for a flatlining of business sentiment when you concede that things will be ok for another decade before the tulip hits the fan and the public realise we need radical change of the way in which business works in order to progress as a nation.

As an example, we have no penalty for having a 'bad' consumer lifestyle; cheap clothes are often the most polluting due to the way they are manufactured and they encourage waste. If we aim for a responsible capitalism rebrand then we could address clear stupidities and progress. I see zero ideas from the Tories for such change. I would suggest that being a bad consumer and buying short-lived tulip is actually promoted to youngsters, perhaps because they're the least wealthy generation we've seen in many decades.

In the UK (and other countries, I don't deny) there is zero incentive to buy long-term or buy responsibly because the free market price favours cheaply made tat, favours plastic everywhere and favours satisfying whatever consumer demand is in fashion in a given month. The most ecological choice be the cheapest choice; polluting should be penalised.

When an old woman goes shopping she isn't buying a plastic bag because she disbelieves climate change and wants to fund fossil fuel companies; she just wants to take her shopping home and be done with it. Consumer sentiment is lead by whatever is offered, not vice versa. We can accommodate for the public with obvious and sensible legislation and policy changes but I see absolute zero from the Tories regarding this. Given it's 2019 this is insane.

It would make more sense to accept this model is broken - but the Tories cant do that, because then their ideology crumbles. The problem is: with climate change we can't realistically just accept the negative changes due to our love of 'free markets'. No markets are free anyway, all are regulated, so it's an ideological myth but one that chimes with some voters as they believe all the hype.

Finally: there are no far left or far right parties in the England right now, just left, right. People are just so used to Blair and May that they think the Labour plans are 'far left'. I've been to far left countries, for my sins, and the current stuff here isn't extreme at either end.

[minestrone]

I have to second Cirrus in this case.

The frightening thing for me, who is registered in multiple countries but currently fully resident in Scotland, is that to a past foreigner it is obvious that the Tories are lying.

The strange campaign tactics of emulating FactCheckUK on twitter and publishing blatant lies is very weird - are you fooled by this Malvolio or any die-hard Boris' Tories?

Publishing the notion of promised new hospitals but them clearly being amalgamations and renovations is dangerous, because it tries to usher in a new world where politicians can blatantly lie - and Boris Johnson is used to that - and get away with it. What would the current Tories (who are clearly a different ilk compared to past ones) have to do to lose your vote?

As per Cirrus I'm not saying vote Labour, but given climate change and other policies it's perfectly acceptable to vote for a party that at least suggests tackling this - if you have children then I'm guessing that you're on side with 99.99% of scientists who have shown it's clearly occurring due to man made emissions and industrialisation; I see scant suggestions from the Tories but at least Labour, the Greens and LibDem are trying to propose some ideas and changes on this front.

The Tories are same-old, same-old and seem to like to keep things the way they are now. On certain fronts this is sensible for continued business and the economy, but when it comes to such major developments - such as climate change - I'd prefer the UK went to the front of developing incredible alternatives, even better than the current offering. There seems to be an incentive with the Tories to just go with the flow and see what happens. Theirs is the least progressive and least radical UK manifesto I've seen in a few decades. It provides for a flatlining of business sentiment when you concede that things will be ok for another decade before the tulip hits the fan and the public realise we need radical change of the way in which business works in order to progress as a nation.

As an example, we have no penalty for having a 'bad' consumer lifestyle; cheap clothes are often the most polluting due to the way they are manufactured and they encourage waste. If we aim for a responsible capitalism rebrand then we could address clear stupidities and progress. I see zero ideas from the Tories for such change. I would suggest that being a bad consumer and buying short-lived tulip is actually promoted to youngsters, perhaps because they're the least wealthy generation we've seen in many decades.

In the UK (and other countries, I don't deny) there is zero incentive to buy long-term or buy responsibly because the free market price favours cheaply made tat, favours plastic everywhere and favours satisfying whatever consumer demand is in fashion in a given month. The most ecological choice be the cheapest choice; polluting should be penalised.

When an old woman goes shopping she isn't buying a plastic bag because she disbelieves climate change and wants to fund fossil fuel companies; she just wants to take her shopping home and be done with it. Consumer sentiment is lead by whatever is offered, not vice versa. We can accommodate for the public with obvious and sensible legislation and policy changes but I see absolute zero from the Tories regarding this. Given it's 2019 this is insane.

It would make more sense to accept this model is broken - but the Tories cant do that, because then their ideology crumbles. The problem is: with climate change we can't realistically just accept the negative changes due to our love of 'free markets'. No markets are free anyway, all are regulated, so it's an ideological myth but one that chimes with some voters as they believe all the hype.

Finally: there are no far left or far right parties in the England right now, just left, right. People are just so used to Blair and May that they think the Labour plans are 'far left'. I've been to far left countries, for my sins, and the current stuff here isn't extreme at either end.

[minestrone]

"the great minestrone"

[WTFH]

Heath was an idiot on several levels, but his government was reacting - very badly - to a set of circumstances brought about by Wilson and Callaghan around the UK economy and the oil crisis brought about by the Arab nations realising their power over the West.

Ah yes, the Tory government problems were all caused by Labour